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Topic: Where or What is Camlin? (Read 2307 times)
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Brie
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 380
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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I wonder if anyone can help me. We have a letter written by my ggg grandfather in which he states that his father was a William Phibbs Irwin. He also mentions his cousin General Irwin who had just died c1890 aged about 80 so I was able to trace him and through him the parents. That generation all seem to have been born at Camlin.
I cannot find Camlin as a place but I have recently found ahouse called Camlin in which some Irwins lived. So could somebody enlighten me as to whether or not there is a Camlin village/hamlet etc or does Camlin definately mean the house.
Also does anyone have any idea whether or not there is anything written about the Irwins anywhere.
Thanks
Brie
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Suziesmith37
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 386
'All In The Balance'
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Some facts from Camlin Civil Parish circa 1837
Parish of Camlin or Crumlin.
It is a parish in the Upper Massereene, county of Antrim and province of Ulster. (Ireland)
Apparantly situated on Lough Neagh.
Does this tie in at all with what you have?
Su
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Pat. side:Barker, Richards. Williams, Brewer, Chapman, Pascoe, Hill - St.Keverne, Redruth, Cornwall
Mat. side:Thomas, Richards, Viant - Falmouth, Padstow,Redruth, Cornwall & Devon. Law - Cornwall, Wales and London
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Brie
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 380
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Thanks for the prompt reply.
Unfortunately it doesn't really fit as we know the family came from Southern Ireland.
Best wishes
Brie
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Suziesmith37
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 386
'All In The Balance'
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Also there is a mention of some tithe payments to a John Irwin esq. of Camlin (landlord) by an Easky at Ballymeeny Sligo County. (1824)
To start you off if you just do a search on a web site - put in William Phibbs Irwin Camlin Ireland and you will be quite surprised what may come up!
Have Fun
Su
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Pat. side:Barker, Richards. Williams, Brewer, Chapman, Pascoe, Hill - St.Keverne, Redruth, Cornwall
Mat. side:Thomas, Richards, Viant - Falmouth, Padstow,Redruth, Cornwall & Devon. Law - Cornwall, Wales and London
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Suziesmith37
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 386
'All In The Balance'
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Also mention of a Richard Phibbs Irwin to do with County Sligo races and a Captain Irwin. circa 1814.
Is it possible these are related to you in some way?
Su
A few more details would be quite helpful as to which part of Ireland you think your Camlin may be located in and a few other names for people to chase for you 
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Pat. side:Barker, Richards. Williams, Brewer, Chapman, Pascoe, Hill - St.Keverne, Redruth, Cornwall
Mat. side:Thomas, Richards, Viant - Falmouth, Padstow,Redruth, Cornwall & Devon. Law - Cornwall, Wales and London
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Brie
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 380
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello again,
Yes, I think these people are all relations but I can't quite work out how they connect and I am beginning to think I'm going to have to start saving and make a visit to Ireland. My father has always believed the family to be from the Roscommon/Sligo area. Also these Irwins hang around with Phibbses.
I have quite a bit more information from the letter but I haven't got that with me at the moment. I just didn't want to overload people. I will dig the letter out and the other bits of information - I may get a chance to do that this evening but if not I will tackle it on Monday as I'm working all weekend.
Thanks again
Brie
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aghadowey
Global Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 13569
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Have been trying to trace a family named Phibbs as we have a very old Bible in my husband's house and found it to be very much a Sligo name. That Phibbs family seem to be connected to Armstrongs and Hamiltons and just yesterday I got some more leads to follow up in 1911 census. Get in touch if any of the names sound familar.
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Brie
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 380
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello
I'll try to keep it brief. As Suzy says if you search the names on the internet rather a lot comes up so I have bits of circumstantial evidence from that.
GG Grandpa William Irwin's (b 1821) cousin was General Irwin of the 88th Connaught Rangers. The General's father was called John and is referred to by William (b1821) as John of Camlin, Ct. Roscommon. William's (1821) father was called William Phibbs Irwin and was the younger brother of John.
On IGI members of the Church of LDS has submitted the following. John Irwin b.1816 and Rebecca Phibbs and a list of children including a John b. 1762 and a younger son William b. 1768. This looks right especially as Rebecca's father is called Harloe Phibbs and Harlow is a tradional name in my family. But I don't have any proper verifycation and don't know from where this information was obtained.
There is a Wlliam Phibe Irwin on IGI who marries an Ann Kelly 1795 (but in Scotland) Again I haven't any independant verifycation.
In 1827 a newspaper report refers to an Ann Honoria Kelly relict of William Phibbs Irwin marrying D'Arcy Mahon.
1837 Ann and D'Arcy are appealing in the House of Lords on behalf of Ann's son William (a minor) by William Phibbs Irwin. It doesn't say what the case was about but I do know that William (1821) inherited land from his mother which he lost under the Encumbered Estates Act. I have no proof that Ann Honoria and this William Phibbs Irwin are William's (1821) parents but the circumstantial evidence is stacking up.
I suppose I need William's (1821) birth certificate. He was born in Ireland but I don't know where. Any ideas how I obtain this if it is possible? And also exactly what Camlin was/is as I could then possibly find where the relevant records would be kept.
And finally, sorry to be so long William (1821) writes he has "been at the house of his father's cousin, one Col. Irwin of the Sligo Militia and seen the original grant of Lands in Roscommon and Sligo from Henry Cromwell, the Protector's son, to a Colonel of the same name, who was a founder of the Irish branch of the family.... " This person I can't pin down at all.
