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Topic: Old Sarum, Wiltshire (Read 847 times)
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stannarp
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Posts: 171
Terry Pratchett's Granny Weatherwax...
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Hi all,
In several references to and about one of my families - INGS, I've come across Old Sarum. When I googled Old Sarum, it seems to be an ancient earthwork near Salisbury (http://www.britainexpress.com/counties/wiltshire/ancient/Old-Sarum/index.htm).
However, the INGS family have put it down as a place of residence on a number of census returns - and when my g-grandparents moved to South Africa and settled in Vryheid, KZN at the turn of the century, they called their house in Vryheid Old Sarum as well, so the place obviously had huge significance for their family.
Questions ... IS there a suburb or parish of Salisbury called Old Sarum? Does anyone else have families that have Old Sarum as their place of abode? Does anyone live there now?
Forgive the ignorance, I've never been to Salisbury, or Old Sarum, and am somewhat curious about both name and place!
Regards,
Patricia
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ABBOTT:dorset; somerset
BENNET: south africa
CAVE: hampshire
EUDEY: redruth, cornwall; victoria; australia
FELTON: borley, essex
HARTILL: bilston, staffordshire
HERMANSSON/HERMANSON: sweden; SA; usa
INGS: wiltshire
MERCER: wiltshire
MINCHINGTON: somerset, dorset
PHILLIPS: australia
ROSE: somerset; wiltshire; SA
SADLER: somerset
SAUNDERS: wiltshire
SELLER: staffordshire, devon, australia, SA
STANNARD: norfolk; victoria, australia; SA
STREET: wiltshire
VINCENT: wiltshire
WARE: somerset
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PrueM
RootsChat Moderator
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Hi Patricia 
I'm not a local or an expert by any means, but I have been to Old Sarum!
These days it's an English Heritage or National Trust monument (one or the other, I don't remember), but back in the 19th century and beyond I imagine it would have all been farmland, or at least grazing land...if you go to the Old Maps website (http://www.old-maps.co.uk/indexmappage2.aspx) and put these coordinates in the "coordinates" boxes at the top of the window: 413900, 132600, and click "Search", you will be taken to a map showing Old Sarum in 1887 (hopefully!!). If you then click on the enlargement window (at bottom right of the attached pic) the map will enlarge in a new window. You'll see a farm hard up against the bank of Old Sarum, and other little places scattered about.
Hope that helps
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 oldsarum.jpg (141.14 KB, 744x338 - viewed 243 times.)
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Paper and Photograph Conservator
I live in NSW, and am researching:
BALFOUR (Derry) BIGG (Kent) BONSALL (DBY, NTT, CHS) BRISBANE (Fife) DANKS (STS) DOBSON (BRK) FRANCIS (ESS) GOODE (HAM) HAYNES (Cork) INGRAM (MDX, SOM) LANGWORTHY (Jersey, DEV) MCKAY (Fife, Aberdeen, Banff, Moray, Inverness) MORRISH (LND) NANCARROW (CON) OGILVIE (Moray, LND) STRATHDEE (Banff) SWAN (Fife) WOOD (LND)
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Newf
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20000 or bust .... whats a Marquessate anyway ?
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You might want to read 'SARUM' by Edward Rutherford - a weighty tome setting fictional characters against real places and events from the Iron Age to modern times around the Salisbury area. It deals at length with Old Sarum etc ....
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk PLEDGER 1678, Gt BardField, Essex EVERETT - 1830, Scoles, Norfolk & Epping, SX OSGATHORPE - 1825, North Kensington LILLEY 1711, Ickleton, Cambs DAVISON 1700-1710, Horncastle & Coningsby, Lincs BOWER 1690-1700, Killinworth, Lincs CHASE 1735, Kings Lynn, Norfolk LAIRD 1777, Portsmouth, Hants & Kings Lynn, Norfolk GOWENLOCK 1850, Carlisle KEW 1814, Carlisle |
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RichardK
RootsChat Member
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Posts: 210
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Sarum was at one time a reasonable sized town with Cathedral and market - but it is on a very windy exposed site with an unreliable water supply, so a new cathedral and new town were built nearby at the bottom of the hill closer to the river - this became 'New Sarum', and so the old town became 'Old Sarum'. Over time, 'New Sarum' has adopted the name Salisbury. Not only has Salisbury eclipsed Old Sarum - it also took trade and status from the nearby county town of Wilton, with Salisbury eventually becoming the county town. However, Old Sarum did not completely disappear - it just dwindled. In the 1832 reform act, Old Sarum was one of the 'Rotten Boroughs' - places which still elected their own members of parliament despite the fact that they had lost their historic importance (which was all the more unfair when you consider that large towns such as Manchester did not have their own Members of Parliament at that time).
