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Topic: Wicked Jack LEWIS and others in Ide (Read 872 times)
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Arranroots
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Any help, however small to locate Jack LEWIS, possibly a cabinet maker, father of a son Augustine (born 26 JUL 1880).
Augustine's mother was nee HOOKINGS, no marriage located. There was also a daughter Fanny and the children were brought up by the JOINT/ SIM families in Ide, Devon.
The parents disappear - in fact I have not located them on censuses.
Apart form a birth reference for Augustine I have little to go on .
How accessible are Devon records - this is all new territory for me??
If you recognise these details or can point me in the right direction you will make my friend very happy - he would like to know what happened to his grandfather WICKED JACK!!
kind regards, Arranroots 
Edit: altered birth date, finger trouble!
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« Last Edit: Sunday 06 November 05 17:15 GMT (UK) by Arranroots »
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Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ SOM: BIRD, BURT aka BROWN HEF: BAUGH, LATHAM, CARTER, PRITCHARD GLS: WEBB, WORKMAN, LATHAM, MALPUS WIL: WEBB, SALTER RAD: PRITCHARD, WILLIAMS GLA: RYAN, KEARNEY, JONES, HARRY MON: WEBB, MORGAN, WILLIAMS, JONES, BIRD SCOTLAND: HASTINGS, CAMERON, KELSO, BUCHANAN, BETHUNE/ BEATON IRELAND: RYAN (WATERFORD), KEARNEY (DUBLIN), BOYLE(DUNDALK) |
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gennig
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Hi Arranroots
You say the mothers maiden name was HOOKINGS but you don't give the first name, do you know it?
The 1891 & 1901 census give Augustine's birth as 1881 in Exmouth and Fanny's surname as Phillips.
Cheers
Genni
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******************************************* All census look up transcriptions are Crown copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk******************************************* Surnames: Armstrong, Gray, Greco, Lambden, Le Busque, Beaton, Carron, Pitt, Gould Areas: Victoria, Tasmania, Hampshire, Berkshire, Yorkshire, Fermanagh, Glamorgan |
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Arranroots
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Hi Genni - thanks for your reply!
I have seen the census returns and have my suspicions that Fanny is the sister (although we thought she would be younger & have the same surname!)
Unfortunately I don't have a clear idea of the mother's name: Ann or Margaret have been suggested, but please don't let that put you off if you find a better alternative! I think I am going to have to buy a certificate - but don't want to spend ALL my friend's pension at once! 
I wondered whether records might be online, but having had a look at Genuki for Devon the records for Ide are too early to be helpful - and I don't know where else to look!
kind regards, Arranroots
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Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ SOM: BIRD, BURT aka BROWN HEF: BAUGH, LATHAM, CARTER, PRITCHARD GLS: WEBB, WORKMAN, LATHAM, MALPUS WIL: WEBB, SALTER RAD: PRITCHARD, WILLIAMS GLA: RYAN, KEARNEY, JONES, HARRY MON: WEBB, MORGAN, WILLIAMS, JONES, BIRD SCOTLAND: HASTINGS, CAMERON, KELSO, BUCHANAN, BETHUNE/ BEATON IRELAND: RYAN (WATERFORD), KEARNEY (DUBLIN), BOYLE(DUNDALK) |
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MaryA
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St Chads, Kirkby
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This is probably totally off the wall but I'm putting names together - forget the name "Jack" since it's often a nickname - and "Rose" seems to be common in your Hookings.
June qtr 1880 Plymouth 5b 400 - the names are
Letitia Chatfield
Henry Mountjoy
Ernest Lewis
Emma Rose Phillips
Mary
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Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukLunt (Wavertree/West Derby), Forshaw (West Derby), Richardson (Knowsley), Kent (Cheshire), Cain (Hertfordshire, London), Larkins (Bedfordshire, London), Nunn (London), Lenton, Hillyard (Bedfordshire), Parle, Lambert, Furlong, Wafer (Wexford) Special separate interest in Longford (Blackrock, Dublin) |
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gennig
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Arranroots
I note that an Augustus LEWIS aged 8mths is a patient in the Devon & Exeter Hopital in the 1881 census.
The following couple are living in Exeter - do you think they might be a possiblity
RG11/2145 Folio: 54 Page: 27
47 Regent St, St Thomas the Apostle, Exeter Devon
John LEWIS Head 33 Whitestone Devon Carpenter
Clara R LEWIS wife 35 St Martin's Middlesex
Cheers
Genni
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******************************************* All census look up transcriptions are Crown copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk******************************************* Surnames: Armstrong, Gray, Greco, Lambden, Le Busque, Beaton, Carron, Pitt, Gould Areas: Victoria, Tasmania, Hampshire, Berkshire, Yorkshire, Fermanagh, Glamorgan |
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Arranroots
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Ooh I am all excited now!
