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Topic: MORRIS Family from Ruthin, Denbighshire (Read 449 times)
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POPPYSOXICLES
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hi
I am researching my Ancestors from Wales... The Morris family from Ruthin, Denibighshire.
My Great Great Grandfather was Isaac Morris born 1840 who married Mary Williams who was from Whitford, Holywell, Flintshire.. I am really stuck on trying to find out anymore information on Isaac.. I know the family had connections with the 'Three Pigeons Inn' in Ruthin .. Isaac and Mary had 4 children all boys Isiah,, born in Whitford, and the other three boys born in Liverpool..Edward, William Henry, and John who was my Great Grandfather.. He marriel an Isabella Louttit in Liverpool.. I did obtain a birth certificate for Isaac but I do not know if it is the correct one as it only has his mothers name on it.. Ann Morris.. anyone with any information or help would be greatly appreciated.. many thanks.
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« Last Edit: Sunday 29 June 08 17:59 BST (UK) by Berlin-Bob »
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jorose
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Start with what you know - I can see the family in 1881, 71 Jacob Street, Toxteth Park, in which Isaac is aged 44 (b. abt 1837?), b. Ruthin, Mary, 46, b. Loe, children Isiah, William Henry, and John. In 1871 they are also in Toxteth Park:
RG10/3806 folio ? page 6
Isiacie(?) Morris, 30, labourer, b. ??andyrnor (?)
Mary, wife, 35, b. Loe
Edward, 3, b. Liverpool.
Isiah, 1, b. Loe
(by 1901 he seems to be aged 62, b. Ruthin).
Now, do you have the marriage of Isaac and Mary, and what information does it contain? I presume you have Mary's maiden name from one of the children's birth certificates.
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POPPYSOXICLES
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Thankyou Annie... I found the information interesting,,,, My Great Great Grandfather was left a share in the pub but he refused it !!! shame really..I would love to find out more.. plan on visiting there soon.. thanks! Poppy.. 
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POPPYSOXICLES
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Hi Jorose
I have just found the registration of Isaac and Marys marriage... 1857 Llangyniew, St Cynyw, Powys, Welshpool, North Wales... I have my doubts whether it is them or not... as Edward was not born until 1868.. unless it is them and they worked in service or something like that.. on the marriage cetificate.. no fathers names becacuse of them being widowed.. Iwas really gutted when I received the certificate.. I have searched and searched but cannot find anymore Isaac Morris and Mary williams.. all the best Poppy
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Tati
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Isiacie(?) Morris, 30, labourer, b. ??andyrnor (?)
Could this be Llandyrnog as per the christening?
Isaac Morris
Christening 01 MAR 1840 Llandyrnog, Denbighshire
Mother Ann Morris
Interestingly, searching for other children in the same batch with mother Ann Morris, there is:
Edward Morris or Prichard
Christening 6 November 1837 Llandyrnog, Denbighshire
Father Edward Prichard, Mother Anne Morris
and
Elizabeth Morris or Jones
Christening 2 June 1843 Llandyrnog, Denbighshire
Father John Jones, Mother Anne Morris
(Not saying it's the same Anne but it's a possibility)
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« Last Edit: Friday 04 July 08 08:41 BST (UK) by Tati »
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"My dear, I think the English pronounce it 'appiness" Desire and hunger is the fire I breathe Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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jorose
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As Mary was already in her thirties when Edward was born, and appears to have been older than Isaac, she may have been married twice.
What is the age of the Isaac on the 1857 marriage certificate? If yours was really born 1840-ish he would have been quite young there (especially if he was already widowed).
Even for a widower, though, the father's name should be listed. No father's name generally indicates illegitimacy. I guess the best thing to do would be to look into the history of the pub and see if there's any Morrises connected with it.
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hiraeth
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Hi Poppy
Llandyrnog is about 3 miles from Ruthin so the baptism for Isaac could be the correct one. http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/DEN/Llandyrnog/
Is the date of birth on the certificate close to the christening date? North Wales BMD only has the one Isaac Morris in 1840.
