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Topic: ARMSTRONGS of Ravensden (Read 5102 times)
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wdurham
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Posts: 196
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Hello All,
Now that the Ravensden link is sorted, you may be interested in the Elstow branchwhich I did some work on last year, as follows:
A Samuel Armstrong born about 1750's wed Sarah. One of their girls Edy/Edith b 1785 c1788 in Elstow wed Samuel Busby on 1st Mar 1806, died Houghton C in 1841
Edith had an illeg son (by 1 month) called Samuel Busby Armstrong 16th Feb 1806 in Elstow. Samuel wed Ann Page of Goldington - a main Armstrong centre, in 1827. They had 10 kids starting with Ann in 1827, but they had dropped the Armstrong surname by then.
On 19th Apr 1827 an Overseers of the Poor in Houghton C asked for Samuel Busby alias Armstrong & wife Ann to be moved to Wilshamstead. Wilshamstead was crossed out & Elstow inserted.
The 1861c for Haynes shows Ann Busby (Armstrong) living as a servant with William & Hannah Armstrong ( Will & Hannah are fromthe Wilstead line) I believe theyt took her in as she was family.
Samuel Busby who wed Edy was probably the son of Beecher Busby & wife Christian (nee Goodman) who wed in 1765 at Bedford St Mary. Samuel was baptised at...Thurleigh! The date was 15th May 1774. Beecher wed again in Oct at Thurl to a Mary Wakeman.
As you see from above, all branches seem cclosely linked.
Anyway, I'll leave it for your perusal,
Cheers,
Bob
Bob- I've been having a look at these Busbys, to see if there are any clues as to the origins of Samuel Armstrong and Sarah.
I think the Thurleigh Busby's are a different family. From the IGI:
A William Busby married Ann Cudd in 1723 in Thurleigh. They appear to have had at least two sons: William b 1725 and Beecher b 1739. There is a burial for a William in 1751 but no age given.
William Jnr married Elizabeth Marcey in 1749 and they had 7 children between 1750 and 1761, which included two attempts at a Henry. There is a burial for a William in Thurleigh in 1791, but no age given.
Beecher married Mary Wakeham in 1774 in Thurleigh and they had at least one son, Samuel b 1774. Beecher died in 1814 aged 76.
Samuel married Elizabeth Darlow in 1799, and they had at least two sons: Beecher b 1800 and John b 1802. There is a burial for a Samuel in Thurleigh in 1803, but no age given.
Beecher Jnr can be found in 1841 in Colmworth with wife Elizabeth and eldest son Samuel aged 15, plus 5 others. John seems to have remained in Thurleigh, though I haven't investigated fully.
None of this helps find out who the Samuel Busby was who married Edith in Elstow in 1806, but at least it seems to show who he WASN'T! The children of Samuel and Edith were all born in Houghton Conquest, and tracking forward shows that several of them stayed there. Samuel and Edith were both buried in HC in 1841 and 1868 respectively.
The fly in the ointment is the nine-week old Edith Armstrong in 1822, born to and buried by Elizabeth Armstrong in Houghton Conquest. I wonder if Samuel Busby and Edith also produced a daughter as well as a son before they got married? I can't see any other source for an Armstrong female in Houghton Conquest at that particular time, particularly one who would name her daughter Edith....she would have been born in Elstow, but moved to HC with Edith and Samuel after the marriage.
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Willson & Pell in Faversham, Egerton, Folkestone in Kent
Cornhill in Kent, Devon and Wokingham, Berks
Cadmans & Kings in Isleham, Cambs
Swan, Gregory, Smith & Mingay in the Burrough Green/Westley area of Cambs
Armstrong & Chandler in Bedford
Abbott/Abbit in Witham, Essex
Davies/Davis in Islington & Hackney
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wdurham
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Found - the first documented link between the "posh" Armstrongs of Ampthill and Houghton Conquest and our branch:
http://tinyurl.com/26xcm8
The John Armstrong at the beginning of the references is son and heir of Charles, who was son of Thomas and Frances Thompson. Thomas was allegedly born in Ireland and settled in Ampthill on his retirement from the Army in 1717. He was a JP - references all over the place on BLARS. His wife Frances was daughter of Lord Haversham and granddaughter of the Earl of Anglesey.
John Armstrong must have been at least 21 to be entering into leases, so born before 1767. This puts him in the right age-group to be a son of Charles - but I cannot find a John born to Charles. Charles' children with Althamia Priaulx were born between 1749-1752 in Steppingly. The Ancestry trees say he had a first wife named Elizabeth, with whom he had one son, Thomas, but I can't find him either!
