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Are these two families the same people?

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Topic: Are these two families the same people? (Read 326 times)

MollyButton
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Are these two families the same people?
« on: Sunday 06 January 08 15:57 GMT (UK) »

Hi All,
Wonder if you can help with my conundrum....

Do you think these families are the same people?
The name of the couple, John and Esther is right, the ages are right, and his occupation (marble polisher) stays the same throughout, as does Esthers birthplace(sort of, St Lukes, London and Middlesex) BUT

1. on the 1871 he says he's from Bermondsey, Surrey
on the 1881 and 1891 he says he's from Bristol and Bristol St Phillips respectively

2. Also on the 1881 there is a 13yr old, Mary, who should surely have been on the 1871?

Confused?

Here I have tried to insert the relevant bits of Census, apologies if it's not there, or there but wrong - first time I've tried this!! Cheesy

Thanks in advance

Molly x

COLSTO2_edited.JPG (24.46 KB, 399x72 - viewed 138 times.) JOHNCO1_edited.JPG (22.95 KB, 505x58 - viewed 136 times.)
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Colston - Lewisham and Hackney, London
Milne - Edinburgh and Forfar
Barron - Edinburgh
Guthrie - Forfar?
Lawrence - Hungerford/Lambourn
Stroude - Berkshire
Bothick - It's a mystery yet to be solved...........

heywood
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 06 January 08 16:36 GMT (UK) »

I think they probably are- can't see your prints but have traced them (I hope) Colston

There is a patient Mary Colston 1868 b Shoreditch as a patient at The London Hospital RG10; Piece: 521; Folio: 78; Page: 19

In an earlier census John is born Shepton Mallet Somerset (1851) but living Bethnal Green (if he is the same one) Can't find him 1861 and 1841 though!

best wishes
heywood


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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Alexander, Suffolk and Lancashire; Ashworth,Whitworth, Grindrod Lancashire; Golden, Duffy County Mayo.

MollyButton
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 06 January 08 16:59 GMT (UK) »

Thats interesting, If thats my Great Aunt Mary I've got her on the 1891 as a servant in Hackney, then she disapears, can't seem to find a death for her either though - so maybe she marries once shes out of hospital.
Got to go cook dinner now - but will be back!
Would you mind letting me know HOW you got those hospital records as I'm still very new to this.

x Molly


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heywood
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 06 January 08 17:55 GMT (UK) »

Hi Molly,
I doubt it she's only 3 in 1871 - even too young for a child bride Roll Eyes

1871 census - just browsed for the name- at least it is spelt properly - hope it's her.

Free BMD has a marriage 1894 Hackney Vol 1b pg 637
Mary Colston - possible spouse Michael J Keena

1901 RG13; Piece: 572; Folio: 157; Page: 2

16 Walmer Rd Plumstead

Michael J Kenna 37 yrs general labourer b Ireland
Mary wife 33 yrs b London City Rd
Esther daur 6 yrs b Kent Plumstead
Mary Kenna mother b Ireland

sounds like Great Aunty Mary- daughter Esther adds to supposition but to make sure you would need that marriage certificate.

best wishes
heywood


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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Alexander, Suffolk and Lancashire; Ashworth,Whitworth, Grindrod Lancashire; Golden, Duffy County Mayo.

MollyButton
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 06 January 08 19:49 GMT (UK) »

hey heywood!

I did mean a long time after hospital Cheesy

LOL. Maths never my strong point.......

That really does sound like her doesn't it? and I got a 1 of 1 when I searched properly too (eventually Roll Eyes

)

Cool, thanks!

Still don't know what to do about John I-don't-know-where-was-born Colston though....

I was going to try parish records, as there seems to be no birth for him on FreeBMD. But What Parish?!?!? Embarrassed

xx Molly


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heywood
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 06 January 08 20:11 GMT (UK) »

trouble is when you look on Family Search - Colston variations seem to be popular in Shepton Mallet Undecided

Free BMD has
June quarter 1838 John Robert Colstone Shepton Mallet

December quarter 1839 Sarah Colston Shepton Mallet

December 1840 Sarah Colston Shepton Mallet

sorry- this is from the info in 1851 - I think you have access don't you. HO107; Piece: 1541; Folio: 460; Page: 27
if not just shout.


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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Alexander, Suffolk and Lancashire; Ashworth,Whitworth, Grindrod Lancashire; Golden, Duffy County Mayo.

heywood
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 06 January 08 20:26 GMT (UK) »

this is becoming interesting and I am crossing everything in the hopes that it isn't a red herring- Undecided

1841 HO107; Piece 963; Book: 13;Folio: 11; Page: 14

Shepton Mallet :has Frederick Colston with Selina (not Louise as in 1851 but no relationships are shown in 1841) with John, Sarah and a Mary - who i can't find a birth for... so... Undecided

But I have found a death for Selina Colston 1848 St Luke's Middlesex
and a marriage for Frderick Colston 1849 Bethnal Green - possible spouse Louisa Champion.

