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Topic: 1851/1861/1871 Census Lookup request Please - HARRIES (Read 528 times)
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Koromo
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1803
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Hi
The writing is very clear, and Jane is definitely aged 3. Margaret is written as 27 - and yes, that would make her rather young to have a 13-yr-old child.
Ann (13) has 'nurse' written as her occupation, and Benjamin the brother was an 'apprentice skinner'.
Cheers
Koromo
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Census information is Crown copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk________________________________________________________________ Lewis: Abergavenny | London | NZ | Chilliwack, BC Stallworthy: Bucks | Samoa | NZ | Canada Brothers: Nottingham | Salford | NZ Gronous: Kington | London Darling: Dunbar | Tahiti Keat: Cornwall | NZ Bowles: Deal | NZ Coaney: Bucks Jones: Brecon  |
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Koromo
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1803
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I looked for David Harries in 1841, but no luck. I found his 1851 Llanelly Queen Square neighbours, but there weren't any glovers/skinners, let alone any called Harries/Harris. (NB. Queen Square is called King Square in 1841.) I thought he might be in Abergwili and there is a David Harries there, aged 25, an Ag Lab, living in an outhouse which didn't seem right, somehow!
However, this could be David's parents and siblings:
1841 HO107/1387/1/6/4
New House (Goityeadno?? Pound?), Logincoch, St Peters, Carmarthen, Carmarthenshire
John Harris, 50, glover, yes born in county
Anne Harris, 50, yes
Jane Harris, 20, yes
John Harris, 20, skinner, yes
Anne Harris, 20, yes
Thomas Harris, 15, skinner, yes
Henry Harris, 14, skinner, yes
Sarah Harris, 11, yes
Benjamin Harris, 6, yes
1861 RG9/4113/16/26
King Street, Llanelly, Carmarthenshire
David Harris, head, 50, glover & leather draper, b. St Peters, Carmarthen
Margaret Harris, wife, 35, b. Abergwilly, Carmarthen
Jane Harris, dau, 13, b. Llanelly, Carmarthen
John Harris, son, 9, b. Llanelly
Thomas Harris, son, 7, b. Llanelly
Sarah Harris, dau, 4, b. Llanelly
William Harris, son, 2, b. Llanelly
1861 RG9/4141/64/15
Tanerdy? Road, St Peter, Carmarthen, Carmarthenshire
Benjamin Harris, head, 26, glover & skinner, b. St Peters, Carmarthen
Rachel Harris, wife, 28, b. Abergwili, Carmarthen
And this is interesting, and a bit confusing!!
1871 RG10/5467/31/7
7 Union Building, Llanelly, Carmarthenshire
David Reynolds, head, 29, carpenter, b. Llanelly, Carmarthen
Jane Reynolds, wife, 23, b. Llanelly
Mary S Harries, step-dau, 3, b. Llanelly
David J Reynolds, son, 9 mths, b. Pentre y strad, Glamorgan
I can't find the rest of the Harries family with any certainty. There are individual Harries children dotted around but there's nothing to tie them into David and Margaret's family.
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« Last Edit: Wednesday 03 January 07 10:13 UTC (UK) by Koromo »
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Census information is Crown copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk________________________________________________________________ Lewis: Abergavenny | London | NZ | Chilliwack, BC Stallworthy: Bucks | Samoa | NZ | Canada Brothers: Nottingham | Salford | NZ Gronous: Kington | London Darling: Dunbar | Tahiti Keat: Cornwall | NZ Bowles: Deal | NZ Coaney: Bucks Jones: Brecon |
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c-al-garian
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 92
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Hi Koromo
Many thanks for this, it's been a great help (I think!)
The 1861 census showing Margaret as age 35, makes the 1851 census to be correct, and maybe ANN (dtr) was from a previous marriage (or whatever).
The 1841 census also confirms Benjamin's (and DAVID's) parents as John and Anne, something I didn't know, thank you! Also, in 1841, Jane, John, and Anne as age 20?... triplets I wonder? or 19,20,21? I can check that on FreeBMD. Unfortunate that David and Margaret can't be found in 1841.
Yes, I have the 1871 census copy for David and Jane REYNOLDS, and I'm also confused about the s/dtr. Maybe Jane's child from a previous 'partnership'
Anyway, thanks again, I'll sift through all this to see if it gets less confusing.
