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Topic: Lincolnshire Romanies (Read 566 times)
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sorcha65
RootsChat Member
Posts: 153
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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I am at my wits end here and wonder if anyone can help. I started all this family tree lark to try and find out why my Granny's family were all so dark skinned. She and her siblings all had black hair, black eyes and very dark skin. So much so that in the summer they were often taken as mixed race especially after the immigration from the West Indies. However I remember someone in the family telling me they were of Romany origin. After 4yr searching I have found no evidence to support this, I have though narrowed it down to the part of the family it came from. Her grandparents were called Pett and Spall, the Spalls came from a rural area of Suffolk called Bruisyard and the Petts came from Spalding in Lincs. I wondered if anyone knew of any Romany communities who travelled regularly there. Its a long shot I know but as the Pett family have been difficult to trace I m clutching at straws. Any info gratefully received. Thanks Sorcha
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escargot
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 63
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Dear Sorcha65,
I don't know anything about Romanies myself, but we were in Spalding at the weekend and went by a sign advertising Gordon Boswell's Romany Museum. If you google in Spalding Romany Museum it comes up.
Escargot
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sorcha65
RootsChat Member
Posts: 153
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Yes I ve been there and done that lol! They told me there was no significance to the location, it was just available! Thanks for the reply anyway. Sorcha
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LizzieW
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 3305
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My gran, my dad and his siblings and even some of my cousins have/had black hair, very dark brown eyes and olive coloured skin. Their background is supposed to be either Spanish or Portuguese, although I've not found that ancestor yet.
Liz
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BENSON- Dalton in Furness (Ulverston) and Hull
BETTISON - Derbys
BOULTON - Dalton-in-Furness and surrounding areas
BRAND - Lincs
COCKETT - Lincs, Yorks, Lancs
DA COSTA (or variants) - Spain or Portugal, London (Middx), ?Hull
GILCHRIST - Scotland, Lincs
HINGLEY - Derbys/Yorks
MANN - Sussex, Kent, Herts
MUMBY - Lincolnshire and Hull
PEMBERTON - Ches, Lancashire
STANTON - Lincs
ROBINSON - Lincs
WHITTAKER/WHITAKER - Ches/Lancs
WRIGHT- Bethnal Green
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An65
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 452
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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RedRed - thank you so much, but I dont really think Im an expert - we are just researching the same lines and lines that interest me so I pick up information on them frequently. I do think I might have a bit of a "knack" for rooting them out as the Rom hide so well under aliases and whatnot, but I also dont think Im alone in that.
Id recommend a hunt through Sues Romany Genes site (the link is listed in the Links page at the top of this traveller forum.) She might have picked up something on this surname.
Unfortunatly, to date I havent come across this name but that doesnt mean much - it only means that they didnt marry into the families Ive been busy researching. The Rom could travel several counties over the course of a year, some settled, some restricted themselves to one or two counties, and others went absolutely everywhere, so it doesnt necessarily follow that they were Lincs based.
A little more info on exactly who Im looking for (and when) might prove to be very useful - id be happy to see if I can find anything on them. If you dont want to put it on the forum, I dont mind if you PM me at all 
Ann
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sorcha65
RootsChat Member
Posts: 153
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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I ll tell you as much as I know. I have by a process of elimination narrowed it down to my GGrans side of the family, she was Adelaide Pett born nr Sheffield 1880. Her mother was a Green from Totley Derbyshire and I ve done some fairly extensive research into that side and I find it unlikely it came from there so I m left with her Dad - Richard Pett. His parents were Hannah Spall born Bruisyard Suffolk c.1809 - don t know the area, I think its rural have been in contact with someone from Suffolk who mooted there might have been an Irish community at one stage. The father John Pett was according to census born Spalding Lincs 1799/1800 his job was a groom in 1841 and by 1851 he was a cab proprietor. These two were married in Doncaster 1832, one of the witnesses was a Richard Pett (I assume a brother) who inconveniently died of Cholera in 1836. Why they went to Doncaster from their respective homes is anyone's guess- service probably. They moved to Sheffield and lived there til they died in 1871 within 3 days of each other!
