Welcome, Guest. Please login or register for free.
Did you miss your activation email?
Thursday 21 August 08 09:23 BST (UK)
Welcome Home Help Shop Search Calendar Login Register
Search Images Online
 
  First Name(s)
Last Name
 
News: Ad: New! FULL 1841 Census: England - Isle of Man - Wales  - Channel Islands Now online. No missing counties.

+  RootsChat.Com
|-+  England (Counties as in 1851-1901)
| |-+  England - General
| | |-+  Westmorland
| | | |-+  Westmorland Lookup Requests
| | | | |-+  Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« previous next »
Pages: [1] 2 Print
Author Topic: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale  (Read 342 times)
Jeffrey
RootsChat Senior
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 301


Census information is Crown Copyright,
Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« on: Tuesday 15 November 05 16:12 GMT (UK) »
I have a Sarah Heigh, maiden name Armstrong, born in 1864 Bewcastle. Cumberland
In the 1891 Census she is living with her husband Charles and children in Kirkby Lonsdale.
Does any one have any further information about her or her parents. Particularly her mother Charters?

Judy
Logged
Cumberland -  Armstrong Little Nixon Richardson Pearson Watson Braithwait
Westmorland - Richardson Dent Nicholson Hanson Kersey/Casey Smith Heigh
Durham - Reed Smith Reay Hammond Metcalf Bell
Thompson Armstrong Branford Parkin Heaton Oates
Northumberland - Nixon Johnson Armstrong Branford  Thompson
Dumfrieshire - Armstrong Bell Halliday Carruthers 
Yorkshire - Richardson Branford Siddle
Roxburghshire - Jackson Elliot Armstrong
Fife - Adamson Gosman Johnstone Brown
'Tricia
RootsChat Marquessate
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 10259


Edith Gent Bowskill
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 15 November 05 16:29 GMT (UK) »
1871  census

Nether Hill, ....(?) Cottage, Bellbank Cumberland

Christopher Armstrong, Head age 41, Mason born Nichol Forest, Cumberland
Sarah Armstrong,wife age 46 son born Stapleton, Cumberland
John Armstrong,son age 16, born  Bewcastle, Cumberland
Cathrine Armstrong,dau age 9 born Bewcastle, Cumberland
Margaret Armstrong,dau age 7 born Bewcastle, Cumberland
Sarah Armstrong, dau age 4 born 1864  Bewcastle, Cumberland

 
 RG10/5212 Longtown Folio 34 Page 2

Do you have marriage cert to verify father's name?
There is also another Sarah Armstrong born Bewcastle, age 7, father William, a Farmer

Tricia
Logged
Census transcriptions are Crown Copyright from www.NationalArchives.gov.uk
********************************************************
Nottinghamshire,Bulwell: Bowskill, Everley, Gent, Haywood, Houghton, Wilkinson.
Nottinghamshire, Mansfield:- Baxter
Buckinghamshire: Charlesworth, Fowler
Derbyshire:Brimington:- Adams, Baxter
London: Bird, Charlesworth, Coleman, Desmoulins, Everard, Jarman, Quinton, Richards
Italy: Gioffredi
'Tricia
RootsChat Marquessate
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 10259


Edith Gent Bowskill
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 15 November 05 16:46 GMT (UK) »
This looks like her birth reference. Bewcastle registers in Longtown

ARMSTRONG, Sarah
Birth Quarter ending June 1864
Longtown
10b
409

Tricia
Logged
Census transcriptions are Crown Copyright from www.NationalArchives.gov.uk
********************************************************
Nottinghamshire,Bulwell: Bowskill, Everley, Gent, Haywood, Houghton, Wilkinson.
Nottinghamshire, Mansfield:- Baxter
Buckinghamshire: Charlesworth, Fowler
Derbyshire:Brimington:- Adams, Baxter
London: Bird, Charlesworth, Coleman, Desmoulins, Everard, Jarman, Quinton, Richards
Italy: Gioffredi
Jeffrey
RootsChat Senior
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 301


Census information is Crown Copyright,
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 15 November 05 16:51 GMT (UK) »
Thanks again for that but I have had a search done at the records office and she is not the right one! The parents do not match up. I think there was another Sarah Armstrong born that year in that area.

I am at a bit of a loss with this as the family didn't seem to like registering anything officially.

