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Topic: WILDMAN/TYLER (Read 2210 times)
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shirle
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Can anyone explain to me why the Wildman's changed their names to Tyler in the 1861 Census, and does anyone have any information on James Wildman, father of Thomas.
Marriage at Riseley Parish Church - pg27 No53
Thomas Wildman Full age Bachelor Labourer Riseley James Labourer to
Temperance Symants Full age Spinster Riseley Samuel Labourer
1851 - HO107; 1751; 59; pg2 Riseley
Thomas Wyman, 32, Radwell, Beds
Temperance " 32, Riseley, Beds
Alfred " 2, Riseley, Beds
1861 - RG9; 985; 19; pg2 Riseley
Thomas Tylor, 42, Bletsoe, Beds
Temperance", 42, Riseley, Beds
Alfred ", 12, Riseley, Beds
William ", 7, Riseley, Beds
Samuel ", 2, Riseley, Beds
1871 - RG10; 1537; 6; pg4 - 22 High Street, Riseley
Thomas Wildman, 52, Bletsoff, Beds
Temperance " 52, Riseley, Beds
Frederic " 22, Riseley, Beds
Bela " 20, Riseley, Beds
William " 19, Riseley, Beds
Samuel " 12, Riseley, Beds
Susan " 9, Riseley, Beds
Can't find Bela in 1861 Census.
No Alfred in 1871 Census but Frederic is same age as Alfred. I think they are the same person. Could find no other Census for Frederic or a Death for Frederic.
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« Last Edit: Tuesday 28 August 07 15:33 BST (UK) by Rick »
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bedfordshire boy
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It might be nothing more sinister than an enumeration error
but
there is a baptism on the IGI (extracted so reliable) on 20 Apr 1772 at Riseley of Martha Wildman or Tyler daughter of Edward Wildman or Tyler, so it appears as though there is some sort of precedent (there are 4 other such entries in Riseley, and a number of marriages). Perhaps they used both surnames.
Also in the BVRI there are a number children of Thomas and Temperance who were baptised in Riseley as "Wildman or Tyler"
Have you found the baptism of Thomas? Bletsoe baptisms/marriages post 1812 are not on the IGI. Another "but" - there is a Thomas Wildman baptised on 20 Sept 1818 at Harpur St Wesleyan Methodist in Bedford, son of James and Catherine. There's a marriage on 4 Jun 1817 of James Wildman and Catherine Bell at Felmersham which is less than a mile west of Radwell, which is a mile west of Bletsoe. Pure speculation of course, but a Catherine Wildman age 46 was buried at Bletsoe on 5 April 1839. Thomas is the only child of James and Catherine on the IGI - if they were non-conformist it's possible they moved to a different church, and subsequent children were not baptised
In 1841 HO107/8/2 folio 5A
Church St, Bletsoe
James Whildman (indexed as Thoman) 50 ag lab born in county,
living in same house as 6 Whites including Thomas & Jane 40
Living in Bletsoe in 1851 HO107/1751 folio 143B
Jane White head W(id) or U(unm) 50 pauper/lacemaker b Sharnbrook
James Wildman lodger widower 64 ag lab b Riseley
George Wildman lodger marr 30 ag lab b Bletsoe
Ann Wildman lodger marr 36 lacemaker b Bletsoe
In 1861
Bletsoe
George Wildman head marr 40 ag lab b Bletsoe
Ann Wildman wife 46 b Bletsoe
William 9, Joseph 6; John 5, sons all b Bletsoe
James Wildman lodger widower 75 parish labourer b Riseley
See a very long thread on this family
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,192610.0.html
- being a contrary sort of person I do not necessarily agree, at least not without further research, that James has a connection to Ravensden. I'm sure when JP reads this he'll chip in with further thoughts!
Regards
David
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukBeds: Cople: Luke/Spencer Everton: Hale Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey Potton: Merrill Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt Hunts: Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn Cambs: Bourn: Bowd Eltisley: Medlock Graveley: Ford/Revell |
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bedfordshire boy
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You know what it's like John - you keep finding an extra snippet, and then you find an enormous archived thread! But, yes, I had finished. Thought you were at work anyway which is why I kept fine tuning my post while I thought that no-one was looking!
It seems from censuses as though George was the son of James, and therefore a younger brother of Thomas - have you found any confirmation that he and Mary were children of James and Catherine? That at least would go a long way to tieing in that Felmersham marriage to Thomas
David
I know, now I'm altering this post as well!
This 37 degree sun is addling my brain this afternoon
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukBeds: Cople: Luke/Spencer Everton: Hale Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey Potton: Merrill Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt Hunts: Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn Cambs: Bourn: Bowd Eltisley: Medlock Graveley: Ford/Revell |
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johnP-bedford
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Grand baby Jack 21/08/2008
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The Wildman alias Tyler scenario is not only in Riseley, but in neighbouring Thurleigh. From both these parishes, records have baptisms, marriages & burials in these names & many variants ; WILEMAN, WILLEMAN, WILLMAN, TILER, TILUR; going back to 1649. Also sometimes reverting to just the one name Tyler or Wildman & then reappearing with the alias. This cannot be just the transcriber saying this could either be 'Wildman' or 'Tyler' but that the family name was stated with the associated alias.There are cases of a marriage of a Wildman alias Tyler, followed by a burial of the man, followed by a remarriage of the widow which still states Wildman alias Tyler - surely she would have made her bloody mind up by now. I digress !