What we need to do now is ask Paul if he could look for an Ann Morris baptism for you in Ruthin c1815-1820. I have checked the parish register transcripts 1592-1812 - and the good news is there are a lot of MORRISes in there - unfortunately your Ann doesn't appear to be one of them - probably too early. But if we can find her baptism and names for her parents it may well be possible for you to trace Isaac's mother's family back a lot further.
Heather
PS I forgot to say that the parish register transcripts for Llandyrnog are also available from the Clwyd FHS or through Genfair.
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukCARRINGTON, ROBERTS, WILLIAMS, FOULKES, WYNN, BLUNT, JONES Denbighshire. DAVIES, OWEN, JONES, WILLIAMS, THOMAS, EVANS, MORGAN, SOLOMAN, GRIFFITHS Caernarfonshire & Anglesey THATCHER, HILLIER, PARISH Surrey APPLETON, MALTHOUSE, GLOVER Hertfordshire MCDONALD & SOUPER Aberdeen c1800 |
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Tati
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Not sure if it's any use but I think I have identified the Ann mother of 'Elizabeth Morris or Jones'. Unfortunately there isn't an Isaac with her on census 
1851
HO107/2505/259
Llandyrnog, Denbighshire
Hannah Morris, head, unm, 40, Pauper
Anne, sister, unm, 35, Charwoman
Elizabeth, niece, 7, scholar
All born Llandyrnog
The 1861 census shows her with 2 more children: Harriet J age 9 and John J age 6.
She seems to be the daughter of Simon and Elizabeth (as per IGI christening). I was hoping to find Isaac with them in 1841 but he's not there.
Sorry this is no help at all until we have found Isaac in 1841 and 1851 ...
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"My dear, I think the English pronounce it 'appiness" Desire and hunger is the fire I breathe Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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hiraeth
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Sorry this is no help at all until we have found Isaac in 1841 and 1851 ...
Ah this may be a problem as a lot of this area's censuses are missing in 1841 and 1851...did you find Simon & Elizabeth in 1841 Tati?
Heather
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukCARRINGTON, ROBERTS, WILLIAMS, FOULKES, WYNN, BLUNT, JONES Denbighshire. DAVIES, OWEN, JONES, WILLIAMS, THOMAS, EVANS, MORGAN, SOLOMAN, GRIFFITHS Caernarfonshire & Anglesey THATCHER, HILLIER, PARISH Surrey APPLETON, MALTHOUSE, GLOVER Hertfordshire MCDONALD & SOUPER Aberdeen c1800 |
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Paul
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Hi Poppy Llandyrnog is about 3 miles from Ruthin so the baptism for Isaac could be the correct one. http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/DEN/Llandyrnog/Is the date of birth on the certificate close to the christening date? North Wales BMD only has the one Isaac Morris in 1840. What we need to do now is ask Paul if he could look for an Ann Morris baptism for you in Ruthin c1815-1820. I have checked the parish register transcripts 1592-1812 - and the good news is there are a lot of MORRISes in there - unfortunately your Ann doesn't appear to be one of them - probably too early. But if we can find her baptism and names for her parents it may well be possible for you to trace Isaac's mother's family back a lot further. Heather PS I forgot to say that the parish register transcripts for Llandyrnog are also available from the Clwyd FHS or through Genfair.
Hello Heather, I couldn't see a baptism in Ruthin for an Ann Morris 1814-1825 
Paul.
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hiraeth
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Hi Paul
Thanks for checking Ruthin. From the last posts here though it looks like Llandyrnog is more likely
Heather
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukCARRINGTON, ROBERTS, WILLIAMS, FOULKES, WYNN, BLUNT, JONES Denbighshire. DAVIES, OWEN, JONES, WILLIAMS, THOMAS, EVANS, MORGAN, SOLOMAN, GRIFFITHS Caernarfonshire & Anglesey THATCHER, HILLIER, PARISH Surrey APPLETON, MALTHOUSE, GLOVER Hertfordshire MCDONALD & SOUPER Aberdeen c1800 |
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Paul
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I'll have a little look, next time.
Paul
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