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Pages: 1 2 3 [4]
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Topic: Issues with Lamb family research - COMPLETED (Read 1894 times)
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breaky
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Posts: 39
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Thanks, PrueM. (I've managed to load a less squashed up version), but all I can make out, of the top witness's name, is "McLeroy".
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Forfarian
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Looks like John Robertson to me 
And to me - but I surmise that the question relates to the first witness rather than the second one. I can't make up my mind whether the surname is McHenry, or McIlroy, or McLeroy, or McInroy and I have no idea what his/her first name is.
I see that a James Macinroy married a Betty Robertson in Kettins in 1828 and that they had a son James who could have been of an age to be Alexander's witness.
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Researching
AITKENHEAD, Lanarkshire; BINNY, Forfar; BLACK, New Monkland; BRYSON, Cumbernauld; BURGESS, North-East Scotland; CRUICKSHANK, Rothes; DALLAS, Botriphnie; DAVIDSON, Oyne; HOGG, Larbert; LESLIE, Rothes; LESLIE, Mortlach; MENDUM, England; PATERSON, Larbert; RHIND, Forfar; SANG, Scotland; SCOTT, East Kilbride; STOREY, New Monkland; THORNTON, Shotts; WADDELL, New Monkland; WILKIE, New Monkland; WILKIE, Tannadice; WYLLIE, Lethnot and Navar; YOUNG, Keith
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TunjiLees
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Dr. Oladipo James Olaore
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Thanks again people, the identity of the witnesses could certainly prove useful.
On another matter: the only Helen Lamb who could plausibly be Alexander's mother that I can find from around that time is:
Old Parish Registers: Helen Lamb, B. 9 Mar 1803 Angus, Monfieth
IGI Extracted Record: Parents = WILL. LAMB/ISOBEL SMITH.
This does not seem to be her though as she is not connected to John Lamb, Kettins or Newtyle.
Also, coming back to Forfarian's earlier theory of all of the Lamb family from Newtyle being descended from the same John Lamb. Perhaps someone could please lookup census records of the Lambs in Newtyle over the years? Perhaps it will help to see if his theory is correct as there may be a possibility of being able link the people from different households.
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Forfarian
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On another matter: the only Helen Lamb who could plausibly be Alexander's mother that I can find from around that time is:
Old Parish Registers: Helen Lamb, B. 9 Mar 1803 Angus, Monfieth
IGI Extracted Record: Parents = WILL. LAMB/ISOBEL SMITH.
This does not seem to be her though as she is not connected to John Lamb, Kettins or Newtyle.
I will eat my hat if this Helen Lamb is the mother of Alexander Ross. It is never safe to assume that, because there is only one person of roughly the right age in the IGI, or in the parish registers, it is the same person. I have seen somewhere a suggestion that anything up to 40% of baptisms were not recorded in the parish register. It does vary quite a bit, and the proportion escaping the net is probably lower in small rural parishes like Newtyle and Meigle than in the cities, but even so you can't be sure.
In my own tree I have 167 people born between about 1800 and 1810, mostly in rural parishes, and of those there are 35 whose baptisms I cannot find. That's about one in every five.
Have you looked at the death of Helen Lamb, wife of Andrew Murray?
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Researching
AITKENHEAD, Lanarkshire; BINNY, Forfar; BLACK, New Monkland; BRYSON, Cumbernauld; BURGESS, North-East Scotland; CRUICKSHANK, Rothes; DALLAS, Botriphnie; DAVIDSON, Oyne; HOGG, Larbert; LESLIE, Rothes; LESLIE, Mortlach; MENDUM, England; PATERSON, Larbert; RHIND, Forfar; SANG, Scotland; SCOTT, East Kilbride; STOREY, New Monkland; THORNTON, Shotts; WADDELL, New Monkland; WILKIE, New Monkland; WILKIE, Tannadice; WYLLIE, Lethnot and Navar; YOUNG, Keith
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TunjiLees
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Dr. Oladipo James Olaore
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Deaths
1860 LAMB HELEN GAIRNS (mother's surname) ROBB (other surnames) F 39 DUNDEE FIRST DISTRICT DUNDEE CITY/ANGUS 282/01 0327
1873 LAMB HELEN GORDON (other surnames) F 32 ST MARY DUNDEE CITY/ANGUS 282/02 0125
1875 LAMB HELEN CRAWFORD (other surnames) F 69 MONIKIE /ANGUS 311/00 0026
1880 LAMB HELEN SAMSON (other surnames )F 73 KIRRIEMUIR /ANGUS 299/00 0031
1899 LAMB HELEN F 60 MONTROSE /ANGUS 312/00 0090
1903 LAMB HELEN F 37 PANBRIDE /ANGUS 316/00 0014
1905 LAMB HELEN REID (other surnames) F 42 LOCHEE DUNDEE CITY/ANGUS 282/05 0233
1906 LAMB HELEN F 46 MONTROSE /ANGUS 312/00 0010
1906 LAMB HELEN KIDD (other surnames) F 75 ST CLEMENT DUNDEE CITY/ANGUS
and
1880 MURRAY HELEN LAMB F 65 MEIGLE /PERTH 379/00 0001
1882 MURRAY HELEN LAMB F 39 PENICUIK /MIDLOTHIAN 697/00 0022
I do not see any possibilities for Helen Lamb in 1841 on FreeCEN.
