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Author Topic: charltons great clifton  (Read 1635 times)
csc
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private robert cursiter seaforth highlanders
charltons great clifton
« on: Thursday 19 February 09 17:32 UTC (UK) »
does anyone know about the children of john charlton b1847 and ann young b1847 i know fletcher died in his 20s but there are several other boys christopher william john jacob who got married in whitehaven1908 joseph my grandfather my father john charlton visited one of his aunts in coventry when he was in the army in 1941  i think she might have been mary but there were at least 2 other sisters we dont know much about them as grandad was drowned at longtown 1935 before we were born csc
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charlton and sparks cumberland  kerr  and dickson mouswald and torthorwad bell ruthwell hetherington ruthwell and cumberland cursiter  sanday and kirkwall drever sanday cooper sanday turfus sanday
Lumber-Jack
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Old Josiah
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 19 February 09 20:34 UTC (UK) »
Are these they? 1891 census
John 42 Aglab GT C
Ann 41 GT C
John Y 11 Slainburn
Shedrack S 9 Dovenby
Jacob 7 Dovenby
Jane 5 Dearham
Joseph S 9m GT C

if so they moved around....look where all the 5 sons were born

Best wishes from Canada...Lumber-Jack
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csc
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private robert cursiter seaforth highlanders
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 19 February 09 20:59 UTC (UK) »
yes this is my family john was an agricultural worker moving from farm to farm all of us grandchildren of joseph wished we had known him we have 1 picture of him he was quite handsome no wonder granny fell for him according to her he was a good husband and father taken away too soon thanks csc
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charlton and sparks cumberland  kerr  and dickson mouswald and torthorwad bell ruthwell hetherington ruthwell and cumberland cursiter  sanday and kirkwall drever sanday cooper sanday turfus sanday
Lumber-Jack
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Old Josiah
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 19 February 09 21:54 UTC (UK) »
The 1881 census is very interesting:

Rose Hill, Dovenby, Cockermouth

John 33 GT C
Ann 33 GT C
Fletcher Young 13 (a son not called Charlton)Little Broughton
Christopher 10 Greysouthern
William 8 Greysouthern
Mary 6 Little Clifton
Margaret A 8 Stainburn
John Y 1 Stainburn

Did John have a first wife called Young to produce Fletcher or was he adopted or produced out of wedlock?All the other children except Fletcher are explicitly called Charlton.

Are William and Margaret A. twins? If so how come they are born in different towns? Was one adopted or produced by other means?

John was working for Jane Archer and her son Joseph who farmed 66 acres at Rose Hill.

John lived beside a poor member of the famous Dalzell family, Richard, who was also an ag lab and probably worked along side him. Richard's wife Mary was the Toll Gate Keeper at the Toll Bar.

Best wishes, Lumber-Jack
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GeoffE
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Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #4 on: Thursday 19 February 09 22:05 UTC (UK) »
I think Margt A was aged 3 - 'tis very like the 33s of her parents.

Fletcher was probably a YOUNG ...

Marriages Mar 1870 
CHARLTON    John   Cockermouth    10b   661   
YOUNG    Ann      Cockermouth    10b   661
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Lumber-Jack
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Old Josiah
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 19 February 09 22:17 UTC (UK) »
Thanks Geoff I am sure that you are right on both counts: Fletcher got his Mum's maiden name and later on John Y got it too I suppose.

1871 census

Plumbland living at High Close: which must have been a farm because next door is the Farm bailiff Joseph Ferguson;  I hope that George Robson the gamekeeper living on the other side at Plumbland Moor slipped John a rabbit or two every now and then!