Regards
Richard.
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Kelly, Birkenhead & Co. Kildare
Marshall, Luton & area
Reid, Co. Kildare & Dublin
Cox, Barnack Northamptonshire
Edwards, Pagham, Sussex & area
Scott, Roxburghshire & Perthshire
Mitchell, Warwickshire
Savage, Hampshire
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stannarp
RootsChat Member
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Terry Pratchett's Granny Weatherwax...
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Hi all,
Thanks for the information - good to get more of a feel for the place!
I've been trying to get hold of Edward Rutherford's book - mostly for my Dad, he would like to read it, but so would I - unfortunately it has been misfiled in the library. Will keep trying!
Regards,
Patricia
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ABBOTT:dorset; somerset
BENNET: south africa
CAVE: hampshire
EUDEY: redruth, cornwall; victoria; australia
FELTON: borley, essex
HARTILL: bilston, staffordshire
HERMANSSON/HERMANSON: sweden; SA; usa
INGS: wiltshire
MERCER: wiltshire
MINCHINGTON: somerset, dorset
PHILLIPS: australia
ROSE: somerset; wiltshire; SA
SADLER: somerset
SAUNDERS: wiltshire
SELLER: staffordshire, devon, australia, SA
STANNARD: norfolk; victoria, australia; SA
STREET: wiltshire
VINCENT: wiltshire
WARE: somerset
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Les de B
RootsChat Veteran
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Posts: 547
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IS there a suburb or parish of Salisbury called Old Sarum? Does anyone else have families that have Old Sarum as their place of abode?
Not an exact answer to your question, but fairly close. Here is part of the wording of my ggg grandfather's 1789 Marriage Certificate;
"Know all men by these presents that we Charles Harry Belin of the Close of Sarum, gentleman, and Joseph Corfe, of the City of New Sarum, gentleman are held and firmly bound to the Right Reverend Shute, Lord Bishop of Sarum............................."
Charles Belin was the groom and Joseph Corfe the father of the bride, who was the organist at Salisbury Cathedral.
Joseph's Will of 1814 indicates "........of the Close of New Sarum in the County of Wiltshire........."
So as well as your Old Sarum, you also have Sarum and New Sarum as well.
Les
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de Belin, Swindail, Willcock, Williams, Moore, Watts, Searjeant, Watson, McCready, Reid, Spink, de Lancey, Van Cortland, and of course, Smith!
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Newf
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20000 or bust .... whats a Marquessate anyway ?
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small world - we have a family of Biddlecombes, who were resident in the Close in 1841, by 1851 one of the sons has moved further west into Dorset and is an organist in a parish Church ....
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk PLEDGER 1678, Gt BardField, Essex EVERETT - 1830, Scoles, Norfolk & Epping, SX OSGATHORPE - 1825, North Kensington LILLEY 1711, Ickleton, Cambs DAVISON 1700-1710, Horncastle & Coningsby, Lincs BOWER 1690-1700, Killinworth, Lincs CHASE 1735, Kings Lynn, Norfolk LAIRD 1777, Portsmouth, Hants & Kings Lynn, Norfolk GOWENLOCK 1850, Carlisle KEW 1814, Carlisle |
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Les de B
RootsChat Veteran
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Posts: 547
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small world - we have a family of Biddlecombes, who were resident in the Close in 1841, by 1851 ...
Even a smaller world - the 1814 Will of Joseph Corfe I mentioned, was witnessed by T. T . Biddlecombe 
Les
PS: The world's getting smaller - Joseph Corfe's wife, Mary Corfe's 1823 Will - witness
"HJT Biddlecombe, day vicar of the Cathedral Church of Sarum"
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« Last Edit: Wednesday 16 April 08 10:16 BST (UK) by Les de B »
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de Belin, Swindail, Willcock, Williams, Moore, Watts, Searjeant, Watson, McCready, Reid, Spink, de Lancey, Van Cortland, and of course, Smith!