Judy
Logged
Cumberland -  Armstrong Little Nixon Richardson Pearson Watson Braithwait
Westmorland - Richardson Dent Nicholson Hanson Kersey/Casey Smith Heigh
Durham - Reed Smith Reay Hammond Metcalf Bell
Thompson Armstrong Branford Parkin Heaton Oates
Northumberland - Nixon Johnson Armstrong Branford  Thompson
Dumfrieshire - Armstrong Bell Halliday Carruthers 
Yorkshire - Richardson Branford Siddle
Roxburghshire - Jackson Elliot Armstrong
Fife - Adamson Gosman Johnstone Brown
'Tricia
RootsChat Marquessate
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 10259


Edith Gent Bowskill
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 15 November 05 16:53 GMT (UK) »
Could you tell us who her parents are, please
Logged
Census transcriptions are Crown Copyright from www.NationalArchives.gov.uk
********************************************************
Nottinghamshire,Bulwell: Bowskill, Everley, Gent, Haywood, Houghton, Wilkinson.
Nottinghamshire, Mansfield:- Baxter
Buckinghamshire: Charlesworth, Fowler
Derbyshire:Brimington:- Adams, Baxter
London: Bird, Charlesworth, Coleman, Desmoulins, Everard, Jarman, Quinton, Richards
Italy: Gioffredi
Jeffrey
RootsChat Senior
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 301


Census information is Crown Copyright,
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 15 November 05 17:03 GMT (UK) »

Hi Tricia

Her parents are
William Armstrong b Bewcastle 1832
and Charters?Huh

There is nothing else about Charters. However I believe her to be a Charters Jackson b 1833  Hutton & Corrie Scotland and I know quite a bit about her & her family. She had an illegitimate daughter Agnes who I believe William married after she died. I am wanting to prove this but can find very little factual evidence.

Any ideas, facts etc. gratefully received.

Love the picture of your ancestor.

Judy
Logged
Cumberland -  Armstrong Little Nixon Richardson Pearson Watson Braithwait
Westmorland - Richardson Dent Nicholson Hanson Kersey/Casey Smith Heigh
Durham - Reed Smith Reay Hammond Metcalf Bell
Thompson Armstrong Branford Parkin Heaton Oates
Northumberland - Nixon Johnson Armstrong Branford  Thompson
Dumfrieshire - Armstrong Bell Halliday Carruthers 
Yorkshire - Richardson Branford Siddle
Roxburghshire - Jackson Elliot Armstrong
Fife - Adamson Gosman Johnstone Brown
'Tricia
RootsChat Marquessate
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 10259


Edith Gent Bowskill
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 15 November 05 17:18 GMT (UK) »
Was the illegimate daughter called Agnes Routledge?
Logged
Census transcriptions are Crown Copyright from www.NationalArchives.gov.uk
********************************************************
Nottinghamshire,Bulwell: Bowskill, Everley, Gent, Haywood, Houghton, Wilkinson.
Nottinghamshire, Mansfield:- Baxter
Buckinghamshire: Charlesworth, Fowler
Derbyshire:Brimington:- Adams, Baxter
London: Bird, Charlesworth, Coleman, Desmoulins, Everard, Jarman, Quinton, Richards
Italy: Gioffredi
'Tricia
RootsChat Marquessate
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 10259


Edith Gent Bowskill
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday 15 November 05 17:28 GMT (UK) »
I am 99% positive that Agnes Routledge is the child of Chartres.

She is married to William born 1832 and has a daughter called Charters on the 1881 census. She has the same details as a Agnes Routledge that I have found as Stepdaughter to William.

Tricia
Logged
Census transcriptions are Crown Copyright from www.NationalArchives.gov.uk
********************************************************
Nottinghamshire,Bulwell: Bowskill, Everley, Gent, Haywood, Houghton, Wilkinson.
Nottinghamshire, Mansfield:- Baxter
Buckinghamshire: Charlesworth, Fowler
Derbyshire:Brimington:- Adams, Baxter
London: Bird, Charlesworth, Coleman, Desmoulins, Everard, Jarman, Quinton, Richards
Italy: Gioffredi
Jeffrey
RootsChat Senior
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 301


Census information is Crown Copyright,
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday 15 November 05 17:43 GMT (UK) »
Well that is another little twist.

The illegitimate daughter was called Agnes Jackson but I think that they did not want to say that to the enumerator because of the relationship but the supposition is that they were one and the same person!!! I can find no Agnes Routledge born around then at all.

Also another little twist is that he had already married Agnes at Gretna Green in Oct 1870 (before the Census) She put her maiden name down as Armstrong then and also lied about her age. She was in fact 16 in the 1871 Census. She changed to her correct age around the 1891 Census and on later marriage certificates.

