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Topic: Who are these children? (Read 445 times)
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Stumped!
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I've been trying to work out whether or not the two children highlighted are any relation but I cannot even find a record of their birth. If somebody else can help then I would be very grateful.
Peter
In Q4 of 1871 Catherine Pullon marries Alfred Leeming.
In 1881 (RG11/4534/77/2) Catherine (33) is shown as married and is with her daughter Blanche ( . No sign of Alfred.
In 1891 (RG12/3199/140/30) Catherine (43) and her daughter Blanche (18) are living in Moss Side Manchester. Also in the household are two children, Frank and Margaret Ashton aged 6 8 and 4 6.
By 1901 (RG13/3324/164/39) Blanche (28) has married Harry Foster and they have moved to Sale in Cheshire accompanied by Kate (53) and Margaret (16) who is shown as Harry's "niece-in-law". Frank is in St Pancras as a trainee electrical engineer.
So who are the parents of Frank and Margaret? And what happened to Alfred? Did he die between 1871 and 1881?
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« Last Edit: Saturday 02 August 08 09:48 BST (UK) by Stumped! »
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km1971
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hi Peter
You have the ages wrong. Frank and Margaret were 8 and 6. There is one likely (and two maybe) births for Margaret on FreeBMD. The best is June (qtr) 1885 in West Derby.
The next best are Margaret Alice in the previous qtr (also West Derby) and Margaret Gertrude in June (qtr) 1886 in Toxteth Park.
There is a marriage on Lancs BMD for a William Ashton and Elizabeth Pullon in Preston in 1850. FreeBMD has a possible similar in Dec 1850, but in Burnley.
Catherine (3) is in the 1851 with parents Thomas (45) and Sarah (40), but they appear to have married in 1837, so if Catherine and Elizabeth are sisters, Elizabeth must be from a first marriage of Thomas’.
Regarding Alfred Leeming you are again looking in the wrong place. He was alive (but absent) in 1881. There is a death on FreeBMD in Chorlton (which includes Moss Side) in June (qtr) of 1886. The index has him as 30, so this must be a mistake if it is the right one.
Ken
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« Last Edit: Wednesday 09 July 08 12:15 BST (UK) by km1971 »
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Stumped!
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Hello Ken
Many thanks for your help.
No wonder I couldn't find the births if I had the ages wrong. 
No excuses. I had the downloaded census images in front of me.
I have not come across Elizabeth before so I've sent off to Preston for her marriage certificate.
I'm not sure that Elizabeth will be the mother of these two children. If she married in 1850 and these children were born in the 1880s.....
Hopefully she knows who her father was. 
I've also sent off for Thomas's marriage certificate.
I hadn't considered that he might have been married twice.
He was thirty one when he married Sarah, so it is quite possible.
Peter
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« Last Edit: Thursday 10 July 08 19:38 BST (UK) by Stumped! »
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Stumped!
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I've received the certificate for Thomas's marriage and yes, it does say that he was a widower.
The trouble is that although it gives his father as William it doesn't say that he was deceased.  and the William in my tree died in Gildersome in 1828.
I'm beginning to doubt that this is the right Thomas.
Peter
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« Last Edit: Saturday 12 July 08 13:45 BST (UK) by Stumped! »
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km1971
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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You cannot rely on whether a father was deceased or not. Can you post details of ages (if not full), abodes, fathers and occupations?
Ken
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Stumped!
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Ken
Both shown "of full age".
Thomas is living at Market Street, Manchester, occupation traveller. Father William's occupation shown as a draper.
Sarah Waud living at 6 Caroline Street, Leeds. She is the daughter of John Waud (a gentleman) and Hannah (Haw).
Peter
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Stumped!
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I've now received the marriage certificate for William Ashton (25) and Elizabeth Pullon (27).
Both are living in Nelson, Little (?)Marsden
William is a collier and says his father is Edward, a weaver.
Elizabeth says her father is Richard, a labourer.
No signatures for bride, groom, or witnesses.
At the moment I can't find them on the '51 or the '61.
Peter
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DS
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Hi
In order for Margaret Ashton to be the Niece in Law of Harry Foster (on the 1901 census) she would, strictly speaking, have to be the child of a sibling of Blanche.
If Margaret were the child of a sibling of Catherine (as suggested) she would not be the Niece in Law of Blanche's husband.
Nonetheless, I have quickly looked at each of Catherine's siblings and I cannot see any direct connection to anyone called Ashton. Fanny married into the Gresham family. Amelia married Alfred’s brother and was thus also a Leeming and their brother, John William, died unmarried.
Elizabeth Pullon who married William Ashton in 1850 was obviously not a sibling of Catherine (if her dad was called Richard and Catherine‘s was called Thomas).
If there is a family connection between these two Ashtons and Blanche, it is well concealed. If Blanche did not have any siblings then the title of Niece in Law afforded to Margaret is wrong .......and, that being the case, who knows what the correct title should be ?
Sorry that this is a bit negative Peter, but you could end up as barmy as me, if you keep on with this quest to prove the seemingly unproveable  ......unless someone else now takes up the challenge and proves it
DS 
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Stumped!
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DS
I think that I agree with everything that you have said but......
Does this make any sense? Are the two children the grandchildren of William and Elizabeth?
After all, Catherine and Elizabeth were both Pullons so there is, presumably, some link between them somewhere.
Peter
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« Last Edit: Tuesday 19 August 08 11:55 BST (UK) by Stumped! »
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