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Jebber
RootsChat Veteran
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Posts: 649
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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If it is of any interest, The Close is the enclosed area surrounding the Cathedral, a very prestigious place to live today.
Jebber
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CHOULES All
COLE Gt. Oakley, Essex.
DUNCAN Kent
HORSCROFT Kent.
KING Sturminster Newton, Dorset.
MONK Odiham, Hampshire.
RAM(M)EL(L), Kent.
WILKINS Stour Provost, Dorset.
WICKHAM All in North Essex.
WICKHAM Medway Towns, Kent from 1880
WICKHAM, Ipswich, Suffolk.
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Newf
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20000 or bust .... whats a Marquessate anyway ?
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My man was J T (James Thomas) Biddlecombe b1783 - Lay Vicar and Teacher of Music in 1841 / 51
suspect your 'Day' Vicar is in fact 'Lay' Vicar - so deffo the same chap !
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk PLEDGER 1678, Gt BardField, Essex EVERETT - 1830, Scoles, Norfolk & Epping, SX OSGATHORPE - 1825, North Kensington LILLEY 1711, Ickleton, Cambs DAVISON 1700-1710, Horncastle & Coningsby, Lincs BOWER 1690-1700, Killinworth, Lincs CHASE 1735, Kings Lynn, Norfolk LAIRD 1777, Portsmouth, Hants & Kings Lynn, Norfolk GOWENLOCK 1850, Carlisle KEW 1814, Carlisle |
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Les de B
RootsChat Veteran
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Posts: 547
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My man was J T (James Thomas) Biddlecombe b1783 - Lay Vicar and Teacher of Music in 1841 / 51
Yes, you are correct. Its my deciphering of the old hand writing. I thought it was " T T" but yes, its "J T". And where I had "H J T", it is "J T". I can now see the "H" is actually a mark in front of everybody's signature, so as to indicate where to sign. So, is the same person - a small world 
Les
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de Belin, Swindail, Willcock, Williams, Moore, Watts, Searjeant, Watson, McCready, Reid, Spink, de Lancey, Van Cortland, and of course, Smith!
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willowjaz
RootsChat Extra
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Posts: 3
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hi,
My great great grandfather was James Thomas Biddlecombe the Lay Vicar from Salisbury Cathedral. The organist mentioned was my great grandfather William Henry Biddlecombe who moved to Lyme Regis as the organist. Have lots of information on both these but as yet have not found James Thomas Biddlecombe's parents. Any help would be appreciated.
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Les de B
RootsChat Veteran
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Hi Willowjaz
Sorry, I can't help you any further on the Biddlecombe line, as that name is only a witness to my ancestors' Will.
Hopefully Newfster can help you as her(?)/his(?) posting indicates "we have a family of Biddlecombes".
If you don't get a reply from Newfster from your interest under this topic, you can send a "PM" (i.e. personal message) direct, or create a new topic on that family.
I see this was your first posting at RootsChat, and from memory I think you have to have 5 postings before you can post a PM (helps stops Spammers).
Anyway, you should rack up 5 postings at RootsChat - its a great/friendly site for family research - "welcome aboard"
Les
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de Belin, Swindail, Willcock, Williams, Moore, Watts, Searjeant, Watson, McCready, Reid, Spink, de Lancey, Van Cortland, and of course, Smith!
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Newf
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20000 or bust .... whats a Marquessate anyway ?
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Hi - we didnt get any further back with JT (c1783, Salisbury) altho we are pretty sure that he married Mary Ann Randall in Aug 1804 at St Edmunds.
Have followed the relevant to us family members to Lyme Regis / Uplyme, Sampford Peverell to Silverton then NW London Willesden and finally Bracknell..
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk PLEDGER 1678, Gt BardField, Essex EVERETT - 1830, Scoles, Norfolk & Epping, SX OSGATHORPE - 1825, North Kensington LILLEY 1711, Ickleton, Cambs DAVISON 1700-1710, Horncastle & Coningsby, Lincs BOWER 1690-1700, Killinworth, Lincs CHASE 1735, Kings Lynn, Norfolk LAIRD 1777, Portsmouth, Hants & Kings Lynn, Norfolk GOWENLOCK 1850, Carlisle KEW 1814, Carlisle |
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