I have her birth Cert (passed down through the family) & death Cert and family recall to prove this and her 2 other marriage certs.


That is why I thought if I tried to go through another branch of the family they may have other evidence as to the surname of Charters.

I hope you can follow all this as it is quite complicated. They were quite a rum lot I think!

Judy
Logged
Cumberland -  Armstrong Little Nixon Richardson Pearson Watson Braithwait
Westmorland - Richardson Dent Nicholson Hanson Kersey/Casey Smith Heigh
Durham - Reed Smith Reay Hammond Metcalf Bell
Thompson Armstrong Branford Parkin Heaton Oates
Northumberland - Nixon Johnson Armstrong Branford  Thompson
Dumfrieshire - Armstrong Bell Halliday Carruthers 
Yorkshire - Richardson Branford Siddle
Roxburghshire - Jackson Elliot Armstrong
Fife - Adamson Gosman Johnstone Brown
Jeffrey
RootsChat Senior
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 301


Census information is Crown Copyright,
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #9 on: Tuesday 15 November 05 17:47 GMT (UK) »
Hi Trisha,

You say there is a Margaret Routledge also a stepdaughter of William. Where did you find that information?

Becuase Agnes had a sister Margaret.

Also the Charters born in the 1881 Census was my grandmother. I am named after her.

Judy
Logged
Cumberland -  Armstrong Little Nixon Richardson Pearson Watson Braithwait
Westmorland - Richardson Dent Nicholson Hanson Kersey/Casey Smith Heigh
Durham - Reed Smith Reay Hammond Metcalf Bell
Thompson Armstrong Branford Parkin Heaton Oates
Northumberland - Nixon Johnson Armstrong Branford  Thompson
Dumfrieshire - Armstrong Bell Halliday Carruthers 
Yorkshire - Richardson Branford Siddle
Roxburghshire - Jackson Elliot Armstrong
Fife - Adamson Gosman Johnstone Brown
'Tricia
RootsChat Marquessate
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 10259


Edith Gent Bowskill
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #10 on: Tuesday 15 November 05 18:04 GMT (UK) »
I'll post what I have found in a tick. That Margaret was Agnes - slip of brain.

Tricia
Logged
Census transcriptions are Crown Copyright from www.NationalArchives.gov.uk
********************************************************
Nottinghamshire,Bulwell: Bowskill, Everley, Gent, Haywood, Houghton, Wilkinson.
Nottinghamshire, Mansfield:- Baxter
Buckinghamshire: Charlesworth, Fowler
Derbyshire:Brimington:- Adams, Baxter
London: Bird, Charlesworth, Coleman, Desmoulins, Everard, Jarman, Quinton, Richards
Italy: Gioffredi
'Tricia
RootsChat Marquessate
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 10259


Edith Gent Bowskill
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #11 on: Tuesday 15 November 05 18:47 GMT (UK) »
I assume you have seen the 1871 census?

In 1861 the only William that fits is unmarried.

Have you seen this?

1861 census

John Noble, Head,Farmer of 200 acres of land age 60, Farmer of 200 acres of land born Bewcastle, Cumberland
John Noble nephew,age 37, Shepherd born Bewcastle, Cumberland
Charters Jackson,age born 1835  Hutton, Scotland Servant   
Ann Murray,age born abt 1836  Bewcastle, Cumberland

RG9/3910 Longtown Folio 64 Page 13

Charters must have married and died between 1861 and 1871 so I am not going to find her with daughter Sarah anywhere.

Have you got the 1871image, which is the other one I mentioned? This has William, Sarah and Agnes Routledge on it.
I think the birth cert I gave you is the correct one.
If William and Charters married in Scotland I won't be able to findtheir certificate.

I am not too sure what information you are seeking??
Have you sent for any birth certs for Sarah?

Tricia
Logged
Census transcriptions are Crown Copyright from www.NationalArchives.gov.uk
********************************************************
Nottinghamshire,Bulwell: Bowskill, Everley, Gent, Haywood, Houghton, Wilkinson.
Nottinghamshire, Mansfield:- Baxter
Buckinghamshire: Charlesworth, Fowler
Derbyshire:Brimington:- Adams, Baxter
London: Bird, Charlesworth, Coleman, Desmoulins, Everard, Jarman, Quinton, Richards
Italy: Gioffredi
Jeffrey
RootsChat Senior
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 301


Census information is Crown Copyright,
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #12 on: Tuesday 15 November 05 23:44 GMT (UK) »
Hi Tricia
Thank you for all the information. I have the information too.

