|
Pages: [1] 2
|
 |
|
Author
|
Topic: DRIVING ME MAD cannot find Marriage (Read 929 times)
|
Perro
RootsChat Extra
 Offline
Posts: 84
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
I have my grandfather birth cert. It says Frederick Marshall Goold born 1890 father Frederick Monday Goold
mother Susan Coote
In the 1891 they are living together as Goold fam
In the 1901 they are living as Marshall family.
I cannot find a marriage cert. It is possible Susan was previously married but Frederick M Goold should be easy to find.....if anyone has any advice on how to go about finding the marriage or perhaps they never did get married.
Thanks ..... 
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
silvery
RootsChat Aristocrat
Offline
Posts: 1377
information Crown Copyright, from www.nation
|
Can you give the refs for the censuses?
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
silvery
RootsChat Aristocrat
Offline
Posts: 1377
information Crown Copyright, from www.nation
|
Birth Frederick Monday Goold Dec 1859 St Luke 1b/600
Have you got the 1861 census for Frederick
Rg 9/220/15/28 26 Bouverie St, Holborn, Whitefriars, St luke
Jane Frances Goald 36, head, wid, sewing machinist employing 2, b Holborn
Frances A 10
Charles W D 7
Frederick M 1
children all b St Luke
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
alison300
RootsChat Extra
 Online
Posts: 74
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
Just a thought, but ancestors of mine didn't get married until 17 years after the birth of their first child. On 2 census returns and the baptism/birth certs. for their children she says she is married ... i would never have searched that many years at the FRC so i'm very grateful to FreeBMD.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Wright (West Ham, Stratford, St Lukes, Cripplegate, Edmonton, Tottenham, Romford, Hendon, Brighton)
Swain (Cripplegate, St Lukes)
Wolfe (Cripplegate, Shoreditch)
Willis (Gt. Leighs, Margaretting, Gt. Waltham)
Rawles (Bethnal Green)
Cook (Rochford)
|
|
|
silvery
RootsChat Aristocrat
Offline
Posts: 1377
information Crown Copyright, from www.nation
|
Can anyone find them on the census of 1891/1901. I can't 
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Valda
RootsChat Marquessate
Offline
Posts: 6996
|
They seem to be living in both censuses 1891 and 1901 as Marshall
1901 census RG13 2 folio ?
66 Cirencester Street Paddington
Frederick Marshall 40 Head Married Driver Hackney Carriage London
Susan Marshall 36 Wife Married Kensington
Frederick Marshall 10 Son Kensington
Frank Marshall 7 Son Lambeth
Ernest Marshall 14 days Son Paddington
1891 census RG12 98 folio 37
27 Burne Street Marylebone
Frederick M Marshal 31 Head Married Painter & Decorator Finchey London
Susan J Marshal 26 Wife Married Holloway London
Frederick Marshal 5 months Son Notting Hill London
Births Dec 1866
Coote Susan J Islington 1b 206
Doesn't seem any issue for a legitimate birth for Frederick senior
FREDERICK MONDAY GOOLD
Birth: 04 SEP 1859
Christening: 26 OCT 1859 Saint Pauls Bunhill Row, Finsbury, London
Father: CHARLES GOOLD
Mother: JANE FRANCES
Marriages Jun 1850
Goold Charles St Lukes 2 332
Monday Jane Frances S Lukes 2 332
1871 census RG10 90 folio 73
11 Oxford Street Chelsea
Peter Coote 36 Head Married Labourer Ashden Essex
Mary Coote 37Wife Married Mangaling St Mary le Bone
William Coote 9 Son Ashden Essex
Emma Coote 7 Daughter Islington Middlesex
Susan Coote 4 Daughter Islington Middlesex
Susan still with her family on the 1881 census at the same address in Chelsea.
