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Author Topic: Thomas CATES/KATES  (Read 233 times)
heddwch
RootsChat Senior
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Posts: 414


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Thomas CATES/KATES
« on: Sunday 24 May 09 10:41 UTC (UK) »
Please can someone help I have the above Thomas on the 1851 census as aged 33 a collier living in Aberdare. Married to Rina Davies born in wales
Please can someone check the 1841 census for me as he was born in Clutton. Somerset.
I am trying to trace his parents.
Many thanks for your help
Heddwch
« Last Edit: Sunday 24 May 09 11:33 UTC (UK) by krisesjoint » Logged
dee-jay
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Posts: 435
Re: Thomas CATES/KATES
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 24 May 09 13:44 UTC (UK) »
If your Thomas KATES appears in Cwmaman in 1861 aged 47 with wife Irina[?], his birthplace is not recorded Clutton.  It looks more like Camelton [sic]:  perhaps a misheard Camerton?

I can't access the image for 1881 but Thomas CATES aged 70 with wife Urina has his birthplace transcribed Camertra!  [See RG11  Piece 5324 Folio 137  Page Number 3.]
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SOM/Chard/Combe St Nicholas:  Dean[e]/Doble/Jeffery/Burt;  DEV/Yarcombe:  Dean/Gill/Every; 
BRK/Newbury:  Westall/Green/Lewis/Canning;  WIL/Allcannings:  Hiscock/Amor;  HAM/Kingsclere:  Martin/Hiscock/Westall;  WAR/Marton/Bubbenhall:  Glenn/Holmes;  STS/Yoxall/Hamstall Ridware/Barton-u-Needwood:  Holmes/Dainty;  STS/Brewood/Codsall/Penkridge/Hatherton:  Dean[e]; GLA/Aberdare:  Dean/Dane

Census information: Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
heddwch
RootsChat Senior
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Posts: 414


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: Thomas CATES/KATES
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 24 May 09 19:05 UTC (UK) »
Hello dee-jay,
  Thank you for looking for me.
In the 1871 census it states Thomas Cates born in Clutton  if this  near Camerton? I am sorry I dont know the area.
Kindest Regards
Heddwch
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dee-jay
RootsChat Senior
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Posts: 435
Re: Thomas CATES/KATES
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 24 May 09 23:54 UTC (UK) »
Hi Heddwch

Yes - they are close together if you check Somerset parishes at http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/

I'm not aware of any Clutton PRs online and I can find no evidence of CATES entries in Camerton PRs:  the closest is 'Matha' COATES, a marriage witness.  See  http://freereg.rootsweb.com/

In my personal research into Somerset migrants to Wales I am mindful of how the West Country dialects might have sounded, so I'd be inclined to include KEATES and variants in searches.  [My DEAN variants sometimes were recorded DANE in Wales.]

It seems likely Thomas may have been a widower at marriage to 'Rina' if the elder children in their 1861 household were his.  Have you pursued possible birth registrations for them?
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SOM/Chard/Combe St Nicholas:  Dean[e]/Doble/Jeffery/Burt;  DEV/Yarcombe:  Dean/Gill/Every; 
BRK/Newbury:  Westall/Green/Lewis/Canning;  WIL/Allcannings:  Hiscock/Amor;  HAM/Kingsclere:  Martin/Hiscock/Westall;  WAR/Marton/Bubbenhall:  Glenn/Holmes;  STS/Yoxall/Hamstall Ridware/Barton-u-Needwood:  Holmes/Dainty;  STS/Brewood/Codsall/Penkridge/Hatherton:  Dean[e]; GLA/Aberdare:  Dean/Dane

Census information: Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
heddwch
RootsChat Senior
****
Posts: 414


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: Thomas CATES/KATES
« Reply #4 on: Monday 25 May 09 11:00 UTC (UK) »
Hello dee-jay,
The earliest record I have if Thomas Cates head aged 33
   His wife Rina aged 31 and daughter Mary Ann Daughter aged 3 (1851 census)
In the 1861 census his son Thomas  aged 20 same birthplace as father
  Father Thomas Kates aged 47, Wife aged 41.
  I never thought that Thomas could have been married previously thank you
  that.
  So what is the next step then?
  Heddwch
 

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dee-jay
RootsChat Senior
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Posts: 435
Re: Thomas CATES/KATES
« Reply #5 on: Monday 25 May 09 15:05 UTC (UK) »
I personally would be inclined to obtain a copy of the marriage cert [Dec Qtr 1850 CATES Thomas/DAVIES Rina Merthyr T.  26 665]  to establish paternity and marital status of both parties.  It is possible that the eldest two children recorded 1861 could have been the issue of either parent and absorbed into the post-1851 CATES family.  I can't accesss images to the 1851 Census but it would be useful to locate Thomas junr that year, when aged about 10?

It would also be good to establish the actual Christian name recorded variously Rina/Irina/Urinah/Averina/Verina.
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SOM/Chard/Combe St Nicholas:  Dean[e]/Doble/Jeffery/Burt;  DEV/Yarcombe:  Dean/Gill/Every; 
BRK/Newbury:  Westall/Green/Lewis/Canning;  WIL/Allcannings:  Hiscock/Amor;  HAM/Kingsclere:  Martin/Hiscock/Westall;  WAR/Marton/Bubbenhall:  Glenn/Holmes;  STS/Yoxall/Hamstall Ridware/Barton-u-Needwood:  Holmes/Dainty;  STS/Brewood/Codsall/Penkridge/Hatherton:  Dean[e]; GLA/Aberdare:  Dean/Dane

Census information: Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
heddwch
RootsChat Senior
****
Posts: 414


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: Thomas CATES/KATES
« Reply #6 on: Monday 25 May 09 16:22 UTC (UK) »
Hi dee-jay,
Thank you for your reply I am searching for a freind  whose mother is called Vernina and living in Aberdare.
  I will get a marriage cert for Thomas Cates good thinking, thanks for the tip, and ask for help to find the son Thomas on the 1851 census.
  Cheers
   Heddwch
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