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Forfarian
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I have just looked at the death certificate of Helen Murray, married to Andrew Murray, parents John Lamb, Church Officer and Helen Sydie, both deceased. Helen died on 21 January 1880 at Washington, Meigle of bronchial pneumonia, and the death was registered by her son William Murray.
In the household with Andrew and Helen Murray in 1851 was Alexander Murray, son, aged 16. I think this is probably Helen's son Alexander Ross.
The absence of Helen Lamb in the 1841 census in FreeCen is almost certainly because only 13.4% of the county of Perth, not including Meigle, has so far been transcribed.
While I was at it, I had a look at the death of Frederick Lamb in Newtyle in 1875. His father was John Lamb, small farmer and his mother, as I thought, Agnes Doig. I had hoped it would say Church Officer, which would have proved my hypothesis that John Lamb was married twice. It doesn't disprove it, but you need more evidence.
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Researching
AITKENHEAD, Lanarkshire; BINNY, Forfar; BLACK, New Monkland; BRYSON, Cumbernauld; BURGESS, North-East Scotland; CRUICKSHANK, Rothes; DALLAS, Botriphnie; DAVIDSON, Oyne; HOGG, Larbert; LESLIE, Rothes; LESLIE, Mortlach; MENDUM, England; PATERSON, Larbert; RHIND, Forfar; SANG, Scotland; SCOTT, East Kilbride; STOREY, New Monkland; THORNTON, Shotts; WADDELL, New Monkland; WILKIE, New Monkland; WILKIE, Tannadice; WYLLIE, Lethnot and Navar; YOUNG, Keith
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TunjiLees
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Dr. Oladipo James Olaore
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Great Forfarian, you've definitely cleared up a lot of things.
Does it the certificate have the age of Helen at her death?
So Helen was the daughter of John, interesting.
That means John Lamb had at least four children by Helen Seydie/Siddie:
-Marjory Lamb, b. ?
-Helen Lamb, b. ?
-James Lamb, b. 1809
-McPherson Cunningham Lamb, b. 1815
Then Helen Lamb had an illegitimate child with Alexander Ross in Washington/Meigle, Perth:
-Alexander Ross, b 1835
Helen Lamb then married Andrew Murray and according to IGI had at least four children:
-Jane Murray, b. 1842
-Marjory Murray, b. 1844
-William Murray, b. 1850
-Andrew Murray, b. 1853
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breaky
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Posts: 39
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Here's the 1842 marriage at Meigle
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Forfarian
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Does the certificate have the age of Helen at her death?
65. But she was 38 in 1851, 48 in 1861 and 58 in 1871, giving a birth date of 1812/3
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Researching
AITKENHEAD, Lanarkshire; BINNY, Forfar; BLACK, New Monkland; BRYSON, Cumbernauld; BURGESS, North-East Scotland; CRUICKSHANK, Rothes; DALLAS, Botriphnie; DAVIDSON, Oyne; HOGG, Larbert; LESLIE, Rothes; LESLIE, Mortlach; MENDUM, England; PATERSON, Larbert; RHIND, Forfar; SANG, Scotland; SCOTT, East Kilbride; STOREY, New Monkland; THORNTON, Shotts; WADDELL, New Monkland; WILKIE, New Monkland; WILKIE, Tannadice; WYLLIE, Lethnot and Navar; YOUNG, Keith
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TunjiLees
RootsChat Senior
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Posts: 263
Dr. Oladipo James Olaore
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I believe that I have now gone as far as I can now with my Lamb ancestry research without consulting the General Register Office in Edinburgh, and I would like to sincerely thank breaky & Forfarian for all the help they have given me.
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Pages: 1 2 3 [4]
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Murray_Lamb.jpg