|
Pages: [1] 2
|
 |
|
Author
|
Topic: Finding a Jones! (Read 461 times)
|
LaviniaJ
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 6
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
My ancestor Peter Jones, B. Stockport, UK 1829, left UK and landed in Halifax, Nova Scotia mid to late 1840's (young lad running away to sea??). He met and ? married (?where) Mary Jane "somebody" who was born in Halifax. Next we hear of them is that they are living in Erie, New York State, USA and have children, Lavinia, born in Erie in 1848, William 1853, Elizabeth 1856. One census has them living in Buffalo.
By 1869 they had returned to Stockport UK and we all working in the cotton mills there. Lavinia married in 1869. Mary Jane and the children are listed as British subjects.
Long story short - how do I find Mary Jane's maiden name, if and when they married and where the children were born?
This branch of the family has me stumped.
Anyone have any clues where I might find more information, especially on Mary Jane.
Thanks in anticipation.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
J.J.
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 6007
Census Crown © www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
...The marriage isn't listed online... https://www.novascotiagenealogy.com/
The best way to find the surname is to get a marriage cert for one of the children with parents listed....I imagine Lavinia would be the first to pick up, as you have a date, and it should also say where she is born. If they are called british subjects, then they should all have been born in Canada, but fibs happen...
A small price to pay for the information. http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl
Here's a site re: Buffalo, Erie County, New York...You'll likely have to see if you can find birth records from Parish records...Naturalization records may have her maiden name on them...
http://www.usgennet.org/usa/ny/county/erie1/buffalo/buffalo.htm...
|
|
|
|
« Last Edit: Monday 02 November 09 21:25 UTC (UK) by J.J. »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
cosmac
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 764
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
The 1871 English census has the family living in Stockport and showing Mary born in America as well as Lavinia and William G. Elizabeth shows a birth in Stockport Cheshire which means the family moved back to England by 1858? Lavinia is living with her parents as well as husband Alfred Royle.
The 1881 census shows Mary Jane born Halifax Nova Scotia whereas the 1891 shows Halifax, America. Ancestry consistently interprets America to mean the United States on her 1871 and 1891 records.
In 1881 Peter and Mary have lodgers Elizabeth and James Schofield and there is a marriage between Elizabeth Jones and James in 1880 in Stockport.
This gives you 2 marriage certificates that should give you the mother's maiden name. There are quite a few Elizabeth Jones born around 1858 in Stockport to narrow down those possibilities.
Debbie
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
cosmac
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 764
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
Sorry, I should have realized that - I guess I've been looking at Canadian records for too long!
Debbie
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
cosmac
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 764
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
James Schofield is in Heaton Norris Lancashire working in 1891 but still married.
1861,1881, and 1891 census give 1860 as year of birth for Elizabeth and 1871 gives 1858.
There is another Elizabeth and James Schofield living around Stockport but Elizabeth in that relationship is born 1856 Stockport and that James is born Rochdale Lancashire and they have a few children.
From FreeBMD the choices for the birth of Elizabeth Jones alone (there are a few with second names but I omited them as there was never any indication of a second name on census)
Jun 1856 Stockport 8a 21
Jun 1857 Stockport 8a 23
Sep 1859 Stockport 8a 27
Sep 1859 Stockport 8a 74
Jun 1860 Stockport 8a 3_
Debbie
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
J.J.
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 6007
Census Crown © www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
oop,  been a while since we ordered any marriages from over there...forgot completely...sorry... 
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
LaviniaJ
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 6
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
Thanks to everyone for your hard work. Unfortunately I lost my whole hard drive with a lot of information, recently. Fortunately, I'm one of those old fashioned people who writes a lot of stuff down - lots of scratchy notes that only I can understand.
Last year I met up with some distant cousins (Bardsley family) and got some good information from the Family History records in Stockport Library. Lavinia married Alfred Royle on 27th Sept, 1869 at St. Thomas' Church, Heaton Norris. She is recorded as being born in Erie (Eerie) New York in 1848 and Alfred was born in 1843. Record is at BDM ST/7/8/72 . Only fathers name mentioned and Peter was a weaver. Strangely, the Jones family is recorded on the U.S. 1871 census, but they were already back in England by 1868/1869 for Lavinia and Alfred to marry. No record anywhere of Mary Jane's maiden, which is my major sticking point. None of my family has middle names, which makes it even harder to find people.
Sorry, trying to respond to all posts.
In the 1881 census, Peter and Mary Jane were living at St. Mary's Gate, Stockport and they seem to have been working for the nearby church - St. Mary's (which I've visited). James Schofield, Elizabether Schofield, Elizabeth Hague and Sarah Ann Wild seem to have been lodging with them but I don't think they're related. If Elizabeth had married James Schofield, they wouldn't have been regarded as lodgers. In the 1891 census, Mary Jane and Elizabeth are living together (Eliz. apparently unmarried and she has now branched out to the new industry of my family, as a hat trimmer. Peter must have died by this point. Hard to tell on my copy if its "M" or "W".
