|
Pages: [1]
|
 |
|
Author
|
Topic: Smyth Family (Read 245 times)
|
DS
RootsChat Marquessate
 Offline
Posts: 3081
|
Hi
I have found this Marriage on the BVRI...
13/08/1853 Belfast, Antrim
James Smyth (father James Smyth)
Elizabeth Graham (father John Graham)
Can anyone please find any more information about these people ?
If this is the correct family that we have been looking for, there is a possibility that they had the following children in Ireland before appearing on the 1881 census in Salford, England...
Eliza Jane Smyth c1857
Margaret Ellen Smyth c1858
George Smyth c1861
James Smyth c1863
William Smyth c1867
There might also be a son called John Graham Smyth c1855
Any help will be greatly appreciated.
DS
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
aghadowey
Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate
 Online
Posts: 9089
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
Civil registration of births in Ireland only started in 1864 so for earlier births you would need to search for church records.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
DS
RootsChat Marquessate
Offline
Posts: 3081
|
Hi aghadowey
Thank you for that information.
William should therefore be “civilly” registered, presumably, but the others would only be in Church Records
Could you please steer me towards some online sources of such information in which I might look for them all.
If it is not immediately apparent, I do not live in Ireland and I know almost nothing (if not less)  about the Family History resources that are available over there.
DS
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
scotmum
RootsChat Aristocrat
Offline
Posts: 1198
Look back, look around, look forward!
|
Ulster Historical foundation have about 5 'William Smyth' birth records for County Down and County Antrim in 1867 (plus others either side of this year). It costs £6 or equivalent to view up to five records, so you may wish to do so.
William Smyth index entries
There is no guarantee any will be your William and the parents names are only revealed when purchase is made.
Another site you may wish to try is Emerald Ancestors.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
STEWART, Lanarkshire, Scotland and Fermanagh/Monaghan border areas, Ireland
LILLEY, County Antrim, Ireland (now NI).
HENDERSON,Lanarkshire,Scotland and probably County Londonderry, Ireland (now NI).
CAPE Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
SCOTT Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
|
|
|
OTTO
RootsChat Senior
Offline
Posts: 395
|
Hi
I have found this Marriage on the BVRI...
13/08/1853 Belfast, Antrim
James Smyth (father James Smyth)
Elizabeth Graham (father John Graham)
Can anyone please find any more information about these people ?
If this is the correct family that we have been looking for, there is a possibility that they had the following children in Ireland before appearing on the 1881 census in Salford, England...
Eliza Jane Smyth c1857
Margaret Ellen Smyth c1858
George Smyth c1861
James Smyth c1863
William Smyth c1867
There might also be a son called John Graham Smyth c1855
Any help will be greatly appreciated.
DS
from www.familysearch.org :
AGNES SMYTH born to James Smyth and Elizabeth Graham
05 OCT 1865 0611, Lisburn, Antrim, Ireland
from www.emeraldancestors.com :
Record Type Civil Marriage
Date of Marriage 13 Aug 1853
Groom Name james SMYTH
Bride Name elizabeth GRAHAM
Church Saint Annes Church of Ireland
Parish Shankill
Civil District Belfast
County Antrim
OTTO
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Cardwell, Cheyne, Moreland of County Down (Dromore/Dromara/ Waringstown)
Mercer, Hillsborough and Upper Ballinderry
Ellis, Ferris of Upper Ballinderry
|
|
|
scotmum
RootsChat Aristocrat
Offline
Posts: 1198
Look back, look around, look forward!
|
Also
IGI have a
James Smith and Eliza Graham bearing a son, William Smith in the Lisburn area on 20/4/1867
and
a James Smyth and Elizabeth Graham with a daughter, Agnes Smyth on 5/10/1865, again in Lisburn area.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
STEWART, Lanarkshire, Scotland and Fermanagh/Monaghan border areas, Ireland
LILLEY, County Antrim, Ireland (now NI).
HENDERSON,Lanarkshire,Scotland and probably County Londonderry, Ireland (now NI).
CAPE Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
SCOTT Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
|
|
|
DS
RootsChat Marquessate
Offline
Posts: 3081
|
Hello again 
Thank you both for the additional information. I have looked on the Ulster Historical Foundation site for the Births of William Smyth at Antrim in and around 1867.
Unfortunately none of them was the correct one. The two entries for 1867 were (in brief)....
07/07/1867 Father Terence Smyth in the Parish of Aghaderg
01/11/1867 Father Adam Smyth in the Parish of St Patricks
Is there anywhere else that William’s registration might be found ?
Thank you particularly for the identification of Saint Anne’s Church of Ireland as the church in which the marriage took place. Is this now known as Belfast Cathedral ?
Is it possible to obtain access (in any way) to the Birth/Baptism Registers of the Cathedral for the period 1853 to 1867 ?
OTTO, Would I be right to assume that you have already looked on the Emerald Ancestors site for the five Smyth children listed above who were born prior to 1864 and not found them ?
I have had a look using the free search facility and the initial results indicated possible births as follows....
John Graham Smyth 1
Eliza Jane Smyth 18
Margaret Ellen Smyth 1
George Smyth 43
James Smyth 169
However, when I then clicked on “view details” none of them seemed to be a close enough match to justify paying to have a look at more information.
The singular entries for John Graham and Margaret Ellen initially looked to be very promising but after viewing the details they turned out to be John Green Smyth born in 1871 and Margaret Ellen Smyth born in 1868, respectively.
Thank you again for the leads that you have already provided, I am grateful, but is there anything else that I could do to try and pin down those children to the James Smyth and Elizabeth Graham who married on 13/08/1853 ?
DS
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
DS
RootsChat Marquessate
Offline
Posts: 3081
|
Hello Annie
Thanks for looking and for finding another William. However, the William that has already been identified (born 1867 to parents James Smyth and Eliza or Elizabeth Graham) seems to be a very good match for "our" William who was in Salford in 1881......and I really want it to be him because of the name Graham, which has considerable significance.
One of the problems with that William is the appearance of another possible sister, who we have not heard of before, called Agnes born in 1865. There is no sign of her in Salford in 1881.
What I think I need to do, is to try and find out what happened to this Agnes and also to try and find out if any of the other children listed above (who were in Salford in 1881 with "our" James, Elizabeth and William) had Eliza or Elizabeth Graham as their mother.
The trouble is that I have no idea how to do either since records do not seem to be available 
I am still hoping that someone will give us some further advice about how to go about trying to find out.
For several years we have been told that in order to make any progress in Ireland we need to know which part of Ireland to look in. However, now that we have pinpointed Belfast as a strong possibility it still seems that the scope for possible further progress is very limited (and in some cases, apparently very expensive with no guarantee of a positive result).
At least we are getting out of Salford for a while
DS 
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1]
|
|
|
|
|
