Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland Family History Local History

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register for free.
Did you miss your activation email?
Tuesday 02 December 08 18:07 GMT (UK)

News: Ad: FULL Search right now, www.Ancestry.co.uk today - free for two weeks

RootsChat.Com

England (Counties as in 1851-1901)

England - General

Cumberland

Cumberland Lookup Requests (Moderator: sillgen)

Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland

« previous next »

Pages: [1] 2

Author

Topic: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland (Read 507 times)

Jason46
RootsChat Member

Offline

Posts: 162

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« on: Tuesday 15 January 08 08:58 GMT (UK) »

I have a relative who is proving elusive. George Barnsley who is my Great great Grandfather, married Anne Gates at St Andrews Penrith on 27 Mar 1847 I believe he was born about 1823 (ch 7 may 1823, at St Andrew's Penrith), to Thomas Barnsley and Ann (no maiden name given), and no further information on the IGI. There is a Thomas Barnsley born about 1791 of Sandgate Penrith who may be Georges father, but I have no further information
Could some one please check the registers for Penrith Cumberland for further information on a Thomas Barnsley around this period, or for any brothers or sister's for George.
Any assistance would be greatly appreciated
Jason46


	Logged

Carpenter - Devon and Australia
Flett - Orkneys
Morrell - Antrim, France, Switzerland and Ballarat
Norse and Swedish Royal families to 1000AD
Rowan - Ireland and Gloucester
Poyntz/Pons - Gloucester, France
Wilcher - Bermondsey and Birmingham
Roberts - Liverpool
Price - Monmouthshire
Smith - Orkneys
Barnsley - Cumberland
Discombe - Devon
Brewer - Devon
Torrington - Devon

sillgen
Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate

Offline

Posts: 5889

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 15 January 08 17:52 GMT (UK) »

Hi
Is George the one who is a shoemaker's apprentice age 15 in 1841? HO107/4/1 F14 p25 Penrith (Remember ages above 15 were rounded down in 1841)
Presumably the marriage certificate will confirm his father's name and occupation so that might help. Do you have it?
What was his occupation in later census records?
Andrea


	Logged

Sill/Sills anywhere.
Rowan, Tow, Forman, Brown, Allen and King in Yorkshire, Northumberland and Durham.
Census information is Crown Copyright http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Jason46
RootsChat Member

Offline

Posts: 162

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 16 January 08 05:39 GMT (UK) »

Hi Andrea
I don't have the Marriage certificate and i don't have the census information that you are referring to. Can you forward it to me or tell me how to access it, please.
Also, my gr gr grandmother was a Rowan from Ahoghill, Antrim, Northern Ireland. Is that of interest?
Jason


	Logged

sillgen
Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate

Offline

Posts: 5889

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 17 January 08 09:38 GMT (UK) »

Hi Jason
My Rowans are Irish but from County Cavan and they went across to Jarrow in the mid 1800s.
All census records can be accessed on a couple of paying sites. www.ancestry.co.uk is one They often offer free trials so it might be worth trying that to see if it is worth your while. They also have the full BMD index. If you look at the beginners board it should have links to various useful sites you can use, paying and free. The marriage to Ann Gates is registered in West Derby, Lancashire (part of Liverpool) in the January quarter of 1847 ref 20 698 which seems very odd if you have it in Penrith. Are you sure it is the right one? If it is then I really think it would be a good thing to get the certificate as it will confirm the father's name for both parties. You do need to bear in mind that the IGI is not full coverage by any means and any record submitted by an LDS church member must be treated with caution until you have checked the original source. The Marriage to Anne Gates is on the IGI in "Liverpool" not Penrith but that is confirmed by the BMD index.
How do you know George was born in Penrith? I could not find him in later census with Ann. What children did they have? If you can give me reference for a later census year that would help.
Andrea


	Logged

Sill/Sills anywhere.
Rowan, Tow, Forman, Brown, Allen and King in Yorkshire, Northumberland and Durham.
Census information is Crown Copyright http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Jason46
RootsChat Member

Offline

Posts: 162

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 17 January 08 12:20 GMT (UK) »

Hi Andrea
Thanks for the advice and i will look at the beginners board and go from there.George Barnsley was christened in Penrith 7 May 1823, and married Anne Gates, 27 Mar 1847 in West Derby, Liverpool, and he, his wife, 2 sons, Thomas and John, and his wife's parents, John Gates and Anne (nee Scott) went to Victoria, Australia aboard the Donald McKay in 1852. The two grandparents had died by 1854, George died on the gold fields in 1858 and his wife was murdered in 1863. They also had a daughter born at sea and another daughter, my great grandmother born in 1855. I still don't know who brought her up and the other children. Welcome to Australia!
So George may appear on the 1841 census, but not on the 1851. If you see anything, let me know. I appreciate the interest you have shown
Jason


	Logged

sillgen
Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate

Offline

Posts: 5889

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 17 January 08 15:11 GMT (UK) »