The only fly in the ointment is that Shepton Mallet and Bristol are about 20 miles away which in those days would be a very long way, I would have thought Grin

I would get the marriage certificate for John and see who his father is- please, please, please let it be Frederick Grin


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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Alexander, Suffolk and Lancashire; Ashworth,Whitworth, Grindrod Lancashire; Golden, Duffy County Mayo.

MollyButton
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 06 January 08 20:40 GMT (UK) »

Mmmm,

Yes I'll get the cert.... they're a tricky bunch aren't they?

One of my concerns with this lot is that they are all Silk Weavers and when John turns up later he's a Mason/Marble Polisher - which seems a bit of a departure.... but I guess possible.
And another reason, that sounds silly Wink

- no Williams!! there are ALWAYS William Colstons! Cheesy

lol.

Thanks so much for your interest and help!

Molly x


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heywood
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 06 January 08 21:02 GMT (UK) »

Molly - just yell if you are getting fed up with me - I just love digging and delving Cheesy

- just dawned on me you may have already gone through all this trying to eliminate - just humour me for now - I'll stop!

1861 RG9; Piece: 259; Folio: 98; Page: 63

has Frederick -p.o.b. wrongly given as Shipton Norfolk remarried (Louisa had died by now) to Kezia Champion (Louisa's relative??)

Young Fred is a messenger - perhaps silk weaving is dying out and John wants to improve himself?

I can't find John (nor Esther) in 1861 - perhaps you have- I tried various searches but to no avail.

best wishes- hope it all turns out
Kath


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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Alexander, Suffolk and Lancashire; Ashworth,Whitworth, Grindrod Lancashire; Golden, Duffy County Mayo.

MollyButton
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #9 on: Sunday 06 January 08 21:10 GMT (UK) »

love it Kath!

I have tried a lot but not all that you have found!

Before you do it though, he's not the pupil at Summerhill School, Bristol on the 1851 either!

Have ordered Marriage Cert so will keep you posted..........

Thanks so much for all this.

Must now go and placate OH who had to watch Top Gear by himself and is sulking! Embarrassed

xx Molly


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heywood
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #10 on: Sunday 06 January 08 21:12 GMT (UK) »

that's not the one I found - did you see him with Frederick and Louisa- not going anywhere near Summerhill School now- I have two weeks off work and am still sorting myself out for work tomorrow!!
Nearly there though

best of luck


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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Alexander, Suffolk and Lancashire; Ashworth,Whitworth, Grindrod Lancashire; Golden, Duffy County Mayo.

MollyButton
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #11 on: Monday 07 January 08 14:36 GMT (UK) »

Hi Kath

Hope work was ok!

I did see Frederick and Louisa quite a while ago, but discounted them because of location, but this was before you found me John Robert Colstones birth - so it's definitely worth a re-look

just teaches you not to discount any possibility I guess Roll Eyes

Found this marriage

Name: John Colston Year of Registration: 1861 Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec District: East London County: London, Middlesex Volume: 1c Page:55

Which I think is prob John and Esther - esp as the daughter Esther is born in 1862. So this is the one I've ordered - just the waiting game now Roll Eyes

Am going to spend the meantime looking for G Grandma Henrietta Olive Laurence who was born at a racing stables in Lambourn, theres always something to do!!

Promise to keep you posted, thanks again,

Molly x


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MollyButton
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #12 on: Friday 11 January 08 13:08 GMT (UK) »

Oh dear................... Huh

I have got the marriage cert............... Huh

John's Father is Mark Colston, Pastry Chef Shocked

So goodness only knows where he came from!!

I've got Esther's details too - her father is William John Stroude, Candle Maker, and I'm fairly sure the cert says 'deceased' underneath - but its a bit wobbly.

At the time they were both (John and Esther) living at 11 White Horse Court, East London.

The witnesses were Henry and Mary Stroude.

Not sure where that gets us - but rules out all the ones we looked at!

Ah well, back to the drawing board..........

Molly x


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heywood
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #13 on: Friday 11 January 08 17:24 GMT (UK) »

oh b*****

never to be defeated we just carry on Grin

I will just give brief descriptions as you have access

1851 HO107; Piece: 1564; Folio: 31; Page: 55
St George Southwark Surrey

Mark Colston 39 yrs baker b Portsmouth a wife Elizabeth and family.
Wife and children are born Bristol but John is not with them.

1841 HO107; Piece 1084; Book: 6; Folio: 40; Page: 30

St George, Southwark Surrey

Mark Colston 30 yrs baker with presumably wife and family- John aged 3 yrs born in county but Eliz. aged 5 yrs not born in county.


« Last Edit: Friday 11 January 08 20:48 GMT (UK) by heywood »	Logged

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Alexander, Suffolk and Lancashire; Ashworth,Whitworth, Grindrod Lancashire; Golden, Duffy County Mayo.

heywood
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Re: Are these two families the same people?
« Reply #14 on: Friday 11 January 08 21:00 GMT (UK) »

Mark, Elizabeth and two daughters still going strong in 1861 RG9; Piece: 315; Folio: 138; Page: 34


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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Alexander, Suffolk and Lancashire; Ashworth,Whitworth, Grindrod Lancashire; Golden, Duffy County Mayo.

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