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Topic: Wood/Armstrong name mystery! (Read 602 times)
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WolfieSmith
RootsChat Member
Posts: 150
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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In 1901, Millicent is down as Millicent B.Wood, age 5, born Walbottle.
Can't see a birth of a Millicent B. Wood, but there is a birth of a Milicent Bell (single L in Milicent), Sept. 1895, vol 10b., p.329, Castle Ward District (includes Walbottle). Given that her mother is living with a man named Bell in Walbottle in 1901 that could be her.
Totally by coincidence, I noticed that in 1901, Millicent is living at the address where my grandfathers family were living in 1896. Completely unconnected though.
Alan.
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Michael Dixon
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 2633
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Malcolm,
On 1911 census where was 15 yr old Millicent Wood born. ? ( I know C1901 has it as Walbottle)
What stats did Hugh/Sarah Millicent give for their children on 1911 census.?
I note that her first name(s) thru the censuses from 1871 when she was 5 months old were....
Harriet Sarah, Sarah, Harriet S, Sarah, Sarah Millicent !
I find their "geography" interesting...
Sarah up from Staffs to Holywell in the Earsdon area, north east of Newcastle, then moves to Walbottle , west of Newcastle, to be servant to single and childless Robert Bell
Hugh Hopper born Bebside ( my birth-colliery village) then onto Cambois colliery.
So she did not marry a man from same communityfrom the same colliery village. I wonder how she met Robert Bell of Walbottle and Hugh Hopper of Cambois ? Maybe not relevant is the fact that Cambois lay within the Parish of Bedlington, birth place of Robert Bell.
Her dad was Samuel, but she did not name a son Samuel. Her mam was Emma but I think she named a daughter Emma ( Hopper) ! Was Hugh Hopper born 1903 a twin to Emma Hopper, who died same quarter ?
On the marriage cert, was Hugh also recorded as widow.
Into which faith did Hugh/Sarah baptise their children ?
To marry in the Register Office they would have had to travel to Morpeth town, probably passing several churches on the way.. Cambois itself had C of E church from 1865.
I dont think Registrar would have set them any rigorous tests about their condition, like producing previous marriage certs or maybe more relevant ,death certs of previous spouses.
On the angle of registering names of children.....
Technically speaking children were not registered by surname.
I have just looked at a bunch of birth certs spanning period from 1865 to 1941
(my own)
Column 2 ; Child's Name if any, Column 4 ;Name and Surname of Father ,
Column 5, Name, Surname and Maiden Surname of Mother.
So no surname for child, but when birth registration was indexed, it was done so under the presumption that child's surname was the father's.
If no father's details had been registered, then the presumption would be that child's surname would be same as mother's.
Like you I have searched for connections between these families without finding an answer. I also searched for other Sarah marriages e.g. to an Armstrong.. no success... but I searched from before the 1901 census. Although 1901 records her as single I thought she may have just reverte3d to maiden name of Wood ? ( There are indications that Bedlington-born Robert had a previous family himself - 1891 census 4187-22-37.)
I think I am just clutching at straws.
Michael Dixon
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Names.
GALLAGHER ( + variations).
Areas. Co Sligo, Co Leitrim, Co Mayo. IRELAND.
Ontario, CANADA
Lowell, Ma, USA
Counties of Northumberland & Durham, ENGLAND
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MALEY/MELIA/MALLEY - with or without " O "
Westport Co Mayo. Northumberland
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DIXON
Cumberland.. Brampton, Carlisle, ENGLAND
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Michael Dixon
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 2633
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Malcolm,
I have traced through the possible Bell connections- can't see a connection.
Hugh Hopper's first wife Mary Bell.....
C1881 has her 20, born Ovington
C1891 has her 30, born Bedlington
C1901 has her 41, born Mickley ( Mickley , near Prudhoe, and Ovington both lay within the Parish of Ovingham- so Belington looks incorrect ! )
On C1881 in Sinkers Row, Cambois, they had 1 month old Rachel.
