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Topic: Sinclair/Sutherland/Rosie/Calder? (Read 2571 times)
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bettyespana
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 291
John's 80th birthday
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My ggggrandparents are Alexander Sinclair/Elizabeth Sutherland m.Clyth,Caithness 5 Dec 1788.
The problem I have is that I don't know who their parents were.On the copy of the Old Parish Register from New Register House it only states the fathers names.John Sinclair father of Alexander & what looks like Alexander Robertson father of Elizabeth(it is very badly written & definitely not Sutherland.
I have looked on LDS & have found only 2 possible sets of parents for Alexander Sinclair:
1.John Sinclair/Bessy Rosy b.of Alexander 19.7.1763
2.John Sinclair/Christian Calder b.of Alexander 15.2.1769.
As far as Elizabeth Sutherland is concerned I have drawn a blank.
Please is there anyone out there who can help,it has taken me 5 yrs to find that I have Scottish ancestors via my paternal Granny & I would dearly love to find the rest of my Scottish heritage.
Cheers
bettyespana
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Lancashire- Moss,Broadbent,Olley,Dobson
Norfolk- Olley,Knowles,Bunn,Pooley,Scott,Vince
Caithness & Dumfries - Evans,Sinclair,Mackay
Berwick on Tweed - Mackay
Liverpool,Wigan & Southport - Ball,Taylor
Cheshire - Dickenson
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Burrow Digger
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1235
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You'll need to scroll through the records at Scotlands people - and its a PPV site (pay per view).
http://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/
I'm stuck in the early 1800s and am having trouble getting further back - my family was in Orkney.
BD
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bettyespana
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 291
John's 80th birthday
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Hi Burrowdigger,
I have tried scrolling through Scotlandspeople & actually ordered the certificate I have via them.
Unfortunately being a pensioner I cannot afford too many of their PPV fees,so I am hoping someone out there may have the information I need.
I know I am probably clutching at straws,but I have posts /enquiries in different chat rooms.
Thank you for your prompt reply to my enquiry & future Good Luck in your own research.
Cheers
bettyespanas
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Lancashire- Moss,Broadbent,Olley,Dobson
Norfolk- Olley,Knowles,Bunn,Pooley,Scott,Vince
Caithness & Dumfries - Evans,Sinclair,Mackay
Berwick on Tweed - Mackay
Liverpool,Wigan & Southport - Ball,Taylor
Cheshire - Dickenson
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bettyespana
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 291
John's 80th birthday
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Hi there,
To tell you the truth I am at a loss with these two.
I have a copy of their marriage (not a very clear extract)
This is what it appears to say:
Sinclair Alexander in  was matrimonially contracted to Elisabeth Sutherland in Clyth Caithness for the man John Sinclair in Clyth and for the woman Alexander Robertson in Clyth.
I acquired this from GROS via Scotlandspeople & it is a record of an extract from a Register Of Proclamations of Banns & Marriages. Dec 5th 1788
As far as children other than my Paternal GGGrandfather:
10 Apr 1802 Sinclair Kennedy S to Alex.Sinclair/Eliz.Sinclair Wick Caithness :
Someone sent me this as possible siblings for Kennedy
Janet Sinclair b.23 Nov 1794
Jean Sinclair Ch.28 Nov 1797
Henry Sinclair Ch:2 Apr 1806
Robert Sinclair Ch:14 May 1804
John Sinclair Ch:6 Nov 1795
Benjamin Sinclair b 10 Apr 1802(looks as if Twin of Kennedy)
James Sinclair Ch:19 Nov 1799
These apparently were referenced C110432
My problem is where do I go from here?
The possibles I have from Scotlandspeople don't tie in with the order of these names as you have suggested.
I am very grateful for the info you have sent & will certainly have another look at it,but would appreciate any further advice.
Regards
bettyespana 
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Lancashire- Moss,Broadbent,Olley,Dobson
Norfolk- Olley,Knowles,Bunn,Pooley,Scott,Vince
Caithness & Dumfries - Evans,Sinclair,Mackay
Berwick on Tweed - Mackay
Liverpool,Wigan & Southport - Ball,Taylor
Cheshire - Dickenson
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bettyespana
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 291
John's 80th birthday
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I stand corrected I checked the birth for Kennedy Sinclair from Scotlandspeople & yes they are both Sinclairs.
KennedySinclair & Alice Mackay are the named parents on my Great Grandmother Sarah Elizabeth Sinclair & George Evans Marriage Cert 5.7.1869 St Giles district,Edinburgh.which I have a copy of.
Kennedy Sinclair was in 92 Highlanders /Chelsea Pensioner.
In 1851 the family lived at 54 Dunbar Close Edinburgh & Kennedy was a Licensed Porter.
In 1861 they lived at 29 Charles Street,St Giles district.
Back to the drawing board but thanks for all this,if there is anything I can possibly help you with I will.
In the meantime
Cheers  
bettyespana
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Lancashire- Moss,Broadbent,Olley,Dobson
Norfolk- Olley,Knowles,Bunn,Pooley,Scott,Vince
Caithness & Dumfries - Evans,Sinclair,Mackay
Berwick on Tweed - Mackay
Liverpool,Wigan & Southport - Ball,Taylor
Cheshire - Dickenson
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peterd500
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 20
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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better sit down bettyespana!
Kennedy & his siblings belong to Alexander Sutherland SINCLAIR at Gansclett & Elizabeth SINCLAIR who were married 1793, Alexander the son of "Holy John" SINCLAIR at Gansclett & Christina CALDER, John being a son of Donald SINCLAIR the sailor & Catherine SINCLAIR, Donald being the son of David SINCLAIR of Broynach whose father was Sir James SINCLAIR 2nd of Murkle whose father James SINCLAIR 1st of Murkle married Elizabeth STEWART daughter of "bad" lord robert STEWART, one of the many illegitimate children to Charles V of Scotland (by Euphemia ELPHINSTONE), grandson of henry VII of England.
