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Topic: Frustrated Sutherland Seeks Sutherlands (Read 11110 times)
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ostler
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 346
Great Granddad John Angus Sutherland (1875-1963)
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Me again. 
I'm getting really frustrated looking for a couple of relations of mine. Angus Sutherland born c.1806 and Janet Sutherland (née Sutherland) born c.1816, both in Latheron. They were married 14th April 1843 in Latheron. They had one son as far as I'm aware, William born c.1845, Latheron. In the 1851 census, Angus, Janet and William reside in 4 Badbea, Berriedale, Latheron. If anyone could look up any other censuses to find particularly Angus and Janet, or if there's any other advice you lot could give me, I'd be most appreciative. 
Ta
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All countries/counties
Kinnes, Ostler, Terras (and all variations!!)
Scotland
Caithness: Sutherland and Gunn (Latheron), Mowat (Olrig, Canisbay)
Fife: Fleming, Harley, Small, Laing, Malcolm
Angus/Forfarshire: Small, Laing (Dundee)
Perthshire: Runciman, Whittet, Paul
Midlothian: Dudgeon, Sanderson (Tranent)
England
Gloucestershire: Edkins, Trowton/Troughton
Warwickshire: Bromley, Vickers, Hydon
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JustJean
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 493
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello
If you search on www.ScotlandsPeople.gov.uk in the 1861 census using these terms:
You searched for: Surname: "sutherland"; Use Soundex: Off; Forename: "angus*"; Sex: "Male"; Age From: 50; Age To: 60; Year: 1861; County: "CAITHNESS"; District: "LATHERON";
you'll find there are only 2 results.....and the first one looks like your family based on what you've stated. If you know Angus's occupation from 1851 it would make it more definite.....but this family is living at Badbea so it's is probably them. Not hard to find at all
Best wishes
Jean
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9050
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Hi Ostler
I remember from your previous post trying to track down Angus, Janet and William that it looked like William was their only son on the 1851 Census. From the index, this looks like the family highlighted by Jean. You will have to look at the original image to determine the relationships in the household:
Angus, 55, fisherman, b. Dunbeath
Janet Sutherland, 48, b. Berriedale
Janet Sutherland, 8, b. Berriedale
Margaret Sutherland, 15, Domestic Servant, b. Berriedale
William Sutherland, 15, b. Berriedale
Charlotte Gunn, 76, pauper, b. Berriedale
Address: Badbea, Latheron
Regards.
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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ostler
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 346
Great Granddad John Angus Sutherland (1875-1963)
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Thanks, I'll have to get onto ScotlandsPeople and try it. It says Angus was born in Dunbeath... is that in the parish of Latheron? I'll see if I can look up his birth/baptizm on the site while I'm at it.
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Logged
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All countries/counties
Kinnes, Ostler, Terras (and all variations!!)
Scotland
Caithness: Sutherland and Gunn (Latheron), Mowat (Olrig, Canisbay)
Fife: Fleming, Harley, Small, Laing, Malcolm
Angus/Forfarshire: Small, Laing (Dundee)
Perthshire: Runciman, Whittet, Paul
Midlothian: Dudgeon, Sanderson (Tranent)
England
Gloucestershire: Edkins, Trowton/Troughton
Warwickshire: Bromley, Vickers, Hydon
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9050
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Hi Ostler
Dunbeath is in the parish of Latheron. Have a look at this link for a simple map:
www.georgesons.co.uk/caith.html#map
Regards.
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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ostler
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 346
Great Granddad John Angus Sutherland (1875-1963)
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Just looked up the baptizms, and there are two likely ones that could be my Angus. One is 21/7/1805 in Kildonan to William and Margaret Sutherland. Where's Kildonan?
The other is 29/1/1807 to John and Janet Sutherland in Clyne. Again I don't know where that is. I know it's up in the same area as Latheron, but one of you said Angus was born in Dunbeath. Which is closer to Dunbeath? 
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Logged
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All countries/counties
Kinnes, Ostler, Terras (and all variations!!)
Scotland
Caithness: Sutherland and Gunn (Latheron), Mowat (Olrig, Canisbay)
Fife: Fleming, Harley, Small, Laing, Malcolm
Angus/Forfarshire: Small, Laing (Dundee)
Perthshire: Runciman, Whittet, Paul
Midlothian: Dudgeon, Sanderson (Tranent)
England
Gloucestershire: Edkins, Trowton/Troughton
Warwickshire: Bromley, Vickers, Hydon
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9050
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Hi Ostler
Clyne and Kildonan are both in Sutherland, have a look at this Parish link:
www.scotlandsfamily.com/parish-map-caithness.htm
I had a look at IGI and think that Angus's birth entry doesn't appear to be there. Lots of reasons for this, OPRs haven't survived, birth not registered etc.
