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Topic: Johnston - Rea - Kidd etc. (Read 2065 times)
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adee7
RootsChat Veteran
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Posts: 835
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hi,
Does anyone have information about the ancestry of AGNES RAE, born Feb 14, 1798 in Kinnettes? Her father was Alexander.
On Aug 28, 1814, she married WILLIAM JOHNSTON, (born 1786).
She died Oct 31, 1888, 9 Green Street, Forfar
Thanks, Kathleen
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England and Belfast - GOFF, GOUGH, MATHERS, MOXHAM/MOXAM, OSMOND, PHILLIPS, WINDER, WYKES
Scotland - JOHNSTON, DORWARD, KIDD, KYD, RAMSAY, RAE
Canada - DeWOLFE, HALLADAY, HASKINS, HICOCK, JOHNSTON, OLD/OLDS
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adee7
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Posts: 835
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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A continuation --
Children of Agnes Rae are: DAVID, b. 1821; JANE, b. 1825;
WILLIAM, b. Dec 17, 1833; ALEXANDER, b. 1835; JOHN, b. 1838; GEORGE, B. 1841, all in Forfar area.
WILLIAM's first wife, ISABELLA KIDD, b. May 9, 1832, in Chrichen, Dunichen, died three years after they married.
Date of death is Feb 28, 1858.
Their children: MARY JOHNSTON, b. 1855, Parish of Eassie & Nevay, d. Aug 18, 1906, Mount Pleasant, Monifieth. On June 19, 1874, she married David McIntosh, b. 1854
DAVID KIDD JOHNSTON, b. 1856, Templeton, Newtyle. Nothing more so far about him.
WILLIAM JOHNSTON, b. Oct. 30, 1857, Parish of Eassie & Nevay, d. Nov 14, 1925, Colliston, St. Vigeans, Arbroath. Married ELIZABETH RAMSAY DORWARD, May 28, 1886.
My question? Does anyone have information about the ancestry of AGNES RAE, ISABELLA KIDD, and BARBARA RAMSAY, mother of ELIZABETH RAMSAY DORWARD? -- or further information about DAVID KIDD JOHNSTON?
Thanks, Kathleen
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England and Belfast - GOFF, GOUGH, MATHERS, MOXHAM/MOXAM, OSMOND, PHILLIPS, WINDER, WYKES
Scotland - JOHNSTON, DORWARD, KIDD, KYD, RAMSAY, RAE
Canada - DeWOLFE, HALLADAY, HASKINS, HICOCK, JOHNSTON, OLD/OLDS
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MonicaLesl
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Hi Kathleen
Just filling out some of the lines. Firstly, there are possible siblings to Agnes Rae showing on the OPRs. There are a number of entries either with just Alexander Rae as father or Alexander and mother's name Elizabeth Ramsay:
1. MARGARET Christening: 29 JUL 1794 Kinnettles, Angus, Scotland
2. JAMES REA Christening: 16 NOV 1795 Kinnettles, Angus, Scotland
3. AGNES REA Christening: 14 FEB 1798 Kinnettles, Angus, Scotland
4. ELIZABETH REA Birth: 03 MAY 1800/ Christening: 04 MAY 1800 Kinnettles, Angus, Scotland
5. DAVID REA Birth: 02 JUL 1802/ 05 JUL 1802 Kinnettles, Angus, Scotland
6. ALEXANDER RAE Birth: 11 SEP 1804/ Christening: 16 SEP 1804 Kinnettles, Angus, Scotland
7. WILLIAM REA Christening: 10 APR 1807 Kinnettles, Angus, Scotland
8. JEAN REA Christening: 15 JAN 1810 Kinnettles, Angus, Scotland
9. ISABEL REA Christening: 22 MAR 1814 Kinnettles, Angus, Scotland
Is there no information on Agnes's DC in 1888 to confirm her mother's name?
Regards.
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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MonicaLesl
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In respect of Agnes and William Johnston's children, going by the OPR entries to parents with those names, there are probably a few more children than show above following their marriage in 1814. A few early deaths of children would account for the use of the name again for a subsequent child:
1. MARGARET JOHNSON Birth: 04 FEB 1815/ Christening: 06 FEB 1815 Forfar, Angus, Scotland
2. BELL JOHNSON Christening: 07 JAN 1821 Kirriemuir, Angus, Scotland
3. ELIZABETH JOHNSON Birth: 29 DEC 1822/ Christening: 04 JAN 1823 Kinnettles, Angus, Scotland
4. DAVID JOHNSTON Birth: 07 MAR 1825/ Christening: 15 MAR 1825 Forfar, Angus, Scotland
5. ANN JOHNSTON Birth: 27 MAR 1827/ Christening: 01 APR 1827 Forfar, Angus, Scotland
6. DAVID JOHNSON Birth: 21 MAR 1829Christening: 29 MAR 1829 Forfar, Angus, Scotland
7. JAMES ERSKINE JOHNSTON Birth: 24 MAY 1831/ Christening: 05 JUN 1831 Forfar, Angus, Scotland
8. WILLIAM JOHNSTON Birth: 17 SEP 1833/ Christening: 25 SEP 1833 Forfar, Angus, Scotland
9. ALEXR. JOHNSTON Birth: 01 MAR 1836/ Christening: 20 MAR 1836 Forfar, Angus, Scotland
Regards.