Regards
Valda
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Crazy Robert
RootsChat Aristocrat
Offline
Posts: 1049
crazy !!!! Crazy !!!!
|
Hi,
Name: Frederick Marshall Goold
Year of Registration: 1890
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
District: Kensington
County: Greater London, London, Middlesex
Volume: 1a
Page: 127
Name: Frederick Monday Goold
Year of Registration: 1859
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
District: St Luke
County: Middlesex
Volume: 1b
Page: 600
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukCoble or Covell, Coule Australia, Canada, USA @ England.
Barker Australia @ England
Walker Australia, England @ South America.
Bristol Australia @ England.
Nash Australia @ England.
Wildman @ Australia.
many more other Names.
|
|
|
Valda
RootsChat Marquessate
Offline
Posts: 6996
|
Frederick was still with his mother on the 1871 census
RG10 559 folio 133
1 Dimmond? Row Mile End Old Town
Jane F Goold 45 Head Widow Baby Linen Needlewoman London Middlesex
Frederick Goold 11 Son St Lukes Middlesex
Jane Frances Goold was living with her married daughter Frances Ann Scott and her family in Lambeth on the 1881 census. With them is another daughter Cecilia Jane aged 29 born Greenwich Kent - though she doesn't appear on any earlier censuses, or the civil registration so perhaps there is a mistake on this census concerning her?
FRANCES ANNE GOOLD
Birth: 28 FEB 1851
Christening: 30 MAR 1851 Saint Pauls Bunhill Row, Finsbury, London
Father: CHARLES GOOLD
Mother: JANE FRANCES
CHARLES WILLIAM DREW GOOLD
Birth: 15 JUL 1853
Christening: 07 AUG 1853 Saint Pauls Bunhill Row, Finsbury, London
Father: CHARLES GOOLD
Mother: JANE FRANCES
HENRY JAMES GOULD
Birth: 26 SEP 1856
Christening: 31 OCT 1856 Saint Pauls Bunhill Row, Finsbury, London,
Father: CHARLES GOULD
Mother: JANE FRANCES
(Henry was with the Mondays in St Martin in the Fields on the 1861 and 1871 censuses - their nephew)
Marriages Dec 1878
Goold Frances Anne Holborn 1b 1091
SCOTT Thomas Holborn 1b 1091
Death of the father Charles
Deaths Dec 1859
Goold Charles St Luke 1b 416
None of this explains the use of the alias Marshall in use on the 1891 and 1901 censuses but it narrows down the time period. If the reason has anything to do with Susan J Coote then it occurred after the 1881 census when she was still living with her parents. If it is to do with Frederick Monday Goold than it occurred after 1871 when he was living with his mother.
Regards
Valda
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Perro
RootsChat Extra
Offline
Posts: 84
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
It took me years to find out all the info above and I ordered Peter Coote & Mary Field marriage cert. It gives her father as George deceased so I tried to find out if Georges wife was a Marshall but came unstuck with that. There seam to be as many Fields as there are say Brown's particular George and Mary Field's.
Susan Coote remarried c1910 as she had a daughter Rose Marshall Daly which looks as if the name is her side.
Frederick M Goold is in Hull North Cave in 1881 census.
I have searched FreeBMD for years and keep having another go every few months I have tried ticking the sound like box I have tried Fred allsorts nothing for either Susan or Frederick Monday. Monday was his mothers maiden name. She was the daughter of Wm Monday cabinet maker
Frederick Marshall Goold died in 1964 and his wife had quite a time getting her pension as it appeared there was no Frederick Marshall only as a Christian name.
So the family have used Marshall since 1909 when Frederick joined the Navy. I would love to know where the Marshall came from but its possible I will never find out.
Thank you so much one and all for your welcome efforts.
Kind regards.....
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Perro
RootsChat Extra
Offline
Posts: 84
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
Forgot to say re Cecilla Jane, Goold she was the wife of Chas Wm Drew Goold who was an actor and did not apper to live together in the following years.
I did find out where the Drew came in, it was two Monday sisters married Joesph Drew lived in Weymouth and Jersey or Gurnsey area.