Alexander SINCLAIR at Clyth & Elizabeth SUTHERLAND (Betty MCRYRIE) were contracted to married 5 Jan 1788 and married 2 Jan 1789, Alexander's father being James "Saltie" SINCLAIR the chamberlain, son of Donald the sailor, son of david of Broynach, etc as above. James the chamberlain was married twice and I am descended from a son to his second marriage, "Long John" SINCLAIR who married Barbara CORMACK.
In other words, Alexander who married Elizabeth SUTHERLAND and Alexander who married Elizabeth SINCLAIR were first cousins being descended from half-brothers.
Will that do for starters?
Peter
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peterd500
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 20
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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oops, the two Alexanders'fathers were full brothers, not half-brothers
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bettyespana
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 291
John's 80th birthday
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Hello Peter,
Well you have certainly dumbfounded me,without a doubt.
Somewhere along the way,I had been told there was a possible connection to the heirarchy but I never expected this.
A couple of items in your information sound rather intriguing.
1.Why Donald (the sailor) is there a story behind him being called this?
2.Why John (holy John) is there also a story behind this name?
Was James the chamberlain in the royal house or where?
Please tell me more if you can.
Betty : 
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Lancashire- Moss,Broadbent,Olley,Dobson
Norfolk- Olley,Knowles,Bunn,Pooley,Scott,Vince
Caithness & Dumfries - Evans,Sinclair,Mackay
Berwick on Tweed - Mackay
Liverpool,Wigan & Southport - Ball,Taylor
Cheshire - Dickenson
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peterd500
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 20
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello Betty & Tricia
There is way too much information to send via Rootschat, it will have to be done by private email with attachments etc. I have sent you both messages with an email address for you to use. You will not be disappointed!
regards
peter
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peterd500
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 20
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello Betty & Tricia
What follows this explanation is merely the first paragraph of a very long concluding letter by Thomas SINCLAIR as part of a correspondence in the letters to the editor columns of the old caithness newspaper, the Northern Ensign, that went on regarding the succession of the earldom of caithness, and much more besides, during 1889-1891. Yes, David SINCLAIR who married Margaret MORE was the son of David SINCLAIR of Broynach & Janet EWEN, Broynach's older brother being the earl of caithness. In the 1760s the earldom should have gone to David & margaret's son, captain James SINCLAIR H.E.I.C.S. in Reiss, but Broynach's second marriage to his housekeeper Janet EWEN was in question. In the period 1889-1891 Thomas SINCLAIR was going in to bat for the descendants of Donald SINCLAIR the sailor, the younger brother of David SINCLAIR who married Margaret MORE. By then David's heir-male descendants had died out. Thomas fixed the claim to the earldom on the grandson James SINCLAIR of Alexander SINCLAIR who married Elizabeth Sutherland, Alexander the grandfather being the son to the first marriage of James SINCLAIR the chamberlain, son of Donald the sailor.. Another correspondent to the Northern Ensign was "Scrutator" (Rev. John SINCLAIR), who claimed the earldom for himself as a descendant of William SINCLAIR who went to Avoch in Ross-shire, who is also supposed to be a son of Donald the sailor. Thomas and Scrutator went head to head in their letters as to whether James the chamberlain or William was the elder son. James & William had plenty of siblings including "Holy John" the father of Alexander SINCLAIR who married Elizabeth SINCLAIR the parents of Kennedy SINCLAIR. I have heard from a descendant of John, Kennedy's brother.
I need your addresses to send the rest of this stuff (112 pages of a word document!) as an attachment.
"THE BROYNACHS AND THE EARLDOM OF CAITHNESS
CONCLUDING EVIDENCE, WITH PEDIGREE.
TO THE EDITOR OF THE NORTHERN ENSIGN.
"SlR,—It was calculated, by a general analysis, that the birth year of James, the tenth earl of Caithness, Captain Sinclair, H.E.l.C.S., was 1744. New light as to this most important date is to be gained from close attention to the evidence of Alexander Ross and Alexander Macleod in Ratter's proof of 1767. The latter accompanied David, the father of James, part of the way from Thurso to Wick, when he had the rout to go as a recruit to join the British forces in Flanders for the Dutch war. David Sinclair signed on the road four or five miles from Thurso the confession of paternity of James, which Macleod wrote out for the mother, Margaret More, who had followed the departing soldier, the child yet unborn. If the date of this incident can be fixed, the birth of Captain James will be ascertained within a few months."
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prophetess
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 451
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Hi I have a Jean Calder Sinclair and her son Alexander George Sinclair b 1923
jean married James Swanson Rosie
does this make any sense to you have a lot of info on the Rosies
sybil
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ORKNEY
FLETT, CLOUSTON, WHISHART, SCOTT, BRUCE,
ABERDEEN AREA:THOMSON, ROSIE, CHAFFEY, ALLAN,
GLASGOW;STEWART, SPENCE, DOUGLAS, BLACK , KEAYS(KEYS), MITCHELL, JOHNSTON, FLETT, ALLAN, CALLAGHAN, JENKS,FINLAY,SMELLIE,TYSON
MORAYSHIRE: ALLAN, INNES, MCPHAIL, MATHEWS, STEWART, MCKENZIE, MCLEAN, PLOWMAN, MASSON,
IRELAND:DOUGLAS,BLACK,McAULAY,KEAYS,TWEED,MITCHELL,
ENGLAND: JENKS, WALKER,BALDWIN, HURST,PHILLIPS, CHAFFEY, ROBERTSON, ALLAN;JOHNSON, AMEY,Corston,Race
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