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Topic: Help! Butler Family in Clackmannankshire 1871 (Read 2124 times)
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snootycat
RootsChat Member
Posts: 130
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Its got us all hooked! 
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snootycat
RootsChat Member
Posts: 130
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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But then he would be literally old enough to be her father! I will send for the death cert that should answer some questions! 
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9109
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He's only around 12 yrs older than Margaret, surely no fathering there
Death certificate for him would help. Ask for help if you need it on the Co. Antrim board here on RC 
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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snootycat
RootsChat Member
Posts: 130
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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I thought you meant he was his father, if you see what I mean!
I dont know about you but find this story is incredible!
I cant really work out what you mean by being Thomas Bryson senior, but never mind! I will send for his death cert and that might help, he mentions his sister as Mary
Campbell Butler.........perhaps we should search for a previous marriage
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9109
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I thought you mean Thomas Snr was old enough to be Margaret's father...hence my ref. to him being only around 12 yrs older that her!
I'm going to add to your unravelling of knitting here We have the birth of son Hugh:
HUGH BUTLER Birth: 07 DEC 1867 Govan, Lanark
In the 1871 census, we have Hugh showing as Hugh A. Butler. I found this death entry on SP:
1875 HUGH AUGUSTUS BUTLER, age 7 in BLYTHSWOOD, GLASGOW
But then I also found this entry in Wills:
Butler Hugh Augustus, 26/07/1876, 2 Portman Place, Hillhead, Glasgow, d. 25/04/1875 at Hillhead, intestate - Glasgow Sheriff Court Inventories SC36/48/79
A will for a 7 year old 
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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snootycat
RootsChat Member
Posts: 130
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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How odd!
I will put it on my list of things to access although I have to space it out as it gets expensive!
In the meantime I have my Aunt Adas marriage certificate through, she was the daughter of Alfred Elisha....she also married in a registry office. I am beginning to wonder if she was pregnant as well!Either that or the family were rank atheists or couldn't afford a proper wedding?? I always thought that in the past you married in church unless pregnant or whatever......................on my mothers side being pregnant outside of marriage seems the norm 
I have put a message up on the Middlesex board. I will also put up a notice on the Antrim board. Is there any way I can provide a link to our discussions for the antrim board?
I am very grateful for your help, you are saving me hours of work, if not years. I am still confused over the various children but we are getting there slowly. Its no small wonder I couldn't find her husband....I have been thinking...the will says 'Margaret Reid KNOWN as Mrs Robinson' That gives the impression of an alias? She is called by her legal name in the will, so why feel the need to say 'known as' I can only assume that their relationship wasn't common knowledge..............so I assume it was for decencies sake 
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snootycat
RootsChat Member
Posts: 130
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Perhaps the intestate will for the 7 year old is to legally dispose of his estate under the Trust arrangements. Thomas stipulated that money should be divided up among survivors.
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snootycat
RootsChat Member
Posts: 130
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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I have just thought...I wonder if the adjustment made ten years later was because all the children had reached maturity and they wanted to wind up the Trust Fund and just give everyone their cut. When I have more details I will re examine it. 
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9109
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Hi Pam
Below is the link to this page (which shows at the very top of screen in the URL box):
www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,383081.0.html
If you copy and paste the above, they will link to this post. If I can give you some advice though This post has got very long for someone new to necessarily go through in detail. I would include a copy of the above link on a new post for those that want to go through it all for background. But, I would also include a brief summary on any new post, that would let people work from that for searching any new information that you request.
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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merryhow
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 263
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hi Monica, you could be right that might well be them on the 1861 census. The IGI has a THOMAS ROBINSON and MARGARET JANE KENNAY having children in the Govan area but the only name that matches is Thomas and he is a couple of years older.
Pam, does Thomas name HUGH MC INTYRE BUTLER as his brother?
If so this might help, I saw it last week but couldn't remember where just found it again.
Rev Hugh McIntyre Butler, minister of Magilligan Presbyterian Church 1851-1917. He died 1930. It seems he succeeded his uncle REV SAMUEL BUTLER.
AGHADOWEY posted this information in a reply about the Moody family on the Antrim board.
A couple of thoughts;- If Thomas B c1825 married twice was the first marriage at Magilligan Presbyterian Church? Was there an announcement in the local paper?
What about looking for a death announcement for Thomas B in Antrim.
Val
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snootycat
RootsChat Member
Posts: 130
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Yes Hugh Mcintyre was his brother and married them and I have just had some details about him and others on the Antrim board. I am packing at the moment( moving house!) but will put the details up later.
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9109
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Pam
I thought you said, from the marriage entry, that the minister who married Thomas and Margaret in 1866 was a Duncan McKenzie (reply no.33)?
Good luck with the packing and the move
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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snootycat
RootsChat Member
Posts: 130
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Did I? I will check
Pam
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snootycat
RootsChat Member
Posts: 130
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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You are right! Thank you. 
I somehow connected it to his brother, I suppose because he was a minister. I have found out some more about the Butlers. Apparently Hugh Mcintyres father set up a scholarship which gave a medal to a child at the school for attainment. Someone has contacted me to say they won the prize in the 1950's! By that time it was a Bible!
Tracking down Thomas's death certificate......................
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MonicaLesl
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9109
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I've just been reading up on the entries on the Antrim board - great info
Monica
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MacIsaac, MacDonald, MacPherson, MacVarish, MacMaster: Moidart - Inverness-shire. Gillies: pre-1850 Knoydart, Inverness-shire /post 1850s Fort William area - Argyll. Tully, Tulley, Moran, Murphy: Lanarkshire. Durnan, Durnin, Kelly, Tully, McPhillips: Co Monaghan. McIntyre, McMahon, Tully: Co Cavan (?) Ireland. Moran: Co Mayo (?) Ireland. ..........and lots of Spanish name interests........ Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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