Have you found Angus's death cert.? This would confirm parents' names.
Regards.
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9050
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Angus is still alive in 1881. Showing as married but no one else in the household other than him on the night. Still showing as born in Dunbeath, age, 76, Crofter (Formerly Wool Weaver), and still at Badbea.
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9050
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Just realised occupation on the 1881 Census doesn't quite fit his 1861 entry of fisherman. He either changed direction or had died before the 1881 Census and there's a second Angus b. in Dunbeath around the same time 
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9050
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Ostler
The 1881 Census entry seems to be the correct one I believe. Angus died in 1888. He'd been married twice to two Janets - GOW and then SUTHERLAND. Janet Sutherland was William's mother wasn't she (from your other post?).
Parents Neil Sutherland, crofter and fisherman, and mother Janet Bain (spl?). A cousin from Dunbeath reported the death.
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9050
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A possible submitted entry for first marriage:
ANGUS SUTHERLAND Marriages: Spouse: JANET GOW
Marriage: 19 DEC 1833 Latheron, Caithness, Scotland
And a further submitted entry for the second marriage:
ANGUS SUTHERLAND Marriages: Spouse: JANET SUTHERLAND
Marriage: 14 APR 1843 Latheron, Caithness, Scotland
And a futher submitted entry for what looks like Angus's parents:
NIEL SUTHERLAND Marriages: Spouse: JANET BAIN
Marriage: 17 DEC 1802 Latheron, Caithness, Scotland
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9050
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In respect of children to Neil and Janet Bain, there is one actual extract to a father Neil (no mother's name):
SUTHERLAND Male Christening: 13 MAY 1812 Latheron, Caithness, Scotland
Parents: Father: NIEL SUTHERLAND
And a submitted entry for what may be Angus's christening:
ANGUS SUTHERLAND Christening: 08 OCT 1803 Latheron, Caithness, Scotland
Parents: Father NEIL SUTHERLAND
Submitted entries don't show when you search IGI by batch code alone (the source of this info is OPRs), so there may be further entries for siblings that have been submitted by members with father's name only. ..and of course, you can't search on IGI by father's name only. (chicken and egg  )
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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ostler
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 346
Great Granddad John Angus Sutherland (1875-1963)
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You've certainly been busy!  Thanks very much!
Bit confused about some things, though. I looked up the death certificate and the only one I could get was the one of Angus Sutherland dying in 1888, parents were Neil Sutherland and Janet Bain. It also mentions on the certificate that Angus was married to Janet Gow (deceased) and then secondly to Janet Sutherland. I assume Janet was maybe still alive at this time? That'll be another hunt for me.
Angus was definitely married to Janet Sutherland on 14th Apr 1843.
If Angus was christianed in 1803 then I had his year of birth wrong by three years...
Ach, I don't know what to deduce from all of this. 
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Logged
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All countries/counties
Kinnes, Ostler, Terras (and all variations!!)
Scotland
Caithness: Sutherland and Gunn (Latheron), Mowat (Olrig, Canisbay)
Fife: Fleming, Harley, Small, Laing, Malcolm
Angus/Forfarshire: Small, Laing (Dundee)
Perthshire: Runciman, Whittet, Paul
Midlothian: Dudgeon, Sanderson (Tranent)
England
Gloucestershire: Edkins, Trowton/Troughton
Warwickshire: Bromley, Vickers, Hydon
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9050
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Word of caution, the IGI entries with the exception of the male Sutherland birth, are all submitted entries. The data including dates would need verification (not always possible given there doesn't seem to be corresponding OPRs entries!). Also, unlike today, people weren't necessarily exact with their ages, specially in the ages they stated for censuses (2/3 years out wasn't unusual).
Finding Janet, mother of William, DC may help with additional info.
Regards.
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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ostler
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 346
Great Granddad John Angus Sutherland (1875-1963)
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Time for a visit to Register House, methinks. 
Thanks for all your help; I'll let you know how I get on.
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Logged
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All countries/counties
Kinnes, Ostler, Terras (and all variations!!)
Scotland
Caithness: Sutherland and Gunn (Latheron), Mowat (Olrig, Canisbay)
Fife: Fleming, Harley, Small, Laing, Malcolm
Angus/Forfarshire: Small, Laing (Dundee)
Perthshire: Runciman, Whittet, Paul
Midlothian: Dudgeon, Sanderson (Tranent)
England
Gloucestershire: Edkins, Trowton/Troughton
Warwickshire: Bromley, Vickers, Hydon
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