C1861 Scotland Gate, Bedlington Parish ( 3873-61-11) Matthew H and Rachel
Bell have a one yr old Mickley-born Mary.
C1871 West Sleekburn, Bedlington Parish, Matthew calls himself by second name, Henry ( 5166-71-55). Mary 10 born Ovington.
C1851 Matthew H with parents Matthew and Elizabeth in Ovington ( 2414-74-9)
I think Rachel's maiden name was Morpeth ( Married Mar Qtr 1854 @ Hexham, which covered Ovington )
I think this is Robert Bell....
C1861 West Sleekburn 3873-11-16- Robert Bedlington-born aged 2.(Parents George/Jane)
C1871 West Sleekburn 5165-151-6 Robert 12, a screener ( of coal)
Tricky bit. C1881 West Sleekburn, (5116-20-32) Robert 22 with wife Louisa M, Norfolk-born and 2 month old dtr Eliza J.
Death Registration @ Morpeth, Mar qtr 1885 Louisa Matilda Bell aged 26 yrs.
Then Robert as unmarried mine Deputy on C1891 with Sarah Wood in Walbottle.
Although the Ovington Bell family are fairly close to the Bedlington Bell family, I cannot see other connections. ( There were also several other Bell families round about them thru the censuses.)
~~~~~~~~----------
Hugh Hopper's parents were Christopher and Mary.
Mary Bell's parents were Matthew Henry or v.v. and Rachel
Sarah wood's parents were Samuel and Emma.
Robert Bell's parents were George and Jane.
Hugh Hopper/Mary Bell named first son Christopher, second one Harry... sort of following the English Naming Pattern.
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Henry/Rachel Bell on C1881 have in their household a 5 yr old Bedlington-born Matthew Bell - "adopted son"
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Who were the witnesses at the 1902 marriage ?
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Malcolm, short of good info to answer your initial query, I am sort of just thinking aloud, while adopting a holistic approach- examing all angle back & forth and across hoping for a eureka moment... none so far.
Michael Dixon
PS One of my great g/parents daughters had an illegitimate son. They took him on as their own, even after child's mother married and left the household. But never termed an adoption.
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Names.
GALLAGHER ( + variations).
Areas. Co Sligo, Co Leitrim, Co Mayo. IRELAND.
Ontario, CANADA
Lowell, Ma, USA
Counties of Northumberland & Durham, ENGLAND
-------------------------------------------------------------------
MALEY/MELIA/MALLEY - with or without " O "
Westport Co Mayo. Northumberland
-------------------------------------------------------------------
DIXON
Cumberland.. Brampton, Carlisle, ENGLAND
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tongariro
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 62
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Michael, I am more than a little impressed at the effort you have expended in extracting and tabulating all this information - and I thank you for your generosity of time spent on my behalf!
You have dug out a little more than I, and you have organised it rather better. I have paper notes and mental notes! Like you, I have been trying any byway to solve the Harriet Sarah "Millicent ARMSTRONG" question - including who met whom and where.
The young Millicent Wood was apparently born in Stamfordham (Stanisfordsham - C1911) which is also in the Ovington area. So I/we keep going in circles. Her father could have been Robert Bell. The Armstrong name and "widow" may have been a cover-up. I also investigated the Usher family which C1901 says "adopted" the young Millicent Wood - nothing there either.
I might point out that this is not my family - it is for a friend who lives your way. His parents have a significant wedding anniversary this year and the idea was to give them their family history. It is a complex one and already has a 'skeleton' or two - I don't really want to add any more that they might not want to know. So far I have discovered origins in Norfolk, Lincolnshire, Yorkshire, Sussex and Staffordshire.
Thank you for the Emma Hopper which I missed. She must have been a twin to Hugh - first born to Hugh Hopper and Sarah Wood in 1903. I don't currently have the marriage certificate, and I didn't scan it into my computer, but I did try that line myself when I did have the certificate. I'll get the info later.
