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Author Topic: Seaforth Highlanders  (Read 6361 times)

Offline vandab

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Seaforth Highlanders
« on: Thursday 23 February 06 20:40 GMT (UK) »
Hi . I am trying to find my Great Grandfathers army records. He served in the Seaforth Highlanders in India and was also on The Isle of Wight at the barracks in approx 1885. My grandmother was born in India in 1890 . I know they changed their name but not sure to what. Can anyone advise where i would find the details of his service hopefully on-line, Thanks Vanda ???


I'm researching both sides of my family so I'm looking for a lot of info hence a lot of names!!
My main interest at present is for LAWSON,Scotland†  CRONK,Edenbridge Kent, Croydon.†  LEIGHTON, Scotland.† BROWN Ireland and London, WARBURTON.Cheshire and Worcestershire

Offline Kevwood

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Re: Seaforth Highlanders
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 23 February 06 23:52 GMT (UK) »
Hi Vanda,welcome to Rootschat, if you post names and what you know, someone may be able to find something.

Kev. ;D
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

wood,west,williams,morgan,sollars,hawker,snell,roach,clark,symons. In bristol,fremington,instow,rhymney,colyton


Offline moiramount

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Re: Seaforth Highlanders
« Reply #2 on: Friday 24 February 06 00:18 GMT (UK) »
hi vanda, go online to the national archives, they have records of any medals awarded to them, do you know his number, if not you will have to search with what you know, it will cost you £3.50 to print a copy off. My grandfather was in the seaforths as well in 1914 in france, you havn't said where your gt grandfather was from, mine was from morayshire and i got alot of info from the roll of honour at elgin library.

          moira
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Offline Hackstaple

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Re: Seaforth Highlanders
« Reply #3 on: Friday 24 February 06 00:30 GMT (UK) »
You may find this history of the Seaforths particularly interesting. It was rough soldiering right then! http://www.qohldrs.co.uk/html/seaforth_highlanders_full_hist.htm
Southern or Southan [Hereford , Monmouthshire & Glos], Jenkins, Meredith and Morgan [Monmouthshire and Glos.], Murrill, Damary, Damry, Ray, Lawrence [all Middx. & London], Nethway from Kenn or Yatton. Also Riley and Lyons in South Africa and Riley from St. Helena.
Any census information included in this post is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline vandab

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Re: Seaforth Highlanders
« Reply #4 on: Friday 24 February 06 09:26 GMT (UK) »
Hi, Thanks for the replies. His name was John Lawson and all i really know of him is that he was born born in Scotland. I have contacted The seaforths through their web site but it seems he did not win any medals so they don't have a record for him. I know he was a  Quarter Master Sergeant in1884 on the Isle of Wight and a corpl in 1890 in India. I know this through birth certificates. My nan was born in the Murree Hills and he was in the 2nd Bn Regiment, then and i think it says the 1st when he was in the Isle of Wight.By c1887 he was back in Scotland and then to London,   Vanda
I'm researching both sides of my family so I'm looking for a lot of info hence a lot of names!!
My main interest at present is for LAWSON,Scotland†  CRONK,Edenbridge Kent, Croydon.†  LEIGHTON, Scotland.† BROWN Ireland and London, WARBURTON.Cheshire and Worcestershire

Offline Garen

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Re: Seaforth Highlanders
« Reply #5 on: Monday 27 March 06 15:34 BST (UK) »
Hello Vanda,

After 1881 the Seaforth Highlanders were an amalgamation of the 72nd and 78th Highlanders. The 72nd Highlanders were on the Isle of Wight in 1885 (along with two of my own ggg-uncles), and were back in Scotland by 1887.

Both the 72nd and 78th Highlanders served in the Afghan campaign 1878-1880. I checked the medal roll for both of these regiments and in the 72nd there is a Private John Lawson (though he is listed under the Colour Sergeants). As he's on the roll it means he received the Afghan war medal, but unusually for the 72nd, he received no clasps, nor the bronze star (the 72nd were one of the highest decorated regiments of the Second Afghan War). This may indicate an early exit from the campaign - perhaps due to illness (he's not on the casualty roll). His service number was 58B/22.

I don't believe the 72nd went back to India until after 1900, so it's possible that John Lawson may have changed regiment, probably to the 78th as they were the 2nd Battalion Seaforths (the 72nd were the 1st Battalion).

