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Author Topic: RUSSIA: Relative born in Russia  (Read 406 times)
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RUSSIA: Relative born in Russia
« on: Friday 25 April 08 04:48 BST (UK) »

Just wondering if anyone can help me find a relative born in Russia?

My GG Grandmother, Annie Clark (nee Hodgson) was born in 1871 in Russia (as listed in family records and the 1901 census).
In the census she is listed as a 'British Subject' so I am thinking that she had been through some sort of process to be naturalised.

At some point she married my GG Grandfather, John Clark, however I am unable to find any records of the marriage.  I do know that they had 5 children born from abt 1890 to 1905, and have further information on this.

Given this info I'm guessing that she immigrated between 1871 and 1890 but am unsure how to search for any relevant records...

With thanks in advance for any help, advice, hints or tips!
« Last Edit: Friday 25 April 08 11:51 BST (UK) by Berlin-Bob » Logged

Edgley (East London); Cope (East London); Clark; Hodson (Lancs); Major (East London); Horsman(East London); Winter; Pollak (Austria); Munk (Austria)
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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #1 on: Friday 25 April 08 05:25 BST (UK) »

Hi

As I understand it - it's probably the opposite  - she was very possibly a "military" child (Army, or perhaps Naval) and was born in the country in which her British father was stationed at the time. It was common for Military men to have their wives and children along with them. This scenario makes Annie  a "British Subject" by birthright (but born on foreign soil) and therefore she neither immigrated as a foreigner to England nor had to be Naturalised as English - when her Military father returned home, so simply did his wife and child(ren).

You say you have her on the 1901?   Do you have them on the 1891?

Cheers
AMBLY
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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #2 on: Friday 25 April 08 05:33 BST (UK) »

oh... I didn't know this - great info!

I do have her in the 1901 census, but have not had any luck with census records further back than this. 

In the 1901 census it "husband absent" so I have no further info on her husband other than the knowledge that his name was John.  At this time 4 of their 5 children had been born (Nancy 1901, Margery abt 1892, John 1896, Kate), but only two are listed as in the family home so this adds to the mystery on their location.

I know Annie's mothers name was Joan but I don't have her father's name to search military records... 

Do you have any ideas on where I could look?
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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #3 on: Friday 25 April 08 05:39 BST (UK) »

Hi

I'm just having a wee look now at an 1891 family in London  -  I think it's them - but the father is named as Robert (he is Scots)....they have a daughter 2 weeks old , named Marjorie......

This birth on FREEBMD - I bet is the daughter
Births Jun 1891  - Edmonton - 31, Vol pg 342
Marjorie Joan CLARK

Hang on a tick!!

Cheers
AMBLY
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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #4 on: Friday 25 April 08 05:47 BST (UK) »

excellent!

I did find an Annie Clark married to Robert Clark in Middlesex in the 1891 census... perhaps this is them???

I know his father was a Presbytarian minister in Scotland so he may well have been born there - its sounding promising!

I'll get birth certs when we are a little more certain...
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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #5 on: Friday 25 April 08 05:49 BST (UK) »

I also have Marjorie(Margery)'s marriage record - she married William Sparks in 1918 (1a, 1219) and her name was listed as Margery JL Clark so seems to be aligning somewhat too...  Grin
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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #6 on: Friday 25 April 08 05:54 BST (UK) »

Hi

Yes, I think it may be them!

1891: 15 Varlry Road, Tottenham, Middlesex
Head: Robert CLARK 38. at Checkbook Manufactory , b Dumfries
Wife: Annie CLARK 26, b Russia British Subject
Dau: Marjorie CLARK 2 weeks, b London
Nurse: ELiza CONNOR 42,  b Buckley, North Wales
RG12 /  Piece: 1072 /  Folio 121 /  Page 25
(Tottenham fell into the Edmonton registration District)

Now in 1901, your Annie was aged 30, listed as wife with  "husband absent"  and in Wanstead, Essex with son John age 5 and Nancy age 1, and a number of servants...

Will see if I can spot Robert and Marjorie in 1901 -  maybe he had a middle name of John.....

cheers
AMBLY
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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #7 on: Friday 25 April 08 06:39 BST (UK) »

 Think I've had some luck with the 1881 census Smiley - but it doesn't help me understand why all the children were born in Russia...  Huh Doesn't seem to be a link to the military...

Its is only circumstantial but its another potential lead....

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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #8 on: Friday 25 April 08 08:00 BST (UK) »

That does look promising!  Grin
Perhaps the link to Russia was enterprise, not military....

There is at least one other child - and he is on the IGI as a submited record
Christopher Alfred HODSON born 1852 Moscow, died 1921
Parents: James HODSON and Joan McGILL

He (Christopher)  is married and in Farnsworth in 1881.

Hmm - if this is your Annie;s family  - Joan is a relatively uncommon name, and often associated with Scotland in those times - seems a big coincidence that she married a man whose mother was also named Joan and possibly scottish - Stranger things have happened, though I guess!

cheers
AMBLY
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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #9 on: Friday 25 April 08 08:13 BST (UK) »

Hi

Have you got access to An**cest**ry?
Someone has a tree on there, with those HODSON's on it.
And it looks like yours.
The tree has the daughter Annie  married to Robert CLARK and their children as:
Jack, Kitty, Margot, Nancye and Robin

It doesn't have any marrriage date, and no parent or any BMD details for Robert.

cheers
AMBLY
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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #10 on: Friday 25 April 08 08:20 BST (UK) »

Unfortunately not! Cry

...this is my family Nancye is my Great Grandmother and that is her siblings! Cheesy
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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #11 on: Friday 25 April 08 08:36 BST (UK) »

I've just popped something up on a message board - hopefully I can make a connection with someone!

That was a fantastic find! Cheesy
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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #12 on: Friday 25 April 08 08:51 BST (UK) »

Hi All,

just a thought,

I wonder if it was Prussia and not Russia, although appearing so often, it may well be correct.

The reason for this thought, is that there were a at least two topics on RootsChat about textile workers going to PRUSSIA, because the british textile industry was more advanced than Germany's.
(no time to look now but maybe a RootsChat search for textile schlesien or textile germany might find them.
Topic: CASSIDY emigrated to Germany
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,280109.0.html
Topic: Batley woollen workers, Germany 1880s
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,34233.0.html

But whether Russia or Prussia, the reason might be the same.

This thought came to me on seeing AMBLY's idea
Quote
Perhaps the link to Russia was enterprise, not military....
and familytreeresearch's item
Quote
Retired Cotton Spinner Living On Dividends & Interest 

just a thought
Bob
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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #13 on: Friday 25 April 08 09:39 BST (UK) »

Suspect that the family were in Russia (perhaps Moscow?) and that the father had some connection to linen/textile industry. Know of other British families who also lived in Russia connected to linen trade but left Russia between 1900 and 1917.
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Re: Relative born in Russia
« Reply #14 on: Friday 25 April 08 09:44 BST (UK) »

Hi

I have found more infomation  - part of it dated approx 1920 written I think by James' son Christopher Alfred

It says the HODSONs got their cotton manufacturing experiences at Townhead Mills in Rochdale.
So did a John KONSHIN  a rich Russian gentleman who became he first man to start cotton manufacturing in the Moscow district, and it was through him that the Hodsons went out to Russia.

There is extensive info. [

It is clearly your Nancye's line

I will PM you

Cheers
AMBLY
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