In answer to an earlier post I'm sorry but I haven't found any Armstrongs or Hamiltons.
Thanks
Brie
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Suziesmith37
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 386
'All In The Balance'
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Hi Brie
What a fascinating ancestry you will have!
Now I think it is a case of joining the two up.
To revert back to your original query, it does sound as though the majority of your ancestors came from the more 'northerly ' Camlin. Perhaps they moved south and started naming their houses Camlin and even areas/roads/estates as Camlin (depending on their influence within the community!) I am of course guessing at this - the documentation you eventually find will tell you the facts.
Personally I have always found it easier to work from present day back - I do not know if they had birth certificates in 1821 (any experts please help here!  ) I think you may be back into the parish registers.
It may be worth liaising with aghadowey to see if you have any 'phibbs' in common.
Also on the Irish General page there are a couple of articles from Ticker who is the moderator here and they will give you some great sites to search on.
I couldn't see any other Camlins, but calling all Roscommon experts out there - please let Brie know if any different.
Sorry to generalise on lots of points, I wish I was a little more knowledable on Irish geography but not as yet!
Good Luck Brie and stick at it. 
Su
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Pat. side:Barker, Richards. Williams, Brewer, Chapman, Pascoe, Hill - St.Keverne, Redruth, Cornwall
Mat. side:Thomas, Richards, Viant - Falmouth, Padstow,Redruth, Cornwall & Devon. Law - Cornwall, Wales and London
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aghadowey
Global Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 13569
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Civil registration of births, deaths and Catholic marriages started in 1864 (non-catholic marriages from 1845)- for earlier dates you need to search for church records (if they still exist).
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Darwinsmom
RootsChat Pioneer
Posts: 1
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello there!
I was delighted to see your post - I've been searching for you (or anyone in your lineage) for about five years! Camlin House, located just south of Boyle, Co. Roscommon, was one of the Irwin estates and the house still stands. If you go to Google Earth and go to the following coordinates, you can see it for yourself: 53 degrees, 54' 29.24"W and 8 degrees, 18' 27.66"W. If you type Boyle, Co. Roscommon, Ireland into the Google Earth search box and hit "enter", you will find yourself starting out north of Camlin. Look south and you will see two lakes close together just a little east of the direct line south from Boyle. Now look south-southwest and you will see a small lake that looks like the hull of a boat. Look west of that lake (Treanamarly Lough), and you will see a small river that heads west from the narrow tip of the boat shape. Simply follow that river west and you will see a house that casts a north-facing shadow. That is Camlin House! There is a village named Camlin as well, just a little southeast of the estate. The townland is also called Camlin, the civil parish is Estersnow, in the Barony of Boyle. Any reference to the Irwin estate would probably call it Camlin House, not merely Camlin.
My interest in Camlin House stems from a family mystery I've been trying to unravel for many years. It seems that my gggGrandfather, John McWilliam, may have been an employee of John Irwin from around 1840 to 1863, when all of the family except my ggGrandfather immigrated to New Zealand. John and his wife Rebecca apparently lived at the gatehouse at Camlin, although there is no sign of a gatehouse any more.
You may email me off the board if you'd like. I have a few more details about Camlin House, but not much. I would be most interested in collaborating on research into your Irwins in case anything turns up about the estate and its employees. My email address is darwinsmomATrogersDOTcom. I hope this at least helps you to see where your people came from.
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Brie
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 380
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Thanks for all your help. As I am back to the end of the 1700s I think as Darwinsmom has suggested I need to approach the local library and see if they know of any archives, records etc.
And Aghadowey, if I find any Armstrongs or Hamiltons I will let you know.
Brie
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Suziesmith37
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 386
'All In The Balance'
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Hi Brie
Thanks for PM.
Back to the 1700's! Can't be bad, I am only just getting to the late 1700 
It gets so much harder as you become reliant on documents and bits mentioned here and there!
Hope the Library visit is a success
Su
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Pat. side:Barker, Richards. Williams, Brewer, Chapman, Pascoe, Hill - St.Keverne, Redruth, Cornwall
Mat. side:Thomas, Richards, Viant - Falmouth, Padstow,Redruth, Cornwall & Devon. Law - Cornwall, Wales and London
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abbeyview
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 2
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hi Brie
My gt gt gdmother (my ancestors were late "marry-ers") was Mary Irwin b1801 at Camlin co Roscomon as described by Darwinsmom. She married Caleb Robertson of Boyle. The C of I clergy for Estersnow parish must have been very thorough as it was easy on the IGI to trace Mary's ancestry back:-
Mary's brother John Irwin III of Camlin 1800-1842, married Emily Bolton
Mary's father John Irwin II of Camlin 1762-1842, md Elizabeth O'Malley
John II's parents John Irwin I of Camin 1716-91 and Rebecca Phibbs married at Camlin 1757
John Irwin I's parents - Thoms Irwin II b 1763 Camlin & Ann Walker m 1700 t Granny (which seems to be a big house near Camlin)
Thomas Irwin II's parents - Thomas Irwin I b 1631 Camlin & Mary Jane Knott b c 1635 Camlin - this is mostly on IGI but it seems clearly the same family
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aghadowey
Global Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 13569
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Welcome to Rootschat abeyview but are you sure all the Iriwn records you mention did come from the church records? All the IGI entries I saw were submitted not extracted records and while the details could have from from the Parish records (of they still exist) you would need to check as there is no guarantee that submitted records are accurate.
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