I did find a marriage in 1812 of a William Wildman alias Tyler of Bletsoe, marrying Susan Fairey - I hope Marlene/Dale may make a comment later when the sun wakes up NZ.
John P
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukPartridge - North Beds; Peterborough Bishop - Bedford; Hunts, Hemingford Grey Allen - Hunts, Hemingford Abbotts Clement - Croydon ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
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johnP-bedford
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Grand baby Jack 21/08/2008
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David.
In reply to your question, I think I must have seen the Bletsoe PR at the Archives as I've recorded dates in my extensive family tree. I would not have recorded them otherwise, plus I've found an email sent to Marlene in Nov 2006
I have a Mary W b 1830 who married Joseph Partridge & per the 1850 marriage cert entry for Joseph Partridge & Mary Wildman her father is named as James. Mary Wildman chr 10/Oct/1830 Bletsoe, daughter of James & Catherine ( ? Bell). On same day were chr Ann Wildman & Elizabeth Wildman. Previously found chr of George Wildman, son of James & Catherine on 09/JUN/1821
What I haven't seen is the baptism in Bedford of Thomas 1818. Do the Archives have methodist records ?
(just in case you've already read this - this was added later !  )
at the marriage of William Fairey & Mary Chambers, both of Radweill, on 28/02/1813 at Felmersham; the witnesses were Thomas Bell & Catherine Bell. Marlene ? yes Boycie,,, is this William the brother to Susannah ?
Regardez John
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukPartridge - North Beds; Peterborough Bishop - Bedford; Hunts, Hemingford Grey Allen - Hunts, Hemingford Abbotts Clement - Croydon ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- |
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bedfordshire boy
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Hi John
There's a transcript of Bedford Harpur St Methodist available from BLARS on fiche, so they probably have them on film.
It's all coming together but Thomas's birth/baptism would be useful - John and Catherine of Bletsoe would be a bonus!
I agree with you that Wildman/Tyler is not a transcription problem. Wildman alias Tyler would probably be better
David
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukBeds: Cople: Luke/Spencer Everton: Hale Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey Potton: Merrill Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt Hunts: Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn Cambs: Bourn: Bowd Eltisley: Medlock Graveley: Ford/Revell |
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shirle
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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As you can see I am getting better at this however I forgot to add that 1841 Census I have a possible for Thomas at Riseley, District 2, Page 2
Thomas Tyler 20 Ag Labourer Riseley born in country
I did think James could be a possible brother to Thomas
Shirley
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shirle
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Thanks David
I have found no baptism of Thomas although my resources are very limited as I live in Australia. I have Thomas born 1819, using the census information as he seems to be consistant with his age, just not where he is born or his surname. Your James Wildman and Catherine Bell seem to fit in, an her early death would explain why she is not in the 1841 census
Shirley
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Dale
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Kia Ora All
Delighted to see the Beds Boy again raising his head and better make the most of it as a certain World Cup is about to start & we'll all be fighting cat & dog!
Thanks for the alert JP & nice to see you're continuing the battle Shirle!
I have a copy of the marriage entry at Riseley of Susannah Fair(e)y to William Wildman alias Tyler.
I have been told that the surname can be interpreted as an early bastardy where the family did not want either name to be lost because of possible inheritance claims! Me, I know nothing, cos it seems everyone just claims domestic purposes benefits these days!
Now William & Susannah (bap 1791 Riseley) married 13 October 1812 at Riseley and had
Esther 18 April 1813 bap Riseley Wildman or Tyler (!!)
George 22 June 1815 bap Riseley ***
Sarah bap 26 November 1815 Riseley (Wildman !) died 1 Jan 1822 or at least was buried then!
*** is attributed to parents William & Susannah on the BVRI but doesn't show on the LDS online site!
BUT in 1841 George is living next door to Esther (sister) and her husband Isaac Flavell who married in Blestoe 16 October 1832.
In 1841 William & Susannah had an 11 year old daughter (?) living with them in Riseley - I cannot find a baptism for her anywhere.
Susannah was buried 24 May and William 4 June 1848 at Riseley.
Mary disppears from the radar - so was she living with W & S in 1841 for some reason? Susannah was a midwife so maybe adopted her?
I'm convinced of a connection to JPs Mary and a connection to Bletsoe and surprised that W & S had so few children and also suspect that some of the other children baptised to a W & S may be theirs but in another village!
The Wyman/Whyment pops up all over the place as boarders with Fairey descendants or living next door over decades but I have seen it as a separate name from the Wildman clan!
Go on shoot holes in my Fairy tree!
Anyone got the BVRI mine has holes in it 
Regards
Marlene
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HUNTS: Fairy, Ding, Scotney, Swinton, Burgess, Brace
BEDS: Farey, Fairy, Young, Rootham, Gell, Wildman, Cooper. Deighton, Flavel.