The key item is right at the end - John Armstrong's will. However, this can't be the John mentioned in the first line - he must be the next generation. He is definitely from that family - the Althamiah pegs him firmly to the "posh" lot:
"Recites (9) - will of John Armstrong 7 June 1841
- To daughters Mary Ann Armstrong and Althamiah Armstrong 400 each on attaining 21 years, and if one should die her share to go to the other, if both should die the legacies should lapse for the benefit of the owner of the estates,
- To friends Charles Armstrong, farmer, of Wootton and William Armstrong, farmer, of Hawnes, his personal estate and messuages, tenements and lands, on trust to provide from them 52 a year to wife Mary Armstrong, with power of sale.
Executors: Charles, William and Mary Armstrong as above, will pro 19 June 1843 at Bedford."
I have found his death on FreeBMD, qe Jun 1843, and two daughters on the IGI baptised in 1827 and 1830 respectively. There seems likely to have been a son John in 1832 and a Sarah Augusta in 1835 as well. Though with everything left in trust for his wife and daughters, there couldn't have been a son surviving by 1841, but I can't find a likely burial. Sarah Augusta died qe Sept 1838.
It's interesting because it is the first visible contact between the Ampthill family and ours.
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Willson & Pell in Faversham, Egerton, Folkestone in Kent
Cornhill in Kent, Devon and Wokingham, Berks
Cadmans & Kings in Isleham, Cambs
Swan, Gregory, Smith & Mingay in the Burrough Green/Westley area of Cambs
Armstrong & Chandler in Bedford
Abbott/Abbit in Witham, Essex
Davies/Davis in Islington & Hackney
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castlebob
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello Wendy,
Good work.
I was in contact with a convenor for the Irish Armstrongs about 6 years ago who had masses of info on the "Clan" there. The Stonestown Armstrongs link directly to the Mangerton stronghold, see Burke's Landed Irish Gentry. Something I did try to work on that was another coincidence was that Charles Armstrong wed Althamia Priaulx of Bedford in 1747. In Ireland, Co Offaly (formerly King's Co), there are several Armstrong/Priaulx links. EG John Armstrong Priaulx is mentioned several times in the mid-1800's in Cary House, Kings Co. The rarity of the Priaulx surname seemed to me to be quite a noticeable coincidence.
I did lots of research into the famous Andrew Armstrong (1576-1671), as some old notes claimed to link us with this branch. However, every Armstrong you meet seems to try to make this link! I did holiday in the Canonbie/Newcastleton region in the 1980 to try & confirm a link, but with no success.
Two areas I thought may prove interesting: The Beds Regt were occasionally in Ireland, plus many Lowland Scots came south in the Covenanter's Army.
Anyway, all these extra links like yours start to build up into a quite formidable case. The downside would seem to be that the Riseley A's were labourers, & Stonestown, Gallen & Mangerton were of landed stock. Mind you, George Armstrong (the wealthy farmer) lived amongst his more humble cousins in Goldington, so it does happen.
Anyway, I'll dig out some more old papers.
Thanks,
Bob
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Armstrongs of Bedfordshire, England & Canonbie ,Scotland
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quest40
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Posts: 41
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello everyone,
Well there's certainly some interesting info in this thread! My husband is connected to Thomas Armstrong and Phoebe Wisson, through their son Thomas born c.1796 married to Mary, then via their son Isaac born 1817 at Upprer Gravenhurst. My husband's grandmother was Lizzie Armstrong, daughter of Isaac and his second wife Martha Anderson. I suspect I have already been in contact with castlebob through the Bedfordshire family history society.
Despite wading through all the posts, I can't quite work out who else is actually connected to this family!
Ann
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Conquest, Crowsley, Giovannelli, Kingham, Marshall, Sewell, Wilson
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bedfordshire boy
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To help narrow it down, I'm NOT connected!
David
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukBeds: Cople: Luke/Spencer Everton: Hale Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey Potton: Merrill Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt Hunts: Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn Cambs: Bourn: Bowd Eltisley: Medlock Graveley: Ford/Revell |
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wdurham
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Hi, Ann - welcome to the Armstrong-fest!
There are plenty of them about, all over Bedfordshire.
However, thus far, as Bob has said, we have not been able to prove any link at all between the Armstrongs that are mainly discussed on this thread and Thomas and Phoebe and their family of Upper Gravenhurst.
Very many researchers have picked up on an incorrect reference on the IGI and various other family trees on the net - i.e. that William Armstrong who fathered a family in Thurleigh from his second marriage to Ann Gammons - to whom most of us here ARE related in one way or another - was the son of Thomas and Phoebe.
Sadly he wasn't. That William almost certainly died as a teenager, and the real William Armstrong of Thurleigh was probably an unbaptised son of John and Sarah of Ravensden.
It's good to come across a descendant of Thomas and Phoebe - have you managed to unearth any information prior to their marriage?
