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Topic: GRIFFITH 1841 (Read 1187 times)
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Alex and Jan
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 299
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Shipping records to Australia have located George and Emma GRIFFITH in 1849 coming from St Helier Jersey.
Could SKS look for them in the 1841 census for us please ?
George b 1825 has a brother Thomas
parents John and Emma
Emma b 1828 parents Robert and Sarah - we do not have the marriage details so do not know the surname.
Thank You
Alex and Jan
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Mike E
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 333
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I had a look for George and Emma Griffith in Jersey 1841 census online at http://members.shaw.ca/jerseymaid without success.
All I could find was possibly the brother -
St Helier
Thomas Griffith carpenter 25 Jersey
Mary 25 Jersey
Eliza 3 Jersey
Emilia 18 mths Jersey
Thomas 1 month Jersey.
St Helier, Deslands Place
Thomas Griffiths 20 turner Jersey
Ann Griffiths 20 milliner Jersey
Ann 4 months Jersey
Ann Rose 60 ind Jersey
Sorry this does not sound very promising. Could they have moved to the UK in 1841 before going to Australia?
Have you any more details to confirm a Jersey link? or could it be spelt differently?
Mike
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Alex and Jan
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 299
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Hi Mike
Thanks for your posting.
Thomas was already here when George and Emma emigrated in 1849.
The details we posted where from the shipping records.
Thanks for looking
Alex and Jan
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Mike E
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 333
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Alex and Jan -
I have loads of interesting information for you!
St Helier parish church marriages -
26 Oct 1845
George Griffiths aged 20 bachelor occupation: turner resident: St Helier born: St Helier father: John Griffitrhs, turner
Emma Littlejohns aged 18 spinster - resident: St Helier born: St helier Father: Robert Littlejohns, cooper
George's parents were married in St Helier - 17.3.1814
John Griffiths St Helier
Betsey Le Gresley St Helier
Then I seached for John's baptism, St Helier parish church -
George Griffiths bapt. 3.11.1824 son of John Griffiths and Betsey Le Gresley
and found siblings with the same parents:
Thomas bap. 8.6.1817
Betsey bap. 20.4.1820
Philippe bap. 1.11.1822
George bap. 3.11.1824
Mary Jane bap. 10.12.1828
Harriet bap. 19.6.1831
Francis William bap. 16.2.1834
Mary Ann Jane bap. 16.7.1837
Ann Emilia bap. 15.3.1840
and eventually, I have found them in the 1841 census, St Helier:
John Griffiths
Elizabeth
Philip
George
Elizabeth
Francis
Jane
Henrietta [Harriet?]
Mary
Anne
... and in 1851 census, St Helier, Le Geyt Street -
GRIFFITH
John hd marr. 58 turner St Helier
Betty wife marr. 54 St Helier
Jane Mary dau unm 22 b. France, Nantes
Harriet dau unm 19 St Helier
Francis William son unm 17 "
Mary Ann Jane dau unm 13 "
Ann Amelia dau unm 11 "
Amelia Esther dau unm 8 "
[of course Thomas and George had left by then].
I had a look for the Littlejohns but, although Emma is supposed to be born in St Helier, I couldn't find them.
I think this will give you plenty to be going on with. Let me know when you need any more information.
Mike
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Entwistle (Bolton and Edgworth)
Cook(e) (Manchester and Warwicks)
Whitaker (Lancs and Cumberland)
McMillen and Palmer (Co Down)
Hyde and Oakley (Staffs)
Lovet, Edwards and Clark (Salop)
Ratcliffe, Walker and Ruffley (Lancs)
Sainsbury (Gloucs, Cornwall and Yorks)
Laundry (Cornwall)
Waterhouse and Haigh (Yorks)
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Barber, Brown (Cheshire)
Waterfield (Derby)
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Alex and Jan
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 299
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WOW thanks a lot for those details MIke :-)
We have been contacted by another descendant of this line and he has George Griffith marrying Emma Ann Quarm 26 Oct 1845 !
Her death here in Australia in 1869 says her parents are Robert and Sarah
and that she was born about 1827 St Helier
He also has John Griffith born about 1794 St Helier, parents Jean and Marie Phillipe
Betsy Le Gresley born 20 jan 1797 St John, Jersey, parents Jean Le Gresley and Elizabeth Lucas
Thanks again and we would appreciate it if you happen to find any more details as we cannot research as easily in Australia, the female descendant of this line has died, her husband is blind and we are hoping to give their only son all these details.
Alex and Jan
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Mike E
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 333
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Hmm... interesting...
I wonder how 'Littlejohns' (which I read directly from the original St Helier parish register in the archives - not a transcipt) could become 'Quarm' from your source?
I will have a look for the name Quarm next time... but it is a strange name! However, that might explain why I couldn't find anything on the Littlejohns.
Its also interesting that the John Griffiths, turner aged 45, and family, I found in the 1841 census (in Fletcher Place) are almost next door to the Thomas Griffiths, turner aged 20 (in Deslandes Place). I would guess father and son? Are you certain your Thomas was already in Australia in 1841?
Sorry to add more queries than I answer. However, I am happy to look up all the siblings in the later census records etc. - so I want to make sure I am looking up the right family.