Hi
If he sailed in 1852 he should be on the 1851 with his wife. I will have a look later. You do not explain how you know he was born in Penrith. Is that from family knowledge? It is a common name and I was concerned that you just picked an appropriate baptism from the IGI without realising that Penrith is some distance from Liverpool. If you are sure of that fact then so be it.
Andrea


	Logged

Sill/Sills anywhere.
Rowan, Tow, Forman, Brown, Allen and King in Yorkshire, Northumberland and Durham.
Census information is Crown Copyright http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Jason46
RootsChat Member

Offline

Posts: 162

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 17 January 08 18:50 GMT (UK) »

Hi Andrea
I'm positive from family knowledge, plus another roots chatter, Keith Bateman, has confirmed it. All the inlaws are from Crosthwaite area too. The odd bit is actually the Liverpool marriage. Thanks for the look-up offer, Jason


	Logged

sillgen
Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate

Offline

Posts: 5889

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 17 January 08 18:56 GMT (UK) »

Have just sent you a personal message with the 1851 for George and Anne and births for Thomas Scott, John Gates and Mary Ann Scott Barnsley.
Andrea


	Logged

Sill/Sills anywhere.
Rowan, Tow, Forman, Brown, Allen and King in Yorkshire, Northumberland and Durham.
Census information is Crown Copyright http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

sillgen
Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate

Offline

Posts: 5889

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #8 on: Friday 18 January 08 17:28 GMT (UK) »

Glad you think these are the right ones and as I said in my PM once you have the marriage certificate confirming the name of George's father I will look at the Penrith register when I am in that area after Easter - unless someone more local can do it for you before then.
Andrea


	Logged

Sill/Sills anywhere.
Rowan, Tow, Forman, Brown, Allen and King in Yorkshire, Northumberland and Durham.
Census information is Crown Copyright http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Jason46
RootsChat Member

Offline

Posts: 162

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #9 on: Thursday 07 February 08 17:21 GMT (UK) »

Hi Andrea
I took your advice and got a result. The assistant County Archivist says that 'Sandgates' is the Sandgate Wesleyan Methodist Chapel in Penrith and baptisms registers 1814-1837 are deposited at the National Archives at Kew. Methodists could not marry in their own chapels until1837 and so married in the Church of England, but he looked at the Penrith C of E registers for 1823 but there was no record of Thomas Barnsley marrying.
Not the result I wanted but it does narrow the field a bit
Jason


	Logged

sillgen
Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate

Offline

Posts: 5889

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #10 on: Friday 08 February 08 08:55 GMT (UK) »

Have you got the marriage certificate for George yet? Witnesses might be afmily members and give you other names to look for. Sandgates is an area of Penrith.
Andrea


	Logged

Sill/Sills anywhere.
Rowan, Tow, Forman, Brown, Allen and King in Yorkshire, Northumberland and Durham.
Census information is Crown Copyright http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Jason46
RootsChat Member

Offline

Posts: 162

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #11 on: Tuesday 04 March 08 07:49 GMT (UK) »

Hi Andrea,
I'm still waiting on the Marriage cert, and have sent a reminder. I looked at the Death cert yesterday and there were no parents mentioned, but he died alone so that was expected
Jason


	Logged

Jason46
RootsChat Member

Offline

Posts: 162

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #12 on: Tuesday 04 March 08 17:07 GMT (UK) »

Yo Andrea
George, son of Ann Barnsley of Sandgate, Penrith, single woman, was baptised at St Andrew's Church, Penrith on 7 May, 1823.
No further information
Jason


	Logged

sillgen
Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate

Offline

Posts: 5889

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday 05 March 08 19:18 GMT (UK) »

Ah! It might be worth seeing if there was a bastardy bond issued. The parish did try to get money out of the father if they could. The record office should be able to tell you if any exist for that time.
Andrea


	Logged

Sill/Sills anywhere.
Rowan, Tow, Forman, Brown, Allen and King in Yorkshire, Northumberland and Durham.
Census information is Crown Copyright http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Jason46
RootsChat Member

Offline

Posts: 162

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Re: Barnsley of Penrith Cumberland
« Reply #14 on: Tuesday 11 March 08 09:07 GMT (UK) »

Hi Andrea,
Tom Robson, the Senior Archivist wrote and told me that he checked out the bastardy bond compiled from the entries and found no reference to an Ann Barnsley. He did however find reference to an Elizabeth Barnsley, also of Penrith, who appeared before the magistrates at the Easter Sessions of 1822, with a petition of maintenance from one John Harrison, a skinner of Penrith. I found nothing in the IGI for 1822, but that doesn't mean anything, and I doubt if there was any relevance to Ann, as her son was born after 1822. Maybe there is a relationship between the two women, but how would that help?
Jason


	Logged

Pages: [1] 2

« previous next »

[Copyright] [Free RootsChat Webspace] [Your Surname Interests] [Shrink Link] [About Us] [Terms of Use]

All Census Lookups are Crown Copyright, National Archives for academic and non-commercial research purposes only
RootsChat.com cannot be held responsible directly or indirectly for the messages or content posted by others. Inline images in messages are the copyright of the respective linked sites.
RootsChat.com, Europa House, Bury, Lancashire, BL9 5BT

0.121:23