What I am really wanting is some sort of proof that it was Charters Jackson that married William Armstrong. Then her daughter married William too. I thought maybe by tracing Sarah - Charters & Williams daughter there may be a chance that that side of the family knew Charters surname.

However by you going through the same process as I have  - you have also reached the same conclusions that I have. 

Although there is a lot of evidence to suggest that Charters Jackson did marry William Armstrong i.e. by her unusual Christian name, her age, where she came from and she was in the area & had a daughter Agnes - there is still no definate proof!!

I had already sent away for the birth certificate of the Sarah you gave me and the GRO said that the parents names did not correspond to what I had asked. There was a Sarah born to a Christopher & Sarah Armstrong in the same year in Bewcastle.

I also did the same with one of her brothers, just putting in William Armstrong as father, with a search over 3 years and again drew a blank with the GRO!


The Parish Registers did not have her Maiden name in the recording of her death. But I know they lived at Parknook Bewcastle when she died.

I can not find any marriage In England or Scotland for Charters & William - may have been Gretna but not on the Achievments site.

I know they lived together at New House Bewcastle from 1864 to 1866 as this is in the Manorial Records.

I am very grateful to you for helping .
I am quite frustrated with it. Have you any other ideas about where to get proof?

Judy
Logged
Cumberland -  Armstrong Little Nixon Richardson Pearson Watson Braithwait
Westmorland - Richardson Dent Nicholson Hanson Kersey/Casey Smith Heigh
Durham - Reed Smith Reay Hammond Metcalf Bell
Thompson Armstrong Branford Parkin Heaton Oates
Northumberland - Nixon Johnson Armstrong Branford  Thompson
Dumfrieshire - Armstrong Bell Halliday Carruthers 
Yorkshire - Richardson Branford Siddle
Roxburghshire - Jackson Elliot Armstrong
Fife - Adamson Gosman Johnstone Brown
'Tricia
RootsChat Marquessate
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 10259


Edith Gent Bowskill
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #13 on: Tuesday 15 November 05 23:55 GMT (UK) »
Where did you look for the Charters/William marriage in England?

Tricia
Logged
Census transcriptions are Crown Copyright from www.NationalArchives.gov.uk
********************************************************
Nottinghamshire,Bulwell: Bowskill, Everley, Gent, Haywood, Houghton, Wilkinson.
Nottinghamshire, Mansfield:- Baxter
Buckinghamshire: Charlesworth, Fowler
Derbyshire:Brimington:- Adams, Baxter
London: Bird, Charlesworth, Coleman, Desmoulins, Everard, Jarman, Quinton, Richards
Italy: Gioffredi
Jeffrey
RootsChat Senior
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 301


Census information is Crown Copyright,
Re: Heigh/Armstrong, Kirkby Lonsdale
« Reply #14 on: Wednesday 16 November 05 13:36 GMT (UK) »
Hi Tricia,

I have looked for the marriage in
the Bewcastle Parish Registers.
Ancestry.co.uk
Free BMD
1837 on line
Scotlands people
Achievments site for Gretna Green.

I have not personally gone to look at the Records Office.

There may be another Church in Bewcastle (Knwle Church) which was I think Presbyterian that may have marriage records.

There other places at Gretna where they could have got married but I can not trace where the records are kept.

And then there may be other places in Scotland.

Any other suggestions?
Judy
Logged
Cumberland -  Armstrong Little Nixon Richardson Pearson Watson Braithwait
Westmorland - Richardson Dent Nicholson Hanson Kersey/Casey Smith Heigh
Durham - Reed Smith Reay Hammond Metcalf Bell
Thompson Armstrong Branford Parkin Heaton Oates
Northumberland - Nixon Johnson Armstrong Branford  Thompson
Dumfrieshire - Armstrong Bell Halliday Carruthers 
Yorkshire - Richardson Branford Siddle
Roxburghshire - Jackson Elliot Armstrong
Fife - Adamson Gosman Johnstone Brown
Pages: [1] 2 Print 
« previous next »


[Copyright] [Free RootsChat Webspace] [Your Surname Interests] [Shrink Link] [About Us] [Terms of Use]
All Census Lookups are Crown Copyright, National Archives for academic and non-commercial research purposes only
RootsChat.com cannot be held responsible directly or indirectly for the messages or content posted by others. Inline images in messages are the copyright of the respective linked sites.
RootsChat.com, Europa House, Bury, Lancashire, BL9 5BT
0.211:22