Welcome, Guest. Please login or register for free.
Did you miss your activation email?
Friday 27 November 09 13:59 UTC (UK)
Welcome Home Help Surnames Library Shop Search Login Register

+  RootsChat.Com
|-+  Research in Other Countries
| |-+  Europe (Moderator: Berlin-Bob)
| | |-+  decipher / translate Fürhrungs-Buch from 1880s
« previous next »
Pages: 1 [2] Print
Author Topic: decipher / translate Fürhrungs-Buch from 1880s  (Read 912 times)
scrimnet
RootsChat Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate
*****
Posts: 4720


No plan ever survives first contact...


WWW
Re: decipher / translate Fürhrungs-Buch from 1880s
« Reply #15 on: Friday 06 June 08 19:03 UTC (UK) »
Bob asked on the Armed Forces board if there is a British version of this...Well yes there is and was!

What we are looking at is the German Naval equivalent of a Regimental Conduct Sheet. Some lesser offences are found on a company or squadron conduct sheet.

If one looks on some of the pre WW1 and WW1 attestation sheets, one can find a page with some very similar offences!

I would say that carelessness with his clothing would translate over as a slovenly soldier! I am reminded of Kipling...

"The 'ethen in his blindness bows down to wood and stone
'E don't obey no orders unless they is his own,
'E leaves his side arms awful he leaves them all about...
Then up comes the Regiment, and pokes the 'ethen out!"

Grin Grin

He could have just lost issued items of clothing...Perhaps whilst swimming in full kit...Perhaps he was a bit squiffy

Detachment is well, detachment!

This would be a body of men, detached from their normal duties and sent elsewhere to help out etc.

A WW1 simile would be a platoon sent off to dig trenches for another unit or to fill in gaps betwixt units in the field.

Penalty guard duties, again for slovenly behaviour in not making a proper check as to whom is entering barracks...We call these "Extras" as in extra duties! I have certainly  given these out as verbal orders and not written ones or told the Sgt Major to deliver them without bringing the soldier in question before me on orders...He seems to have got off a bit light with just the x2!

A Regimental Sergeant Major may just hold up the corresponding number of fingers for extras or just say "take four!" These are for mess infringements such as passing the port the wrong way in the Sgts Mess!!


Hope this doesn't muddy the waters too much!

Any more "help" I can offer just ask!
Logged
One more charge and then be dumb,
            When the forts of Folly fall,
        May the victors when they come
            Find my body near the wall.
Lambendsor (aka IGS)
RootsChat Veteran
*****
Posts: 597



WWW
Re: decipher / translate Fürhrungs-Buch from 1880s
« Reply #16 on: Friday 06 June 08 19:29 UTC (UK) »
Thank you all again for fleshing this out - and for airing my ancestor's naughtiness!

I think what has been deciphered as Wehrt. [i.e. Wehrtechnische] Division (on pages 2/3) is actually Werft Division - specifically Zweite[n?] Werft Division zu Wilhelmshaven (it's briefly described on page 142 of Handbuch für das Deutsche reiche auf das Jahr 1884). The way I posted the images may have confused things, so I've attached the tops of pages 2/3 and 4/5 for the sake of clarity.

Handw. Abtheil. 2  Werft.  Div.  vom 1/9.81. -  23.4.83

Handwerker, Abtheilung, 2. Werft Division vom 29.9.83 bis 31.3.84
Schiffszimmermann zum Abtheilungsdienst.


Also, I see now that I posted the pages out of order - page 9 should come right after page 3, for instance. And pages 6/7 should come after page 9 and before pages 4/5.



* chts1c.jpg (156.67 KB, 1000x190 - viewed 127 times.)

* chts2c.jpg (351.41 KB, 1000x425 - viewed 129 times.)
Logged
ENDSOR: Tamworth/Manchester
LAMB: Leeds/Manchester
SMITH: Manchester
HOLMES: Kirk Ireton/Manchester
WORTHINGTON: Middleton/Manchester
SHORROCK: Manchester
BROOKS: Wilmslow/Knutsford
By marriage in Manchester: BAXENDALE, DODD, EYERS, FIRTH, FISHER, FO(R)STER, HARGREAVES, J(A/E)RVIS, McKEOWN, OSBALDESTON, PICKWELL, PODMORE, SCHOFIELD, SHALLCROSS, STONES, WALKER
GREY, DOYLE, GOLDEN, MONAHAN: Ireland
HAWE, FRENEY, NARY: Co. Kilkenny
DONOHO and variants: Co. Longford
Berlin-Bob
Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate
*******
Posts: 5687