Will digest all this info and compare with mine. Thanks again for the input.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
cosmac
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 764
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
The attached is from the 1891 census. Your Elizabeth does look like they have her as married. People who are related to the heads of the household on census have, in my experience, been noted as lodgers so I wouldn't discount James as Elizabeth's husband. It is relatively inexpensive to find out with the marriage certificate.
In what area of the US do you have Peter and family on the 1870 census?
Debbie
|
|
|
|
|
LaviniaJ
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 6
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
The attached is from the 1891 census. Your Elizabeth does look like they have her as married. People who are related to the heads of the household on census have, in my experience, been noted as lodgers so I wouldn't discount James as Elizabeth's husband. It is relatively inexpensive to find out with the marriage certificate.
In what area of the US do you have Peter and family on the 1870 census?
Debbie
Thanks for your help Debbie. I just had a look at the copy of the 1881 census that I have and it looks as though you're right. It has Peter and Mary Jane, then James Schofield 23 and Elizabeth Schofield 24, then Elizabeth Hague and Sarah Ann Wild. I'd never made this connection of James and Elizabeth. It also says Mary Jane is from Nova scotia. Elizabeth is a cotton winder but I can't quite make out James' occupation - is it Waiter, domestic servant?. Also, do you have any idea what the "No. of schedule" means? I take it as meaning that they are different families/individuals in the one house, as people often shared houses and even rooms in those days.
Can't find all the family for the 1850 US census, but I have a note of Lavinia, age 3, in Buffalo Ward 2, Erie, New York and I've also written that she was born in New York-no other details. Obviously, none of the other children were born then.
I haven't sent for any certificates since I'm never sure if I'm close enough to the person and don't want to waste my money with wrong info.
Thanks again
Modified to add - just found my record of 1870 US census. We have Peter Jones, 41, Mary Jones 40, Lavinia 22 and William Jones 15, living in Erie, New York. But how could they be in the US if they were all back in Stockport where Lavinia was married in 1869! Maybe they were time travellers!!! Or had their own Tardis and travelled with Dr. Who. OK< being silly now, but how can you be in 2 places at once? The plot thickens!
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
J.J.
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 6007
Census Crown © www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
Hmmm...might you have the wrong marriage then? Not that it was unusual for people of means to travel back & forth but usually they'd be staying with rellies in 2nd instance. Plus a newly married daughter back with family? If they'd seperated... Have you looked for them all in 1871 u.k. as well, especially Lavinia? Looking back, I see Debbie found them in the U.K. 1871...some pondering to do on that one, that's for sure...
Nice work in making the association on the 1881 Debbie...
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
cosmac
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 764
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
On the 1850 US census there is a Lavinia Jones, age 3 in Buffalo Ward 2, Erie, New York but she is the daughter of Isaac A. Jones (37) b. New York and his wife Lavinia (32) b. New York and sister to Caroline (12), Sarah (6) both born New York. I can find no record of Peter or Mary Jones or either William or Lavinia in the US census for 1850. On the 1870 US census the Lavinia born New York is still living in the same district with her parents.
I can't find your family on the 1870 US census in Erie, New York. Do you have them all together in one household? Mary should be easy to find on the US census with a birthplace of Nova Scotia or Canada but I haven't had any luck. I did find a William Jones, 22, in Buffalo, Ward 5, Erie New York but he is the son of Robert and Jane Jones.
Did any of these possibilities in the 1850 and 1870 US census come via ancestry leaves? I find most of their suggestions not even close to accurate.
There is a good possibility for William Jones on the 1871 British census. RG101164 126 2
Carrisbrooke Hampshire in District Parkhouse Prison as a prisoner - William Jones, single, 23, common labourer born abt 1844 in America. His entry from the 1871 census is attached.
Debbie
Amended to add - forgot we had found William in the 1871 census with his parents in Stockport! We all have our DUH moments.
|
|
|
|
|
cosmac
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 764
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
|
Lavinia Royle is in Stockport Cheshire on the 1881 census at 4 Stringer Yard but her name is recorded as Selina. TG 11 3482 3820
Alfred (37) b. Stockport, Selina (33) b. New York America, Elijah (13) b. Manchester Lancashire,
Mary H. (9) b. Stockport, Martha A (6) b. Stockport, Margaret (3) b. Stockport.
Lavina and Alfred are in Stockport in 1901 RG13 3297 158 5
Her birth is recorded as America British Subject. Children Fred (13) and Martha A. (9) are living with them.
Debbie
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2
|
|
|
|
|
jones88992.jpg