If you think this is him then perhaps you'd consider contributing his details to the Afghan war database project? You can see more info at www.angloafghanwar.info - and I'll be hapy to help further in any way I can.

All the best -
Garen.
Second Anglo-Afghan War 1878-80 - http://www.angloafghanwar.info
Family research - http://www.garenewing.co.uk/family/

Offline vandab

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Re: Seaforth Highlanders
« Reply #6 on: Monday 27 March 06 17:58 BST (UK) »
Hi Garen,  You have made  my day!!
He was a colour Sergeant when he married in 1881 in Lucknow, He married Alice Maud Brown, Her residence was was also Lucknow, the only other info i have is taken from the 1901 census ie the childrens births which are
Mary b 1885 in IOW,  John b 1889 in India,  Andrew b 1891 in India,  Elizabeth b 1890, Murree Hills, India (my nan ),  Robert b Scotland 1887,  James and Alexander both born in London I think he must have been a civilian then.
He was a Quarter Master Sergeant with the 1st Searforth Highlanders when in the IOW and a corpl in 1890 with 2nd Bn Reg of Seaforth Highlanders, if that all makes sense.How can i confirm the one you have found is mine? Also do you know where in Scotland he was born.Will willingly put his details on that web site you have given me if it is him. How did you find out these details i have looked but didn't really know where to look.
Best wishes Vanda, Thanks again
I'm researching both sides of my family so I'm looking for a lot of info hence a lot of names!!
My main interest at present is for LAWSON,Scotland†  CRONK,Edenbridge Kent, Croydon.†  LEIGHTON, Scotland.† BROWN Ireland and London, WARBURTON.Cheshire and Worcestershire

Offline vandab

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Re: Seaforth Highlanders
« Reply #7 on: Monday 27 March 06 18:17 BST (UK) »
Hi Garen, its me again,were Irishmen also in the Seaforth's? I ask because my other G Grandfather must have served somewhere as John's wife was born in St Helena and she lived in Lucknow, (cant find him either)   they had to meet somewhere. Long shot i know
His name was Robert Brown born Ireland
I'm researching both sides of my family so I'm looking for a lot of info hence a lot of names!!
My main interest at present is for LAWSON,Scotland†  CRONK,Edenbridge Kent, Croydon.†  LEIGHTON, Scotland.† BROWN Ireland and London, WARBURTON.Cheshire and Worcestershire

Offline Garen

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Re: Seaforth Highlanders
« Reply #8 on: Monday 27 March 06 18:37 BST (UK) »
Hello Vanda - I'm really pleased this has been some help. How can you know this is the right John Lawson? The clearest way will be to see if his service record survives at Kew. I think it is very likely to be the right person...

Let's look at your facts:

John Lawson, Sergeant 1st Battalion Seaforth Highlanders
1881 Lucknow - Colour Sergeant
1885 Isle of Wight
1887 Scotland
1890 Corporal 2nd Battalion Seaforth Highlanders

And match it up with known facts:

The 1st Battalion Seaforth Highlanders were the 72nd Highlanders before 1881
The Afghan war medal roll shows John Lawson, Colour Sergeant 58B/22
 † † †no clasps
The 72nd Highlanders were in Lucknow 1880-81
The 72nd Highlanders were in Egypt 1882
The Egypt war medal roll shows Colour Sergeant John Lawson S/128 (some soldiers had new numbers when they became the Seaforths in 1881)
 † † †medals: Egypt war medal w/clasp for Tel-el-Kebir and Khedieve's Bronze Star
Carisbrook, Isle of Wight Oct 1882-1885
Edinburgh 1886
Glasgow 1888
I'm fairly sure the 2nd Battalion Seaforths (78th) were in India by 1890 (but I don't know much about them, or that era)

So it looks pretty good. I even think I may have a photo of him (I'll attach it soon, it's bad quality and I'm not sure which one he is).

What's John's date of birth, or approx year from the census and marriage certificate? I have a copy of the Afghan and Egypt war medal roll, so looked him up on there. I also know a bit about the 72nd Highlanders from that time-frame as my two ggg-uncles were sergeants int he 1st Seaforths too - they will have known each other.

Yes, I do believe a fair few Irishmen served in the Seaforths (the 72nd served in Ireland before they went to India, in the 1860s), but there is no Robert Brown on the Afghan war medal roll for the 72nd.
Second Anglo-Afghan War 1878-80 - http://www.angloafghanwar.info
Family research - http://www.garenewing.co.uk/family/