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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MonicaLesl
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Posts: 5710
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A few census entries. Looking at the children you have included above, you probably already have the 1841 entry.
1851:
William Johnston 64, H L W (linen), Kirry Mine, Forfarshire
Agnes Johnston 53, b. Kinnettles, Forfarshire
Elizabeth Johnston 28, H L W (linen), daughter, b. Kinnettles
Jean Johnston 26, daughter, b. Forfar
Ann Johnston 24, H L W (linen), daughter, b. Forfar
Agnes Johnston 8, daughter, b. Forfar
Ann Langlands 6, granddaughter, b. Forfar
Eliza R L Wilkie 1, granddaughter, b. Forfar
Address: South Kingsmuir, Forfar
1861:
William Johnston 74, b. Kirriemuir
Agnes Johnston 63
Elisabeth Johnston 36
Jean Johnston 34
Ann Johnston 32
Agnes Johnston 18
Elisa Wilkie 11
Agnes McNicoll 4, granddaughter, b. Forfar
Flora Cardean 9 Mo, granddaughter, b. Eassie
Margaret Cardean 9 Mo, granddaughter, b. Eassie
Address: South Kengsmuir, Forfar
And the 1871, with William Snr probably having died:
Agnes Johnston 73, head
Agnes Johnston 28
Ann Johnston 44
Jane Johnston 46
Agnes McNicoll 14
Margaret Cardean 10
Address: 10 Village Of Loar, Forfar
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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moscan
RootsChat Aristocrat
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Posts: 1307
The next generation
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While there is no mention on the OPR for Agnes of a mother there is one listed for the mother of David christened 5 July 1802 (Born 2nd July 1802) her name is Elizabeth Ramsey but I couldn't find a marriage of Alexander and Elizabeth
Best wishes
Mo
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All census look up transcriptions are Crown Copyright
Researching: - Freear, Walker, Aston, Scanlan, Courtney, Lowth, O’Sulivan, McDonnell, Condon, McMahon, McKay, Brock, Gourlay, Busby
Locations: - March in Cambridgeshire, Banbury in Oxfordshire, Mileham in Norfolk, Worcester, Evesham, Claines in Worcestershire, Birmingham. Dublin, Cork, Fermanagh in Ireland. Glasgow, Stirling in Scotland
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
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Posts: 5710
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Did William Johnston b. 1833 remarry the Isabella Anderson who shows in his household in 1861?:
WILLIAM JOHNSTON Marriages: Spouse: ISABELLA ANDERSON
Marriage: 07 DEC 1861 Airlie, Angus, Scotland
1861
William Johnston 27, ploughman, b. Forfar
Isabella Anderson 18, Domestic Servant & Ag Lab, b. Kirriemuir
Mary S Johnston 7, b. Forfar
David R Johnston 5, b. Newtyle
William Johnston 3, b. Eassie
Address: Newton West Cottages, Airlie, Angus
1871
William Johnston 36, farm servant, b. Forfar
Isabella Johnston 28, b. Kirriemuir
George A Johnston 8
James Johnston 4
Isabella Johnston 3
Agnes Johnston 7 Mo
George Leighton 11 Mo, nephew
Address: Mains Cottar House, Kinnettles, Angus
I can see a few possible entries in 1871 for children Mary, David and William working as farm servants in the county.
Regards.
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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adee7
RootsChat Veteran
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Posts: 835
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hi Monica,
Thanks for the information. I am working from a document prepared by a cousin who concentrated mostly on his line of the very large family.
Yes, William married Isabella Anderson and had a large family with her.
As is often the case, many of the women's names etc are missing, so I am determined to find them.
Please tell me what the OPRs are?