NORTHANTS: Hills, Mobbs, Twelftrees,
DERBY: Fairey,
LONDON: Fairey, Fairy, Burgess, Williams, Tanser, Picknell, Vinall, Plampin, Mullins, Day, Folwell, Bamfield, Brown
WATFORD HERTS; Burgess, Williams
WARKS: Fairy, Ward, Stephens, Reeves, Hodgkiss, Byrne, Hunt, Edgeworth, Harper, Dudley,
WORCS: Callow, Lowe
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bedfordshire boy
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Hi Marlene
I've not been away! Other than for the odd week either when I've been visiting relatives, or when UK citizens have looked to escape the rain and have descended on me! I think this World Cup we're going to give one of the other teams a chance to win the cup.
I have the BVRI if you need anything specific checked - mine have got holes in too, but just a circular one in the middle which I understand to be deliberate
All the best
David
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukBeds: Cople: Luke/Spencer Everton: Hale Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey Potton: Merrill Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt Hunts: Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn Cambs: Bourn: Bowd Eltisley: Medlock Graveley: Ford/Revell |
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Dale
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Tena Koe David!
I Knew you were around from another alias (dirty word) on another site!
If you wouldn't mind could you double check George circa 1815 and whether there is a baptism for a Mary circa 1830 just so there is a record here for JP & Shirle?
My BVRI has been thrashed I'm afraid & the Fair(e)y section has deeper grooves than usual! Funny I have the hole in the middle too!
The All Blacks have flown out & are supposedly heading for Corsica - no idea why!
Don't forget to go to Paris and see our rugby ball in front of the Eyeful Tower!
Cheers
The Kiwi Kid
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HUNTS: Fairy, Ding, Scotney, Swinton, Burgess, Brace
BEDS: Farey, Fairy, Young, Rootham, Gell, Wildman, Cooper. Deighton, Flavel.
NORTHANTS: Hills, Mobbs, Twelftrees,
DERBY: Fairey,
LONDON: Fairey, Fairy, Burgess, Williams, Tanser, Picknell, Vinall, Plampin, Mullins, Day, Folwell, Bamfield, Brown
WATFORD HERTS; Burgess, Williams
WARKS: Fairy, Ward, Stephens, Reeves, Hodgkiss, Byrne, Hunt, Edgeworth, Harper, Dudley,
WORCS: Callow, Lowe
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bedfordshire boy
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Hi Marlene
This is my only alias! The other boards are me - "David" with a giveaway email if you know I live in Carcassonne!
The All Blacks have gone to Corsica because there are loads of sheep there (make good cheese - sheep milk, not all-black milk!) and it makes them feel at home. I wouldn't go to Paris to see an English rugby ball, let alone a kiwi one (in fact I wouldn't even cross the road to see either!)
The BVRI baptisms are as you give for Esther, George and Sarah - George must have been a late baptism as his birth must have been Dec 1814 latest.
There are no Mary Wildman or Mary Tyler baptised 1830. Marys/Marias baptised in Riseley 1829-31 (all were 1829 or 1830) were Baker/Cooper/Dickens/Dennis/Langley/Sharman. I can see Baker, Cooper, Dennis and Langley in 1841 so if she was born in Riseley she may have been one of the other two. Do either of the names ring a Wildman bell?
Regards
David
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukBeds: Cople: Luke/Spencer Everton: Hale Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey Potton: Merrill Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt Hunts: Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn Cambs: Bourn: Bowd Eltisley: Medlock Graveley: Ford/Revell |
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Dale
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Ok Fellas this is my beauty sleep time & ye gods it's needed!
JP- I reckon she IS the Mary who is with William & Susannah in 1841 - maybe it was school hols 
If she belonged to W & S she was a (very) late baby commonly called an afterthought?
Had anything dramatic happened to James & Catherine that she might have been sent to the Aunt & Uncle nearby? I understand Bletsoe is only a couple of miles from Riseley?
David, firstly I suppose you are a round ball man and then I have to say our sheep population has dwindled considerably as Dairy products are making us a mint at present!
So from now on it has to be cow jokes! And we already know all the ones about their flatulence causing air pollution!
A very tired Kiwi is now taking the body to the spa & byes!
Ka kite ano
See ya tomorrow! Or later today!
Marlene
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HUNTS: Fairy, Ding, Scotney, Swinton, Burgess, Brace
BEDS: Farey, Fairy, Young, Rootham, Gell, Wildman, Cooper. Deighton, Flavel.
NORTHANTS: Hills, Mobbs, Twelftrees,
DERBY: Fairey,
LONDON: Fairey, Fairy, Burgess, Williams, Tanser, Picknell, Vinall, Plampin, Mullins, Day, Folwell, Bamfield, Brown
WATFORD HERTS; Burgess, Williams
WARKS: Fairy, Ward, Stephens, Reeves, Hodgkiss, Byrne, Hunt, Edgeworth, Harper, Dudley,
WORCS: Callow, Lowe
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