A number of Armstrongs seem to have arrived in various Bedfordshire villages at about the same time int he late 1780s - and I suspect that they MAY be related, if only because they all named a daughter (usually their eldest) Edith. This COULD suggest that they were all children of John Armstrong and Edith Grange, who ended up living (and both died) in Maulden and were probably "on the parish". There are only two recorded children of theirs - William and John. as mentioned by Bob just now. But baptisms cost money - it's possible that there were more children.
It just seems so much of a coincidence that Samuel in Elstow, Thomas in Upper Gravenhurst and John in Ravensden, all had daughters named Edith.....
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Willson & Pell in Faversham, Egerton, Folkestone in Kent
Cornhill in Kent, Devon and Wokingham, Berks
Cadmans & Kings in Isleham, Cambs
Swan, Gregory, Smith & Mingay in the Burrough Green/Westley area of Cambs
Armstrong & Chandler in Bedford
Abbott/Abbit in Witham, Essex
Davies/Davis in Islington & Hackney
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castlebob
RootsChat Senior
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Posts: 334
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello All,
I'm based on the South Coast, so unable to attend BFHS meetings, sadly. Some info that may be of interest re Armstrongs: (I'd welcome your input)
I read that Queen Elizabeth sent Francis Russell, 2nd Earl of Bedford, to the Borders in 1563 as a Warden of the March in an effort to help keep the peace. Sir Walter Scott's poem "The Raid of the Reidswire" names Russell & the Armstrongs in the 'dispute'.
I wonder if Russell offered the Armstrongs an escape route to Beds? In 1586, a Simon Armstrong fathered a child Elizabeth in Woburn (seat of the Dukes). One of the last Lairds of Mangerton was Simon Armstrong, wife Elizabeth Forster. There is a betrothal stone at Mangerton with their initials.
Also, my DNA shows links to Scottish Armstrongs approx in the 1400's.
Could the Russell's be the link?
Cheers,
Bob Armstrong
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Armstrongs of Bedfordshire, England & Canonbie ,Scotland
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quest40
RootsChat Extra
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Posts: 41
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello everyone,
As was said, certainly loads of Armstrongs! Unfortunately, I have not been able to find anything before Thomas and Phoebe's marriage - in fact it was only through other people's research that I found out about them!
I see among my notes that their first child, baptised in 1789 was called Edith, so as Bob says, a similar naming pattern.
Ann
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Conquest, Crowsley, Giovannelli, Kingham, Marshall, Sewell, Wilson
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bedfordshire boy
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Hi Bob
That's an interesting theory, but I'm not sure if it could ever be proved!
A few comments
This is a well documented family, so I'd have thought that a move south would have been noted.
The Simon Armstrong 9th and penultimate Laird of Mangerton rebuilt Mangerton Castle in 1583 and died the same year, three years before the birth of Elizabeth Armstrong at Woburn, so he couldn't have been the Simon in Woburn. But there were a number of Simons in the family, so another member might have moved south.
Francis Russell died in 1585, the year before Elizabeth was born, and 18 years after he returned to London from the Borders. It seems a bit of a gap - 20 years - from when he moved back to London to the birth in Woburn, for there to have been a connection between the Earl and Simon Armstrong
I can't see a burial of Simon or Elizabeth in Beds, or indeed of any Armstrong at Woburn.
A Henry Armstrong was reproducing in Leighton Buzzard in 1613
Thomas Armstrongs were buried at Tingrith and Willington in 1630 and 1652, so it appears that more than one Armstrong turned up in Beds.
I prefer working backwards in time!
Regards
David
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukBeds: Cople: Luke/Spencer Everton: Hale Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey Potton: Merrill Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt Hunts: Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn Cambs: Bourn: Bowd Eltisley: Medlock Graveley: Ford/Revell |
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castlebob
RootsChat Senior
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Posts: 334
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Thanks David for the input & extra ( & expert) Beds knowledge.
As you say, it's just conjecture, but I have a list of coincidences, plus vague family connections to some Scots-Irish in Beds, (see Stonestown, Ireland ), plus an early Armstrong who wed Christian Fiddes in Wilstead. (The only girl I've found of the name was from Jedburgh, & the age fits).
Unfortunately, none of this is proof positive, but my DNA links to some people from the Borders in the 1400's (+/-) is useful.
If you uncover anything in your researching travels, I'd welcome any input.
Cheers,
Bob
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Armstrongs of Bedfordshire, England & Canonbie ,Scotland
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bedfordshire boy
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Just came across this on A2a which you may have and which may mean nothing at all
Moravian Church, Bedfordshire
CONGREGATION BIOGRAPHIES
Brief biographies of people connected with the Bedford Congregation
FILE - Nathaniel Armstrong, born Hayfeild in Derbyshire, 23 Feb 1744 - ref. MO616
David
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukBeds: Cople: Luke/Spencer Everton: Hale Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey Potton: Merrill Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt Hunts: Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn Cambs: Bourn: Bowd Eltisley: Medlock Graveley: Ford/Revell |
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