Regards, Kathleen
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England and Belfast - GOFF, GOUGH, MATHERS, MOXHAM/MOXAM, OSMOND, PHILLIPS, WINDER, WYKES
Scotland - JOHNSTON, DORWARD, KIDD, KYD, RAMSAY, RAE
Canada - DeWOLFE, HALLADAY, HASKINS, HICOCK, JOHNSTON, OLD/OLDS
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moscan
RootsChat Aristocrat
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Posts: 1307
The next generation
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OPRS are the old (Pre 1855) parish records, they are available on Scotlandspeople which is a pay per view website where the OPRs and also the Birth Marriage and Death certs are viewable.
For £6 for 30 credits you may view the images. One image is 5 Credits.
Best wishes
Mo
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Logged
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All census look up transcriptions are Crown Copyright
Researching: - Freear, Walker, Aston, Scanlan, Courtney, Lowth, O’Sulivan, McDonnell, Condon, McMahon, McKay, Brock, Gourlay, Busby
Locations: - March in Cambridgeshire, Banbury in Oxfordshire, Mileham in Norfolk, Worcester, Evesham, Claines in Worcestershire, Birmingham. Dublin, Cork, Fermanagh in Ireland. Glasgow, Stirling in Scotland
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
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Posts: 5710
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Hi Kathleen
Excuse the dribs and drabs on the posts, I am just posting section by section as I find info. It also can help separate family lines for clarity.
The OPRs stand for the Old Parish Register, the main source of birth and marrige record before the start of official registration in Scotland in 1855. Have a look at this link here on RootsChat from Pam which details this area amongst other resources when researching in Scotland: www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,24468.0.html
A possibility for David Johnstone in the 1891 census:
David Johnston 34, gardener, b. Newtyle
Elizabeth Johnston 27, b. Cortachy, Forfarshire
Jane H Johnston 1, Airlie, Forfarshire
Address: Gardyne, Kirkden, Angus
A possible marriage entry on Scotlands People which will hopefully let you confirm whether this is the son of Willam and Isabella Kidd:
1887 JOHNSTON DAVID OGILVY ELIZABETH CORTACHY AND CLOVA /ANGUS 278/00 0003
Regards.
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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adee7
RootsChat Veteran
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Posts: 835
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Thanks for all of this, Monica.
Regards, Kathleen
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England and Belfast - GOFF, GOUGH, MATHERS, MOXHAM/MOXAM, OSMOND, PHILLIPS, WINDER, WYKES
Scotland - JOHNSTON, DORWARD, KIDD, KYD, RAMSAY, RAE
Canada - DeWOLFE, HALLADAY, HASKINS, HICOCK, JOHNSTON, OLD/OLDS
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adee7
RootsChat Veteran
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Posts: 835
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hi Monica,
An additional note -- Two of William Johnston and Isabella Anderson's sons are those mentioned in my post re Johnston Stores Ltd.
Regards, Kathleen
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England and Belfast - GOFF, GOUGH, MATHERS, MOXHAM/MOXAM, OSMOND, PHILLIPS, WINDER, WYKES
Scotland - JOHNSTON, DORWARD, KIDD, KYD, RAMSAY, RAE
Canada - DeWOLFE, HALLADAY, HASKINS, HICOCK, JOHNSTON, OLD/OLDS
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
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Posts: 5710
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Yes, I've been following that post - fascinating history!
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
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Posts: 5710
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This looks like Isabella Kidd's birth entry:
ISOBEL KYD Birth: 09 MAY 1832/ Christening: 13 MAY 1832 Dunnichen, Angus, Scotland. Parents: Father: JAMES KYD Mother: MARY SUTTIE
Isabella's mother's name explains William and Isabella's first born's name including the middle name 'S' that shows in the 1861 census.
However, only Isabella's entry is showing, can't as yet find any siblings or more importantly, entries in the 1841/51 censuses. There's also no death entry showing for a Mary Suttie other name Kydd (with wildcards to pick up on spelling variants) after 1855 and the start of official reg.
Isabella's marriage cert will show whether her parents were still alive at the time of her marriage:
1855 JOHNSTONWILLIAM KIDD ISABELLA FORFAR LANDWARD /ANGUS 288/02 0001
Kathleen, you are fortunate, the registration is on 5 Jan 1855 (from IGI), just pipped into the start of official reg 
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
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Posts: 5710
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Kathleen
Totally stuck on Isabella's line...so curiosity got the better of me  and I've had a quick look at her marriage cert. Sadly, and probably indicative of her early life, she didn't know the exact date of her birth or the names of her parents. The only clues to her background are the names of two witnesses to the marriage a Charles (I think, writing is faint) and James Kydd.
At least you have confirmation of her parents' names from the OPR entry for the registration of her birth and christening. If you decide to view the image on SP of the OPR entry, you might be lucky and depending what is on it, find out a bit more about James and Mary Suttie.
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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