John 24 Clifton
Ann 24 Clifton (she is always listed as an ag lab so she must have worked hard as well as looked after a large number of children)
Fletcher Young Charlton (problem solved) 3 Broughton
Christopher 6m Greysouthern

Best wishes, Lumber-Jack
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Lumber-Jack
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Old Josiah
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 19 February 09 22:31 UTC (UK) »
John Charlton
Birth 1847 Q1 Cockermouth Cumbria Vol 25 p119

Best fit with John age 24 in 1871

Best wishes, Lumber-Jack
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Lumber-Jack
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Old Josiah
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 19 February 09 22:50 UTC (UK) »
I cannot find John Charlton born in Great Clifton in 1847 in the 1851 or 1861 census though I have a great hit for a Charlton family in Brampton and on the same 1861 page can even see  that John's grandad living as a single widower! Lumber-Jack
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Lumber-Jack
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Old Josiah
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 19 February 09 23:03 UTC (UK) »
Just to wrap up from me

1901 census Little Clifton
John 53 general labourer (getting older1) GT C
Ann 53 Little Clifton (first time stated)
Christopher 30 Greysouthern ag lab ( probably primary wage earner)
Joseph S 11 GT C

next door: Edward Bradle  Farmer and employer

The 1911 census for Cumberland is not yet available as far as I know.

You should be able to visit a few churches and parish records; look up some old farms; send off for some certificates and write the story of John and Ann.

Good luck.  Lumber-Jack
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Lumber-Jack
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Old Josiah
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #9 on: Thursday 19 February 09 23:09 UTC (UK) »
Spoke too soon:

John Charlton death

1917  Q1      70 years  Cockermouth, Cumbria, Cumberland

10b 887

Lumber-Jack
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Lumber-Jack
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Old Josiah
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #10 on: Thursday 19 February 09 23:15 UTC (UK) »
And they loved, lived hard, worked hard and were destined to be together in life and death:

Ann Charlton death 1915 Q1 69 years Cockermouth Cumbria Cumberland  10b 1035

Lumber-Jack
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Lumber-Jack
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Old Josiah
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #11 on: Thursday 19 February 09 23:59 UTC (UK) »
I am hooked! I tried looking for the ancestors:

1851 Little Clifton (remember in the 1901 Ann said she was from Little Clifton)

John Young 37 Coal Miner Plumbland
Mary 37 labouress wife Selmuzther?Huh
John 15 Coal miner Workington
Jane 13 at home Embleton
Mary 8 scholar Workington
Ann (our Ann) 4 Clifton
Margaret 1 Clifton

So Ann was a coal miner's daughter and you now know the names of  some of your grt(x2) grandparents (John and Mary Young) if I have my grts right!

Where or what is Selmuzther?

Lumber-Jack
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Lumber-Jack
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Old Josiah
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #12 on: Friday 20 February 09 00:11 UTC (UK) »
 1861 Little Clifton

John Young 47 farmer (easier perhaps than coal mining) Plumbland
Mary 48 Letmurthy (now we know!)
Ann 14 servant LC
Margaret 12 scholar LC
Jacob 8 scholar LC
Martha 2

So two more joined the Young's , farming became the trade and Ann went into service.

Lumber-Jack
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Lumber-Jack
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Old Josiah
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #13 on: Friday 20 February 09 00:27 UTC (UK) »
I have two deaths for Elizabeth and John Charlton in Cockermouth in 1846. I cannot find "our" John single in the 1851 or 1861 census although he is supposed to be born 1847ish in Great Clifton. One of my previous posts  is for Brampton but I think it is pushing it geographically and occupationally. Unless someone more experienced than I can find him you would  have to request the marriage license and hope his parent(s) are listed. He could have been orphaned, given the above deaths, but then my imagination is wont to fly! Lumber-Jack
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Lumber-Jack
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Old Josiah
Re: charltons great clifton
« Reply #14 on: Friday 20 February 09 01:09 UTC (UK) »
1841 Census Workington
Brow Top opposite High Brewery

living between a sailor's family and a teacher/midwife and a butcher(what more do you need?!)

John  Young 25 labourer
Mary 25
John 5
Jane 3

So they must have moved from the town to Clifton when the pit opened. So if you want to find older Young's you have to go to Workington.

Lumber-Jack
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