The Scotts went to live in Brighton and had a shop in 1901.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Valda
RootsChat Marquessate
Offline
Posts: 6996
|
I would say from at least the 1891 census the family was using Marshall as their surname in everyday life because censuses usually reflect the surname the family were known by, by their neighbours. On anything legal howver, as evidenced by Frederick Marshall Goold's birth certificate they used Goold. Though the other Goold siblings carried on as Goold e.g.
J 77/554/16920 Divorce Court File: 16920. Appellant: Cecilia Jane Goold. Respondent: Charles William Drew Goold. Type: Wife's petition [wx]. 1895
Registers of Seaman's services
Name Marshall, Frederick Monday
Official Number: K3210
Place of Birth: Kensington, London
05 November 1890 ADM 188/873
Sp Frederick Junior became Frederick Monday Marshall instead of Frederick Marshall Goold.
Births Sep 1909
Daly Rose Marshall Kensington 1a 114
When did Frederick Monday Marshall/Goold die?
What was Susan's middle name? What was her 'second' husband's name?
Who is this? A connection or a coincidence?
Births Dec 1904
Marshall Florence Monday Sculcoates 9d 209
Deaths Dec 1904
MARSHALL Florence Monday 0 Sculcoates 9d 146
SCULCOATES REGISTRATION DISTRICT
Registration County : Yorkshire East Riding.
Created : 1.7.1837.
Abolished : 1.4.1937 (succeeded by Hull and Holderness districts).
Sub-districts : Cottingham; Drypool; East Sculcoates; Ferriby; Hedon; Hessle; Newland; Southcoates; Sutton; West Sculcoates.
An interesting coincidence, but still possibly a coincidence, given the whereabouts in England of FredericK Monday Marshall/Goold on the 1881 census (a Marshall family lived next door to Hotham Hall but that probably is a coincidence).
Regards
Valda
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Perro
RootsChat Extra
Offline
Posts: 84
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
Thank you VALDA so thats why they did not live together. It was very unusual to divorce in Victorian times for a lady to divorce. Wonder what he did or did not do!
Maybe Frederick Monday Goold just up and left Susan Jane nee Coote, and if they never married he would be free to do so. I have no death for him or any other info after the 1901, it will be very interesting to see what the 1911 turns up.
I think the birth in Sculcoates is worth sending for as it sounds too coincidental. May I thank you for the Navy record and number I might get a bit of info from that about his Naval records.
Its been very interesting to read all the comments and again my thanks to one and all for the interest and help given.
Kind Regards......Avril
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Valda
RootsChat Marquessate
Offline
Posts: 6996
|
Avril
The navy record you get order online from The National Archives from this website - their 'Documents online part of their website for which they have a standard charge
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documentsonline/
The divorce records you can order from their Catalogue section. This takes longer becaue they check the record and then tell you the charge as the records online in their catalogue are of vastly different sizes and types.
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/
Divorce was unusual before the end of the First World War as it was costly and therefore not really affordable for most people. After the First World War legal aid was established.
I thought it likely you were going to tell me you didn't know what happened to Frederick Monday Goold. In comparison to Frederick, so far Susan's life is more of an open book, so Frederick potentially is the more likely one to have caused the surname change.
After 1901 did Susan marry/live with Mr Daly or just have a child by him? Have you got her marriage?
What was Mr Daly's full name? As a bit of a wild shot was it Henry Thomas?
Do you know when Susan died and in what surname?
What happened to the other Goold brother - Henry James Goold. Did he like Charles William Drew Goold continue on in the surname Goold?
Regards
Valda
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Perro
RootsChat Extra
Offline
Posts: 84
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
Valda....thank you....I have the death of Susan June Coote 26/04/1952 and my grandfather was the person to sign it. She died 1070 Harrow Rd N.W.10 a widow of John Bernard Daly mattress maker.
Frank Goold's daughter Eileen is still living in London and can remember meeting her, but sadly does not know the tale. But says she had many children but lost a lot of them young.
Rose Marshall Daly did not marry and was last heard of in St Leonards by the sea. I am sorry but I cannot find Susan's marriage to John Bernard so it gets more of a mystery.
I will check out what I have on the other Goold's. Kind regards Avril
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2
|
|
|
|
|