The Augustus LEWIS in hospital look very likely - since I have an exact date of birth I know that he should be 8 months old. There is no mother in the hospital with him, but I guess she wouldn't have been at that time? I wondered if she had died.
The John LEWIS also seems to be a possibility, since the carpenter bit fits. I am trying to ignore the Clara bit, since I said myself that her first name could be anything. I feel the need of that certificate!
Mary: the marriage is certainly possible. I had assumed that Jack was a nickname for John, but the PHILLIPS bit is persuasive. I wonder if we can find these couples on censuses? Will have a look, although you will probable be there before me!
I want to thank you both for your efforts - you are reassuring me on some points and drawing my attention to bits I had overlooked - just the spirit of Rootchat. Have a hug from me!!
A
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Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ SOM: BIRD, BURT aka BROWN HEF: BAUGH, LATHAM, CARTER, PRITCHARD GLS: WEBB, WORKMAN, LATHAM, MALPUS WIL: WEBB, SALTER RAD: PRITCHARD, WILLIAMS GLA: RYAN, KEARNEY, JONES, HARRY MON: WEBB, MORGAN, WILLIAMS, JONES, BIRD SCOTLAND: HASTINGS, CAMERON, KELSO, BUCHANAN, BETHUNE/ BEATON IRELAND: RYAN (WATERFORD), KEARNEY (DUBLIN), BOYLE(DUNDALK) |
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Arranroots
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Mary - have found Ernest in 1881, married to Letitia! 
Never mind!
A
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Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ SOM: BIRD, BURT aka BROWN HEF: BAUGH, LATHAM, CARTER, PRITCHARD GLS: WEBB, WORKMAN, LATHAM, MALPUS WIL: WEBB, SALTER RAD: PRITCHARD, WILLIAMS GLA: RYAN, KEARNEY, JONES, HARRY MON: WEBB, MORGAN, WILLIAMS, JONES, BIRD SCOTLAND: HASTINGS, CAMERON, KELSO, BUCHANAN, BETHUNE/ BEATON IRELAND: RYAN (WATERFORD), KEARNEY (DUBLIN), BOYLE(DUNDALK) |
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Arranroots
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Another thought: we don't KNOW that Miss HOOKINGS married Mr LEWIS. 
She wasn't married to the father of her first child, Hermon HOOKINGS (as family legend has it anyway). I wonder if she had Fanny and Austine by different men - but would she have been able to give them the father's name in that case?
My head is spinning again!
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Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ SOM: BIRD, BURT aka BROWN HEF: BAUGH, LATHAM, CARTER, PRITCHARD GLS: WEBB, WORKMAN, LATHAM, MALPUS WIL: WEBB, SALTER RAD: PRITCHARD, WILLIAMS GLA: RYAN, KEARNEY, JONES, HARRY MON: WEBB, MORGAN, WILLIAMS, JONES, BIRD SCOTLAND: HASTINGS, CAMERON, KELSO, BUCHANAN, BETHUNE/ BEATON IRELAND: RYAN (WATERFORD), KEARNEY (DUBLIN), BOYLE(DUNDALK) |
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gennig
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Arranroots
Found the following:-
Clara Rebecca LEWIS died Aged 39 Sept QTR 1884
Vol 5b Page 49 St Thomas
John LEWIS married Clara Rebecca CHAMBERS
June QTR 1874 5b 137 St Thomas
I know HOOKINGS doesn't come into it, but you never know.
The Joint family may have taken Fanny & Augustine (they may not be related in the true sense) in, Sarah was John JOINT'S second wife and her first husband had the Surname HORE but what was her maiden name.
John LEWIS remarried and was still living in St Thomas area in 1891 with wife and Step children.
Genni
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******************************************* All census look up transcriptions are Crown copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk******************************************* Surnames: Armstrong, Gray, Greco, Lambden, Le Busque, Beaton, Carron, Pitt, Gould Areas: Victoria, Tasmania, Hampshire, Berkshire, Yorkshire, Fermanagh, Glamorgan |
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Arranroots
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Good question (Sarah's maiden name) - don't know!
Fanny (poss this Fanny PHILLIPS) married Edward HORE, son of their neighbours in the census presumably. Augustine married Daisy, whose mother's maiden name was HORE.
And their mother was a ---- an elusive woman!!
Are you thinking that Sarah could be the mother? Wouldn't it say step-child in that case? And another thing that bothers me is that Fanny is with the family in 1881, when Augustus LEWIS is found in hospital. Would she not be with her mother if she were still alive? Who knows.