by: My Daughter. Chatting to find her Roots !
Re: decipher / translate Fürhrungs-Buch from 1880s
« Reply #17 on: Friday 06 June 08 19:56 UTC (UK) »
Thanks Scrimnet, that has helped with some of the "vocabulary" Smiley
Logged
Searching for Coleman, Moore, Kallnung in London; Margulies, Remenyi in E. Europe;
Ancestors of Hessie Stevenson-Coleman-Baxter (Ireland, 1861)
and, of course, any other ancestors for my web-site.

All Census Data included in this post is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)
Lambendsor (aka IGS)
RootsChat Veteran
*****
Posts: 597



WWW
Re: decipher / translate Fürhrungs-Buch from 1880s
« Reply #18 on: Saturday 07 June 08 12:01 UTC (UK) »
Another follow-up:

Regarding this part on page 9:

Wilhelmshaven, den 23 April 1883 [not 1882].
Der Abtheilungsführer
[undecipherable signature]
Korvetten Kapitain

The 1884 Handbuch (on page 143, regarding the staff of the Zweite Werft-Division zu Wilhelmshaven) lists:

Führer der II. (Handwerker) Abtheilung: Frhr. v. Röffing, Korvetten Kapitain

Does anyone think the "undecipherable signature" could be "Frhr. v. Röffing"?

* chts4b.jpg (103.12 KB, 588x281 - viewed 116 times.)
Logged
ENDSOR: Tamworth/Manchester
LAMB: Leeds/Manchester
SMITH: Manchester
HOLMES: Kirk Ireton/Manchester
WORTHINGTON: Middleton/Manchester
SHORROCK: Manchester
BROOKS: Wilmslow/Knutsford
By marriage in Manchester: BAXENDALE, DODD, EYERS, FIRTH, FISHER, FO(R)STER, HARGREAVES, J(A/E)RVIS, McKEOWN, OSBALDESTON, PICKWELL, PODMORE, SCHOFIELD, SHALLCROSS, STONES, WALKER
GREY, DOYLE, GOLDEN, MONAHAN: Ireland
HAWE, FRENEY, NARY: Co. Kilkenny
DONOHO and variants: Co. Longford
Berlin-Bob
Moderator
RootsChat Marquessate
*******
Posts: 5687


by: My Daughter. Chatting to find her Roots !
Re: decipher / translate Fürhrungs-Buch from 1880s
« Reply #19 on: Saturday 07 June 08 12:12 UTC (UK) »
I wouldn't like to say, it looks as if it could be.

"Frhr. v. ... "  = Freiherr von .... i.e. a 'von ....

Trivia, or background information (as you wish  Grin ):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freiherr
Quote
A German Freiherr is called "Baron" in English: the function was practically the same, although the title was derived separately in the English and German languages. [...] the titles are now legally considered to be simply part of the family name (with the former title following the first name, e.g. Georg Freiherr von Platz), and they may or may not be used. They do, however, have prestige in some circles of society, ....

Interestingly, Robert Graves (I, Claudius) is known in Germany as Robert von Ranke-Graves, as his mother was a "von Ranke" and, presumably, the publishers probably thought his books would sell better if they mentioned the 'von' connection  Grin

It has now been very "watered down".
I know several 'von ....' here, but all of them tend to leave it off when introducing themselves and only use it for signing official documents, as "officialdom" insists.
Logged
Searching for Coleman, Moore, Kallnung in London; Margulies, Remenyi in E. Europe;
Ancestors of Hessie Stevenson-Coleman-Baxter (Ireland, 1861)
and, of course, any other ancestors for my web-site.

All Census Data included in this post is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)
Pages: 1 [2] Print 
« previous next »


[Copyright] [Shrink Link] [About Us] [Terms of Use]
All Census Lookups are Crown Copyright, National Archives for academic and non-commercial research purposes only
RootsChat.com cannot be held responsible directly or indirectly for the messages or content posted by others. Inline images in messages are the copyright of the respective linked sites.
RootsChat.com, Europa House, Bury, Lancashire, BL9 5BT

In loving memory of Eric George Davies, 1934-2009, the father of RootsChat.com































Powered by SMF 1.0.7 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC
0.775:21