I have tried with a Lincolnshire Archivist - nothing. Found one John Pett - not mine, this one died in Cambridgeshire. Theres no birth for him on IGI. All I know is we are all dark skinned in the family and are usually taken as Italian/Spanish. I would just like to know why. All I can remember is my Nan telling me we were Gypsies and her mother was Pschic and used to read the tea leaves! Sorry for the length of this. Sorcha
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An65
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 452
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Well, I seen John Pett on the 1841/51/61 CR in Sheffield, and on the first hes a groom, and on the second a gentlemans servant, and on the third a Cab Proprieter. They are living in a house, their neighbours arent giving any clues by their occupations or surnames, and there are a few other Petts living in the Spalding/Pinchbeck area, with non-romany occupations. Id have to say that it seems unlikely that this family are Romanies. I took a look at Spalls in Bruisyard Sfk, none in the CR, BUT - theres a whole generation of them on the IGI. This suggests a possibility - if the Spall family had all their kids baptised there, but none of them could accurately recall their place of birth for the census. To be honest with you, the mention of the name Green flags up more Romany likelihood than the others. Green is a known name.
I know thats not a lot of help, but Im afraid I cant see that I can find out much more for you. Sorry - perhaps someone else can.......
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sorcha65
RootsChat Member
Posts: 153
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Thanks for trying for me anyway An - aahh well the search goes on! Sorcha
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An65
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 452
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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The search may well not yet be over. You may yet find a link in the next generation back or something. It wasnt unheard of for the Rom to settle if they married into a gorja family even way back then. Good luck hunting!!
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sorcha65
RootsChat Member
Posts: 153
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Thanks An, just out of interest, I have found a link to a Brown family. Is that a Romany name? Sorcha
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An65
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 452
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Yep. Im related to one of the Browns. Hard family to trace tho - tell me more
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An65
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 452
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Just out of interest here are a few Rom names linked to Lincolnshire:
Heron/Herron/Hearn/Hearne/Herring etc
Boswell/Boss
Young (Herons and Bosses under a different surname)
Winter/Winters often alias Smith or Pierce/Pearse
Gray
Elliott
Brown
Smith
Wilson
Rhodes
Shaw
Loveridge
theres more but that will do for now.
The Herons and Boswells, and Bosses all intermarried, also marrying with the Smiths and Grays, a few marrying into the Winters/Pierces/Wilsons/Browns and so on and so forth.
Winters reputedly cam from North East, The Shaws and Loveridges and Herons from the midlands - Northants and East Anglia, the Rhodes came from Hull (far as I know) the Bosses loved Yorkshire. The Grays one branch settled in Cams and East Anglia, the other in Lincs, The Elliotts from Notts, and the Smiths were everywhere.
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sorcha65
RootsChat Member
Posts: 153
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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The Brown I m on about would be from the Spall side, therefore from Suffolk - I know this is a long shot cos Brown's a well common name. Sorcha
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An65
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 452
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Remember Rom are from everwhere - Suffolk could well be a place for a Brown to turn up.
I know of only a few Browns. There was Thomas Brown married Lydia Cooper (or Smith) travelled around the East Anglian area for sure, and his brother Bui (spelt in so many ways you wouldnt believe) married Lydia Smith and they travelled Lincs and East Anglia (but had no children from what I could see). They were sons of Rachel Heron and Jack Heron/Baker/Brown (and possibly other aliases).
There was a Francis Brown who travelled round Lincs/Yorks and all that area with Unity his wife,
and there was my great great great Gran Mary Brown married Thomas Smith and had my great great Gran Deliah who married Samuel Gray.
It certainly isnt an impossibility that a Brown in Suffolk could be one of that lot. They are very hard to trace tho!.
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