Regards
Mike
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Entwistle (Bolton and Edgworth)
Cook(e) (Manchester and Warwicks)
Whitaker (Lancs and Cumberland)
McMillen and Palmer (Co Down)
Hyde and Oakley (Staffs)
Lovet, Edwards and Clark (Salop)
Ratcliffe, Walker and Ruffley (Lancs)
Sainsbury (Gloucs, Cornwall and Yorks)
Laundry (Cornwall)
Waterhouse and Haigh (Yorks)
Bird, Rendel / Rendle, Bull, Stoodley, Shoemake / Shoemark, Groves, Baker, Hallett, Burford, Gaylard, Mounter, Highmore (Somerset)
Barber, Brown (Cheshire)
Waterfield (Derby)
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Alex and Jan
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 299
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Hello again Mike,
The details from the other descendant are on worldconnect.rootsweb.com.
Thomas left England 6 Oct 1848 arriving here 7 Jan 1849 on "Thomas Arbuthnot" - the shipping records say Thomas 31, Ann 29, Ann L 8, Rosa J 5, Thomas G 3.
George left England 16 Oct 1848 arriving here 12 Feb 1849 on the "Harbinger" - George 24, Emma 21, George E infant
These can be viewed on records.nsw.gov.au in the a to z index under immigration.
Alex and Jan
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Mike E
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 333
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Hi Alex and Jan -
So that's fairly certain that the Thomas Griffiths in St Helier 1841 census (Deslandes Place) is the brother of George who was living with his father John and family in Fletcher Place, before leaving for Australia.
I still need to sort out the Littlejohn/Quarm question: it seems to be the right marriage but different surname!
Mike
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Entwistle (Bolton and Edgworth)
Cook(e) (Manchester and Warwicks)
Whitaker (Lancs and Cumberland)
McMillen and Palmer (Co Down)
Hyde and Oakley (Staffs)
Lovet, Edwards and Clark (Salop)
Ratcliffe, Walker and Ruffley (Lancs)
Sainsbury (Gloucs, Cornwall and Yorks)
Laundry (Cornwall)
Waterhouse and Haigh (Yorks)
Bird, Rendel / Rendle, Bull, Stoodley, Shoemake / Shoemark, Groves, Baker, Hallett, Burford, Gaylard, Mounter, Highmore (Somerset)
Barber, Brown (Cheshire)
Waterfield (Derby)
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Alex and Jan
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 299
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Thanks Mike,
We look forward to hearing what you can find.
Regards,
Alex and Jan
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Mike E
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 333
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I still need to sort out the Littlejohn/Quarm question: it seems to be the right marriage but different surname!
Hello again Alex and Jan -
I have made some progress on the Quarm issue; it's such an unusual name that there is only one family in Jersey.
1841 census, St Helier, Jersey:
QUARM
Robert
Sarah
Emma
Mary
Josa
Amelia
1851 census, Old Street, St Helier
QUARM
Robert head marr 48 cooper b. England
Sarah wife marr 46 sugar boiler b.England
Margaret dau unm 20 at home b. Jersey, St Helier
Laura J dau unm 12 scholar b.Jersey, St Helier
Theresa dau unm 10 scholar b.Jersey, St Helier
William son unm 6 scholar b.Jersey, St Helier
1861 census, Old Street, St Helier
QUARM
Sarah head wid. 58 confectioner England
William son unm 18 French polisher St Helier
Robert son unm 16 scholar st Helier
Laura daug unm 22 servant St Helier
Then I get to some interesting baptisms, and some burials, - St Helier parish church, all with parents Robert Quarm / Quarn and Sarah :
QUARN [sic]
Robert Edwin bap. 25 Dec 1827
Emma Ann bap. 25 Dec 1827
QUARM
Mary Ann Sarah bap. 3.2.1830
Amelia Temperance bap 25.3.1832 - bur. 26.5.1836
Laura Jane bap. 27.4.1834 - bur. 14.4.1838
Amelia Le Feuvre bap. 18.12.1836 - bur. 11.5.1838
Laura Jane bap. 24.2.1839
Theresa Amelia bap. 8.8.1841
... and St Helier registrar's index (civil registration after 1842)
Robert Edward QUARM period 14.11.1844 - 24.12.1845 page 35
William Littlejohns QUARM period 1.8.1842 - 30.9.1943 page 58.
So - BINGO! - the very last entry I found has established there is a link (I don't know why!) between Quarm and Littlejohns! I'm not at all clear why Emma's marriage entry should put her surname down as 'Littlejohns', but it seems fairly clear that she is a Quarm and her father is Robert Quarm the cooper.
SO this partly solves the mystery.
I couldn't find a marriage entry in St Helier for Robert Quarm and Sarah ( ca.1823-1831) - and since they both come from England, I wonder if they were married there?
I hope this helps.
Regards
Mike
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Entwistle (Bolton and Edgworth)
Cook(e) (Manchester and Warwicks)
Whitaker (Lancs and Cumberland)
McMillen and Palmer (Co Down)
Hyde and Oakley (Staffs)
Lovet, Edwards and Clark (Salop)
Ratcliffe, Walker and Ruffley (Lancs)
Sainsbury (Gloucs, Cornwall and Yorks)
Laundry (Cornwall)
Waterhouse and Haigh (Yorks)
Bird, Rendel / Rendle, Bull, Stoodley, Shoemake / Shoemark, Groves, Baker, Hallett, Burford, Gaylard, Mounter, Highmore (Somerset)
Barber, Brown (Cheshire)
Waterfield (Derby)
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Alex and Jan
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 299
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Thanks so much for all your time and legwork.
We appreciate it so very much.
Regards,
Jan and Alex
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