I remember tracing one of Geoff's rellies who turned out to be in service and parked her children with family because she lived-in. I can't help feeling there must be a family relationship between the JOINTS, the SIMS (the wife was nee JOINT) and the children.
I am going to ring Augustine's son - he isn't checking his e-mails! Back soon.
A
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Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ SOM: BIRD, BURT aka BROWN HEF: BAUGH, LATHAM, CARTER, PRITCHARD GLS: WEBB, WORKMAN, LATHAM, MALPUS WIL: WEBB, SALTER RAD: PRITCHARD, WILLIAMS GLA: RYAN, KEARNEY, JONES, HARRY MON: WEBB, MORGAN, WILLIAMS, JONES, BIRD SCOTLAND: HASTINGS, CAMERON, KELSO, BUCHANAN, BETHUNE/ BEATON IRELAND: RYAN (WATERFORD), KEARNEY (DUBLIN), BOYLE(DUNDALK) |
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gennig
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My thought is that Sarah JOINT is either John's relative or Clara's relative.
Laura Emily HORE was Sarah JOINTS daughter, she is on the 1881 census living with them. On 1891 census she is Laura E SIMS with her husband Frederick SIMS.
I thought at first maybe Laura had Augustine before marrying Frederick.
How does Hermon HOOKINGS come into the picture only one I could find was born circa 1874 and in 1891 was living by himself at age 16!!!
Genni 
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******************************************* All census look up transcriptions are Crown copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk******************************************* Surnames: Armstrong, Gray, Greco, Lambden, Le Busque, Beaton, Carron, Pitt, Gould Areas: Victoria, Tasmania, Hampshire, Berkshire, Yorkshire, Fermanagh, Glamorgan |
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Arranroots
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Sorry Genni
Here is Hermon's part of the story - he is the illegitimate (?) son of Augustine & Fanny's mother.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,102655.0.html
There were 3 children in all, but I was expecting Fanny to share a surname LEWIS with Augustine.
Funny now that you mention it that Hermon seems not to be acceptable in the JOINT or SIMS household, whereas the other children are? No wonder he emigrated, poor chap!
A
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Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ SOM: BIRD, BURT aka BROWN HEF: BAUGH, LATHAM, CARTER, PRITCHARD GLS: WEBB, WORKMAN, LATHAM, MALPUS WIL: WEBB, SALTER RAD: PRITCHARD, WILLIAMS GLA: RYAN, KEARNEY, JONES, HARRY MON: WEBB, MORGAN, WILLIAMS, JONES, BIRD SCOTLAND: HASTINGS, CAMERON, KELSO, BUCHANAN, BETHUNE/ BEATON IRELAND: RYAN (WATERFORD), KEARNEY (DUBLIN), BOYLE(DUNDALK) |
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gennig
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I've checked Sarah back to 1851 and she was married to Edward HORE
The census reveal the following children, all born Ide Devon:-
Edward born circa 1846 aged 5 in 1851
Augustas born 1850 aged 3mths 1851
Louisa Elizabeth born circa 1857 aged 4 in 1861
Laura Emily born circa 1862 aged 9 in 1871
genni
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******************************************* All census look up transcriptions are Crown copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk******************************************* Surnames: Armstrong, Gray, Greco, Lambden, Le Busque, Beaton, Carron, Pitt, Gould Areas: Victoria, Tasmania, Hampshire, Berkshire, Yorkshire, Fermanagh, Glamorgan |
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Arranroots
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Aha! Augustus eh?
I confess you are way ahead of me! Will check these out and PRINT them out before I get terminally confused!
There seems to be a very close-knit community there!
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Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ SOM: BIRD, BURT aka BROWN HEF: BAUGH, LATHAM, CARTER, PRITCHARD GLS: WEBB, WORKMAN, LATHAM, MALPUS WIL: WEBB, SALTER RAD: PRITCHARD, WILLIAMS GLA: RYAN, KEARNEY, JONES, HARRY MON: WEBB, MORGAN, WILLIAMS, JONES, BIRD SCOTLAND: HASTINGS, CAMERON, KELSO, BUCHANAN, BETHUNE/ BEATON IRELAND: RYAN (WATERFORD), KEARNEY (DUBLIN), BOYLE(DUNDALK) |
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gennig
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Other than the fact they don't move around, I would think they are Gypsys.
Will check my book and see what family names were in Devon.
Genni
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******************************************* All census look up transcriptions are Crown copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk******************************************* Surnames: Armstrong, Gray, Greco, Lambden, Le Busque, Beaton, Carron, Pitt, Gould Areas: Victoria, Tasmania, Hampshire, Berkshire, Yorkshire, Fermanagh, Glamorgan |
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