Thanks again for now, Michael.
Malcolm
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Yorkshire (Rawdon) EXLEY.
Scotland (Dumfries) REID
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lazytee
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 26
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hi Malcolm!
I have just happened upon your fascinating exchange of messages with Alan and Michael, and when I read the name HUGH HOPPER I jumped to attention, because Hugh is an outer twiglet in my family tree. His first wife Mary Bell was the daughter of Matthew Bell and Rachel Morpeth (as discovered by Michael) and Rachel is my great x 2 aunt, sister of my great grandfather Edward Morpeth.
I'm afraid I can't contribute anything useful to the mystery of Harriet Sarah Millicent Armstrong's name, but I can positively confirm that the Robert Bell, in whose household Sarah was living in 1901, is not in any way related to the Bell/Morpeth family (though, in fact, Mary Bell did have a brother Robert, but he can easily be traced separately through the 1861-1901 censuses). Bell is a very common name in Northumberland - I have several strands of Bells in my family tree.
If the family you are researching for is descended directly from Hugh Hopper and Sarah Wood/Armstrong, they may be interested to know that, during the 1880s, Hugh and first wife Mary and little daughter Rachel emigrated to the coalfields of Pennsylvania, and while in the U.S. they had a son Christopher, born in Fayette County, Pa. in about 1884. They actually went out to the the same district of Pennsylvania as Mary's uncle John Morpeth, who emigrated from Choppington with his wife Isabella Hornsby and their baby William in 1871. John, Isabella and William can be found in the U.S. census of 1880 at North Union, Fayette Co., Pa. (You have to have World Membership of Ancestry to access this - it was done for me by a kind friend.) Whereas John, Isabella and William stayed in the U.S.A. for the rest of their lives, William eventually dying in about 1954, the Hoppers returned to Northumberland after a few years, settling and having more children in Ashington.
Thank you so much to you all, Malcolm, Alan and Michael for your delightful correspondence and for providing me with this extra piece to my family jigsaw. As I do not yet have access to the 1911 census, I was completely unaware that Mary Bell died and Hugh remarried the splendid mystery woman Sarah Wood.
If there is any further info you would like about the Bell/Morpeth family, Malcolm, I would be happy to share what I have with you.
Kindest regards to you all,
Hazel.
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2zpool
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1442
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Hmmm--my family from Bedlington and Choppington also went in about 1884 to North Union Twp in Fayette Co. Pennsylvania!!! Popular place-also very pretty.
Janis
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Co. Durham: Hall, Snowdon, Makepeace, Barnfather, Barrass, Gray/Grey, Wilson, Carr, Cole, Richardson, Greener Northumberland: Grey/Gray, Richardson, Barnfather, Heron, Redpath ------------------------------------------------------------------ Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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Michael Dixon
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 2633
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Wee bit of Trivia.
A few years ago, a local historian in Blyth, Northumberland, UK, in reply to my question on why/how so many local miners left for Pennsylvania in c1880s, told me that a man in Cramlington acted as a Agent for US mining concerns, recruiting miners.
Michael Dixon
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Names.
GALLAGHER ( + variations).
Areas. Co Sligo, Co Leitrim, Co Mayo. IRELAND.
Ontario, CANADA
Lowell, Ma, USA
Counties of Northumberland & Durham, ENGLAND
-------------------------------------------------------------------
MALEY/MELIA/MALLEY - with or without " O "
Westport Co Mayo. Northumberland
-------------------------------------------------------------------
DIXON
Cumberland.. Brampton, Carlisle, ENGLAND
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2zpool
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1442
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I tried to find advertisements in the newspapers but didn't see any. North Union Twp is not a very large place-well not famous at any rate. I know the mines were just opening and these people were experienced miners.
