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Author Topic: Current Paternity Rights to his surname  (Read 623 times)
fielding
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Current Paternity Rights to his surname
« on: Tuesday 04 January 05 16:31 UTC (UK) »
Copuls s.k.s. please explain or clarify for me exactly what rights of surname an unmarried father has got for his child.

I have heard that for an un-married couple, if the father registers the newborn infant then it will be HIS surname which will appear on the birth certificate, whereas if the mother registers the infant, then it would be HER surname which is on the certificate.
What, therefore, is the necessary course of action that the father should take in order to ensure that the infant is given HIS surname so that he does not forfeit any Rights of Paternity for his (bastard) child in these uncertain times when so many couples break-up; short of legal adoption should they marry at a later date.

In other words, how can he best give his infant HIS surname??

Thank you,
Sue
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Hackstaple
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Re: Current Paternity Rights to his surname
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 04 January 05 16:33 UTC (UK) »
If this is a current matter then it would be advisable to seek the advice of a lawyer or the Citizens Advice Bureau. Laws and customs vary from country to country - quite widely.
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Southern or Southan [Hereford , Monmouthshire & Glos], Jenkins, Meredith and Morgan [Monmouthshire and Glos.], Murrill, Damary, Damry, Ray, Lawrence [all Middx. & London], Nethway from Kenn or Yatton. Also Riley and Lyons in South Africa and Riley from St. Helena.
Any census information included in this post is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
casalguidi
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Re: Current Paternity Rights to his surname
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 04 January 05 18:04 UTC (UK) »
There is a little bit about it and a helpline number on the General Register Office website:

http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/births/parentalresponsibility/

Best wishes

Casalguidi
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Census information is Crown Copyright http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
minime
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Re: Current Paternity Rights to his surname
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 04 January 05 23:05 UTC (UK) »
Depending on where you are, the legalities are probably different. Here in the US...the father's last name usually goes on the child's certificate, whether married or not. (Sometimes an unfortunate, as in my case.) Here, father's don't generally lose rights, no matter the circumstance. It has to be pretty nasty for the courts not to give visitation or anything else to the father, up to and including joint custody, again whether married or not.

The best advice is to seek legal council as Hackstaple said, and see what they can do to help.

Minime
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Birchall, Cooper, Kearns, Hope, Desmarias
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genresearch
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Re: Current Paternity Rights to his surname
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 05 January 05 01:02 UTC (UK) »
In England and Wales unmarried father's have no rights to the surname of the child being his own nor does he have any parental responsibility rights under law.  He does however have upkeep rights.

For the unmarried father to have his surname given to the child both himself and the mother have to attend the registrars office together and agree that this is their wishes.  This differs with married couples where either can register seperately and the baby is given the fathers name.  Funnily I was asked whether I was married to the mother on only one occasion out of 4 and that was the third child.

Gen
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WYATT, COX, STRATTON, all from south Derbyshire and the STS, LEI border
fielding
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Re: Current Paternity Rights to his surname
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 05 January 05 16:25 UTC (UK) »
Thank you everybody for all your very helpful comments.
My enquiry concerned the situation in England and Wales and I appreciate your replies.
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petere
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Re: Current Paternity Rights to his surname
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 05 January 05 21:01 UTC (UK) »
I'm not sure about modern birth certificates but of all of the birth certificates that I have for my ancestors none of them have a column for the child's surname. The one birth cert that I have where the mother and father have a different surname was indexed in the GRO index under both surnames and there was no way of knowing which name the child used. This was in 1857.

Peter E
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leagen
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Re: Current Paternity Rights to his surname
« Reply #7 on: Friday 07 January 05 18:59 UTC (UK) »
On the 1870 census of New York one of my ancestor's half-sisters is listed under the family name as her last name even tho it Wasn't her last name as her last name was the name of the mother's first husband.  It seems to be, at least on census records, that whatever the family told the census taker is what was taken as true.  I know the law in U.S. (From my own experiance) is that a person can use Any name they want to as long as they are not doing so to run away from the law. Don't know if this actually pertains to the original question in this thread but thought it might be of interest/help to some.  Leagen
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Dolgellau
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Re: Current Paternity Rights to his surname
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 09 January 05 03:26 UTC (UK) »
On old England and Wales marriage certificates there is no surname recorded for the child, just first name(s), it is assumed that the child of a married couple will have the same surname as his father and the child of an unmarried mother will have the surname of his mother.

Comparison between what is recorded on birth certificates and census returns or other official documents will show that this assumption is often wrong.

On modern certificates (since the early 80's I think, but I can't give a definite date) there is a  column for the child's surname. As with the first name the surname recorded will be the one chosen by the person registering the birth.

If a couple are unmarried then it has been the case since the earliest days of registration that the father must be present to give his consent to entering his name in the father's name column.

An unmarried father could only register the birth "on his own" on the grounds of being present at the birth and could not claim to be a parent unless the mother was also present to agree to the father's name being included.

Marriage certificates of illegitimate children often contain the reputed father's name in the appropriate place  - and can contain that information without the reputed father's consent.

If the opening post refers to a current issue rather than a family history issue it should be taken up with a solicitor or  Citizens Advice  - it is not the sort of thing that family historians can give proper advice about and it would be unfair to expect  us do so.
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fielding
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Re: Current Paternity Rights to his surname
« Reply #9 on: Sunday 09 January 05 17:03 UTC (UK) »
Thank you very much for all of your most helpful advice.
It has been taken on board and appreciated.
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denben
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Re: Current Paternity Rights to his surname
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 12 January 05 00:46 UTC (UK) »
I have worked for the CAB and perhaps I can add a bit more.

For an unmarried father to make any decision regarding his child, including birth certificate details, he must have 'parental responsibility'.  He can acquire 'parental responsibility' in two ways; the mother can grant it to him or he can apply to the court. 

Of course, if the mother doesn't grant it and she goes ahead and registers the child it would probably be too late for court action.

I should point out that a child's legal name is the name by which he/she is known regardless of birth certificate, deed poll or statutory declaration.
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genresearch
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Re: Current Paternity Rights to his surname
« Reply #11 on: Monday 24 January 05 21:28 UTC (UK) »
As Den said the mother can grant him parental responsibility but unless that is drawn up by a legal document it means nothing in law.  The register will still not put the fathers nameon the cert unless he is present.  That is a requirement by law.  this is to stop women claiming a child belongs to one person when he may not.

This is in some resepct what Fathers For Justice are now campaigning for amongst teh fact they want access to their children.  Radio 2 yesterday had a long item on this and the lawyer they had on pointed out a case where the mother refused her ex access to his child.  The judge made legal precedent by giving custody to the father because he was going to let the mother see the child. 

Now to stop posting this because I am getting into a minefield of personal feelings with my own life that I don't wish to have washed here nor do I want to throw personal feelings into what I would consider a critical correct response plus its getting off the original question Smiley

Gen
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WYATT, COX, STRATTON, all from south Derbyshire and the STS, LEI border
minime
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Re: Current Paternity Rights to his surname
« Reply #12 on: Tuesday 25 January 05 02:56 UTC (UK) »
And here I thought just the US was a mess with it's laws and such.

Minime
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Birchall, Cooper, Kearns, Hope, Desmarias
Scotland, England, Ireland, Canada?, France?
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