Regards
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Jenkins; Griffiths; Reynolds; Simlett; Harries; Evans
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Koromo
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1803
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Hi c-al-garian
I would doubt those 3 children were triplets. The instructions to enumerators of the 1841 census were to round down the ages to the nearest multiple of 5, so Jane, John and Anne could all have been aged between 20 and 24. Even 15-year-old Thomas could really be a 19-year-old.
Under the age of 15, the enumerators were meant to write down the actual age and in most cases they did, but remember that they could only put down what they were given by the family. Often the enumerators didn't understand the instructions themselves and a large percentage of the population were illiterate in those days, too. It's best to regard the ages in the 1841 census as a guide rather than definitive proof!
All John and Anne's children were born before the civil registration of births became mandatory from the September quarter of 1837. You will have to track down the parish records to find the children's baptisms. There are a couple of possibles on the IGI:
Baptised at St Peters, Carmarthen with parents John and Hannah
Batch No 7211907, submitted entries by LDS members
John Harris, 11 Jun 1815
Anne Harris, 10 Nov 1820
Elizabeth Harris, 30 Jan 1825
Note: The names Anne and Hannah were often interchangeable. I have many Annes in the censuses whose birth/baptism name was Hannah.
Good luck! 
Cheers
Koromo
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Census information is Crown copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk________________________________________________________________ Lewis: Abergavenny | London | NZ | Chilliwack, BC Stallworthy: Bucks | Samoa | NZ | Canada Brothers: Nottingham | Salford | NZ Gronous: Kington | London Darling: Dunbar | Tahiti Keat: Cornwall | NZ Bowles: Deal | NZ Coaney: Bucks Jones: Brecon |
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welsh lady
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1453
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c-al-agarian
You were right in assuming Ann was from Davids first marriage .Heres the Baptism
Abergwili Baptisms
Ann Harries-on 03/09/1837
Father-David Harries ,Occupation -Glover
Mother-Elizabeth
Abode-Gategoch.
Only marriage i can find that fits in the area and date (Have Carms marriages on disc)is David Harris to Elizabeth Nelson
on 30/06/1836 in St Peters Carmarthen.
Best Wishes Welsh Lady
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This information is Crown Copyright,from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukAmor/Amer-Bromham Wiltshire,Hertfordshire,Suffolk. Pyett-Suffolk Wolfenden-Cambridgeshire,Huntingdonshire Bird,Nash-Essex. Anderson,-London.Bethnal Green,Shoreditch,Hackney King-,Uxbridge,Shoreditch,Bethnal Green Edwards,Roberts,Lane,Price,Williams-Llanelli. Roberts-Pembroke Dock |
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kob3203
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 93
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My interest in this is via the 1871 Reynolds connection (RG10/5467/31/7, 7 Union Building, Llanelly, Carmarthenshire), the David Reynolds/Jane XXXX marriage, and the curious case of the Mary J Harries stepdaughter.
I'd noticed too that Mary J Harries is shown as David's step-daughter on the 1871 census, so I assumed that she was Jane's daughter from a previous marriage.
If that was correct, then I wasn't sure whether the David Reynolds/Jane XXXX would show her maiden name or her married surname (i.e. the name of her deceased husband), so I did a tentative Birth GRO index search and came up with this, which must be the certificate that you have?
1868, Dec, David Reynolds, Llanelly, 11a, 912
1868, Dec, Jane Harries, Llanelly, 11a, 912
I'm confused because your first post in this topic implies that Harries was her maiden name, and gives no indication that she was a widow when she married David Reynolds.
Puzzled,
Pete
P.S. I guess there's always the possibility that she married somebody with the same surname, Harries, and had a daughter, Mary J Harries, with him before he died? The only possibility I can see is too far away, and probably too early...
1862, Dec, Jane Harries, Haverfordwest, 11a,1124
1862, Dec, William Harries, Haverfordwest, 11a,1124
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Researching Welsh and Irish family history from SE Asia...
Browne: Mallow, Co. Cork (1895-1935) + Cahir, Co. Tipperary (1860-1895) Purtell: Cahir (1860-1895) Fanning: Cashel (to1886)
Corbett: Mitchelstown, Co. Cork (1860-1935) Sweeney: Mitchelstown (1860-1935)
Griffiths: Llanelly, Carmarthenshire (1837-1934) Reynolds: Llanelly (1837-1901)
Williams: Llanelly (1837-1934) Lewis: Ton Pentre, Glamorganshire (1837-1901)
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