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Topic: help with this missing ancestor please (Read 468 times)
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charlotteCH
RootsChat Aristocrat
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Posts: 1014
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have you checked the freebmd to see if his death is there?
That should clear that question out of the way for you.
charlotte
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HARGREAVES, HANSON, BAILEY, BURTON, HEWITT, JAGGER, LOCKWOOD, UTTLEY, MIDGLEY, RUDD, TAYLOR, HOLDEN, SHAW Halifax / Sowerby/ Southowram 18C+
GILL, Accrington, Blackburn, West Derby, Lancs, migrated USA 1891 to RI: GILL in SC: HOTCHKISS in RI: PELOQUIN in RI
HUMPHRIES, HILLIER, ALLEN, LYDBURY Nunney/Frome 18-19C
HUMPHRIES, BIGFORD, JOYCE, HEWITT, ROBINSON, McMULLEN, SUFFEL, CARNEY, MARRON, COMPTON, FREEMAN Ont. Canada 1830+
82nd Regt of Foot 1808-1825
1st WRY Militia 1780-1808
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bedfordshire boy
RootsChat Marquessate
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That IGI entry is a member submission so shouldn't be relied upon without first checking it with the parish register. An IGI member submission isn't evidence that he was "definitely born"! It looks to me to be wrong as you won't usually find a birth without a baptism in a parish register at this time. So the LDS member who submitted the entry may have erroneously described it as a birth rather than a baptism but the date is right, or it might be complete fiction!
Have you traced Joseph whose "birth" is shown as 13 May 1838 - but this one also has an extracted entry with his baptism being shown as 13 May 1838. Was he a twin of John who was baptised on the same day and who appeared in 1851 aged 12?
I can't see a Thomas Turner death in Luton registration district, nor is there a burial of Thomas Turner in Studham up to 1851
Have you found the family in 1841 as I can't see them?
I question if he actually existed
David
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukBeds: Cople: Luke/Spencer Everton: Hale Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey Potton: Merrill Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt Hunts: Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn Cambs: Bourn: Bowd Eltisley: Medlock Graveley: Ford/Revell |
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waterfall
RootsChat Senior
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Posts: 379
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From Studham St Mary's P/Register
17/4/1834 Bartel s Bartel & Sarah Turner, Studham, Labourer
17/4/1834 Sarah d " " " "
14/5/1837 Thomas s Bartholmew & Sarah Turner, Studham, farmer
13/5/1838 13/5/1838 Joseph s Barthel & Sarah Turner, Studham, farmer
13/5/1838 John s Barthel & Sarah Turner, Studham, farmer
15/11/1840 Alfred s Bartle & Sarah Turner, Studham, farmer
No burials for Thomas Turner between 1837 and 1851 at St Mary's, Studham.
The 1841 census for Studham, Herts is missing on Ancestry.
I suspect that is where the "Turners" were to be found as in 1851 some down as being born in Studham, Herts.
Is a bit odd...... Susan
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Bedfordshire. Hull, Lines Buckinghamshire. Hull, Lines Hertfordshire, Hull, Lines Durham, Matthews Yorkshire, Matthews Census information Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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Galium
RootsChat Veteran
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Posts: 506
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.natio
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Can't see these on Ancestry, but Origins has them:
Studham, Hertfordshire
Bartle Turner 30 Ag Lab N
Sarah Turner 30 N
William Turner 13 Y
Joseph Turner 12 Y
Mary Turner 10 Y
Sarah Turner 8 Y
Bartle Turner 6 Y
Martha Turner 4 Y
John Turner 3 Y
Alfred Turner 1 Y
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waterfall
RootsChat Senior
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Posts: 379
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Is possible that the entry for the bap of Thomas was a mistake on part of the cleric? Should it have been "Martha"?
I also had a similar problem with Studham P/R. A bap down for a "Frederick" which should have been "John". Spent years hunting "Frederick" then penny dropped having found a bap for all other than John and the relevant births on Free BMD.