Janis
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Co. Durham: Hall, Snowdon, Makepeace, Barnfather, Barrass, Gray/Grey, Wilson, Carr, Cole, Richardson, Greener Northumberland: Grey/Gray, Richardson, Barnfather, Heron, Redpath ------------------------------------------------------------------ Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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lazytee
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 26
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Thanks for that Michael. I was just about to ask Janis if she knew how it was that English miners emigrated to that particular part of Pennsylvania. Of course I do not know if Hugh Hopper deliberately followed his wife's uncle to Pennsylvania, or whether it was just coincidence. Probably the latter. Interesting, though, how John Morpeth came to go to Fayette County ten years earlier.
Cheers, Hazel
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Michael Dixon
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 2633
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My Ireland-born great g/f remained in the coal mines around Blyth, Northumberland, Uk.
His Ireland-born siblings worked in coal mines in Sunderland area, County Durham. One brother emigrated to work mines in McKeesport, Allegheny County, Pennsylvania.
Michael
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Names.
GALLAGHER ( + variations).
Areas. Co Sligo, Co Leitrim, Co Mayo. IRELAND.
Ontario, CANADA
Lowell, Ma, USA
Counties of Northumberland & Durham, ENGLAND
-------------------------------------------------------------------
MALEY/MELIA/MALLEY - with or without " O "
Westport Co Mayo. Northumberland
-------------------------------------------------------------------
DIXON
Cumberland.. Brampton, Carlisle, ENGLAND
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tongariro
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 62
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello Hazel!
Thank you for your interesting contribution. You are definite about Robert Bell not being a direct relative of Mary Bell - it did seem significant, but is probably just coincidental. One of those things that too often has us running down a road to nowhere 
Thanks too for the additional information about Hugh Hopper and Mary's move to the USA - and Mary's uncle preceding them. Useful information. I had concluded that they had gone (and come back) from the census entries for Christopher being born in the USA. I also concluded that little Rachel (firstborn) did not return with them as there is no other record of her. Died there or on passage???
As my friend's family are from the Hugh+Sarah marriage, I think I now have enough about the Hugh+Mary relationship for my purposes, thanks. I'm pleased that these exchanges have been a help to you in adding another bud to an outer twiglet!
Michael - I just want to thank you again for all your efforts and your 'musings' on this subject. There were too many thoughts to respond to all but they were interesting and useful. You did ask about the witnesses to the wedding of Hugh Hopper and Harriet Sarah Millicent Armstrong - they were Christopher Hopper (either Hugh's son, or his 76 year old father), and Maggie Grieves - and she leads nowhere.
I have another speculative route as to how Hugh and Harriet Sarah Wood met. Hugh's cousin (Andrew Moses Hopper) married a Selina Wood and lived in Cambois (as Hugh did). Like Sarah Millicent Wood, Selina Wood was born in Shropshire. Selina and Sarah may also have been cousins (they were not sisters). Not proven but a possibility. Harriet Sarah was on the marriage certificate as living in the same house as Hugh and had probably moved in to look after the small children after Mary Hopper died - the marriage ensued.
The mystery of the "Millicent Armstrong" bit remains!!
Curiously, I am writing this to you two, Michael and Hazel, and the friend I am doing it for is called Michael - his wife is Hazel!
Malcolm
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Yorkshire (Rawdon) EXLEY.
Scotland (Dumfries) REID
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lazytee
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 26
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hi Malcolm!
Glad you found my contribution interesting. Little Rachel died at the age of 7 in Q4 1888 in Morpeth registration district.
Cheers, Hazel.
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Pages: [1]
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I had noticed the B in MILLICENT B WOOD but its possible significance had passed me by! You are probably right in suggesting that MILICENT BELL may be the relevant birth. If ROBERT BELL had acknowledged umarried paternity at the registration then both BELL and WOOD should be on the certificate and she could be called MILLICENT BELL WOOD. I will have to obtain the certificate to prove it.