Hope that makes sense, Susan
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Bedfordshire. Hull, Lines Buckinghamshire. Hull, Lines Hertfordshire, Hull, Lines Durham, Matthews Yorkshire, Matthews Census information Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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bedfordshire boy
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Hi Susan
That's what I thought to start with, as there appears to be a baptism of Thomas who's never seen again, and Martha who appears in 1841 and 1851 of the same age as Thomas.
But then I saw a "birth" member submission on the IGI of Martha on 14 Jun 1836 at Studham. The other member subs have turned out to be half right - right date, but birth instead of baptism. Might you have missed this baptism?
David
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukBeds: Cople: Luke/Spencer Everton: Hale Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey Potton: Merrill Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt Hunts: Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn Cambs: Bourn: Bowd Eltisley: Medlock Graveley: Ford/Revell |
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waterfall
RootsChat Senior
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Posts: 379
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Morning David,
could well have missed the bap of Martha as I never check the IGI before looking at register..........perhaps I should.
Will have another look and check that out for Martha in 1836 and any others on IGI.
Susan
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Bedfordshire. Hull, Lines Buckinghamshire. Hull, Lines Hertfordshire, Hull, Lines Durham, Matthews Yorkshire, Matthews Census information Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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waterfall
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Posts: 379
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Have rechecked and only error that I found is the bap date for Bartel & Sarah. Should be 17/8/1834 not April as I previously posted.
There is no bap for Martha 14/6/1836 or any other date. Does seem quite likely that the bap date for Thomas could be Martha.
However a few more entries from Studham P/R which should answer partly the post on Bucks board.
BAPTISMS
25/11/1866 Ann adult d of Bartholomew & Sarah Turner, Studham, Beds, Shepherd
13/10/1867 Sarah Jane d Ann Turner, Studham, Beds, Spinster
31/5/1868 Sarah Ann d Sarah Turner now Scott, Teddington, Middx, Spinster
31/5/1868 William s Sarah Turner now Scott, Teddington, Middx, Spinster
31/5/1868 Charles Joshua s Ann Turner, Studham, Beds, Spinster
From that I would imagine that there was no marriage for Ann to George Whitman in 1866.
George Whitman I suspect to be son of Joshua & Mary Ann Whitman of Hudnall. George had a brother Joshua who married a Jane Garment and he was the victualler at "The Bell Public House" in Studham.
Have a marriage but need to go till later, Susan
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Bedfordshire. Hull, Lines Buckinghamshire. Hull, Lines Hertfordshire, Hull, Lines Durham, Matthews Yorkshire, Matthews Census information Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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bedfordshire boy
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I agree Susan, that Thomas probably should be Martha. Unprovable though!
What it does prove though, once again, is that you cannot rely on member submissions. This one for Martha is just fiction
David
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.ukBeds: Cople: Luke/Spencer Everton: Hale Henlow: Cooper/Watts/Sabey Potton: Merrill Southill: Faulkner/Litchfield/Sabey Woburn/Husborne Crawley: Surkitt Hunts: Gt Gransden: Merrill/Chandler/Medlock Toseland: Surkitt/Hedge/Corn Cambs: Bourn: Bowd Eltisley: Medlock Graveley: Ford/Revell |
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waterfall
RootsChat Senior
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Posts: 379
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Yes David the IGI a useful tool but not to be relied on as you say, hence I tend to work from P/R's and census then when stuck look at IGI which may give one a lead. Trouble is so many parishes missing just to make life fun.
From St Marys, Studham
MARRIAGE
25/9/1847 Joseph Turnerx, minor, Batchelor, Laborer, Studham, (father Bartholomew Turner, Laborer) married by banns
Mary Austinx, minor, Spinster, Studham, (father Joseph Austin, Laborer)
Witness James Austinx Charlotte Greenx
12/11/1858 John Scottx, full age, Bachelor, Labourer, Studham, (father the late William Scott, Butcher)
married by banns
Martha Turner, full age, Spinster, Studham, (father Bartle Turner, Labourer)
Witness George Cain, Mary Ann Cutler
Of no consequence but George Cain and Mary Ann Cutler married in 1859. George was deported in 1861 to Australia where he died.
Susan
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Bedfordshire. Hull, Lines Buckinghamshire. Hull, Lines Hertfordshire, Hull, Lines Durham, Matthews Yorkshire, Matthews Census information Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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