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Author Topic: The illusive sam "COMPLETED"  (Read 721 times)
robsdad
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Posts: 113


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


The illusive sam "COMPLETED"
« on: Saturday 06 June 09 21:16 UTC (UK) »

Hi everyone, my first try at this so please be gentle with me.
my gggf Samuel Lambsdale 50 on 1841 and 59 on 1851 says he's born in . Wolverhampton
but no trace so far at wolves archives etc.
any help would be great.
his 'wife' was a Charlotte Devonport christened in Kinver but no marriage details located.

Cheers  robsdad
« Last Edit: Monday 13 July 09 16:21 UTC (UK) by robsdad » Logged
heywood
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Posts: 8888



Re: The illusive sam
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 06 June 09 23:06 UTC (UK) »

Hi robsdad,

Welcome to rootschat!

I don't think I am going to be much help but have a couple of things for you to follow up.
You may already have all this info.
I assume because of your inverted commas for Charlotte that you know that she is a second 'wife'.

1841 has an Elias ? ' Elins'. 23 yrs with the family.

Family Search has a christening for him -1818 St Peter's Wolverhampton with parents Samuel and Mary.
There are other children for Samuel and Mary. Samuel (1814) and Elizabeth (1813)
The death of Mary (assuming it happened) would explain the gap in the children until the 'marriage' with Charlotte.

1841 and 1851
Samuel is a Locksmith
1851 HO107; Piece: 2020; Folio: 241; Page: 32
has a John Lambsdale 50 yrs b Wolverhampton who is also a Locksmith (sometimes trades run in families)

I had thought that this Samuel and John were part of a group of children baptised to Elias and Nancy Lamsdale on Family Search in Willenhall. However I have found them elsewhere  Sad
They may somehow be related to the father in the family Elias  Huh
best wishes
heywood
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Alexander, Suffolk and Lancashire; Ashworth,Whitworth, Grindrod Lancashire; Golden, Duffy County Mayo.
heywood
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Posts: 8888



Re: The illusive sam
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 06 June 09 23:25 UTC (UK) »

I'm back again and I fear just causing mayhem!

I found Elias and Nancy Lansdale in 1841 (born 1761) and they have their Samuel with them.. so ruled out. He is a locksmith.
There is another Elias Lambsdale b 1801- a locksmith.

I think I had better forget my theory re Locksmiths - I know it was an Iron area but everyone seems to be a locksmith   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

I think I should leave this now
heywood
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Alexander, Suffolk and Lancashire; Ashworth,Whitworth, Grindrod Lancashire; Golden, Duffy County Mayo.
DMP
RootsChat Aristocrat
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Posts: 1670



Re: The illusive sam
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 07 June 09 00:58 UTC (UK) »

Hi
Samuel Lambsdale married Charlotte
9 Dec 1835
St Peter Wolverhampton
Samuel was a widow
Charlotte a spinster
Witness
William Brookes/John Biddulph

also
Merridale cemetery
18 Mar 1855 Samuel LAMSDALE 63years  Zoar Street
9 Jan 1876 Charlotte LAMSDALE 64years  Compton Street
from
http://www.wolverhamptonhistory.org.uk/resources/familyhistory

Donna
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Butler/Willenhall/Smethwick/bromsgrove Briton/oldbury Doughty/Homer/Reynolds/Whitehouse/tipton Greenaway/gornal Phillips/,bala Toon/burton Selwood/tipton/worcester skidmore/hill top Wedgbury/worcester Wheatley/west Bromwich  Wooldridge/oldswinford  Worton/cradley Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
robsdad
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Posts: 113


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Re: The illusive sam
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 07 June 09 09:18 UTC (UK) »

Thanks Donna,
Missed that entry somehow
Had my suspicions he was married more than once

Cheers and thanks again

robsdad
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robsdad
RootsChat Member
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Posts: 113


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Re: The illusive sam
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 07 June 09 09:24 UTC (UK) »

Thanks heywood,
I did find this info. over time but many thanks for your efforts
Donna seems to have come up trumps
just need to locate his birth details now

cheers

robsdad
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charlotteCH
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Posts: 3674



Re: The illusive sam
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 07 June 09 09:26 UTC (UK) »

Hi robsdad. welcome to rootschat Grin

Do you know about freebmd?  It's a website where you can lookup bdms- gives you the basic info and when you put this with the census you can start to get some bearings on people.  This sort of search always needs proper cross checking but it is a site worth knowing about for your future hunts.
The events listed on the site start in 1837 and the transcriptions are up to c. 1920 now.

charlotte
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robsdad
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Posts: 113


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Re: The illusive sam
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 07 June 09 09:39 UTC (UK) »

Thanks charlotte
Always useful to know, more info the beter

cheers

robsdad
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DMP
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Posts: 1670



Re: The illusive sam
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 07 June 09 15:21 UTC (UK) »

Hi
found this marriage

Samuel Lamsdale
Martha Fair
17 oct 1814
Penn

Donna
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Butler/Willenhall/Smethwick/bromsgrove Briton/oldbury Doughty/Homer/Reynolds/Whitehouse/tipton Greenaway/gornal Phillips/,bala Toon/burton Selwood/tipton/worcester skidmore/hill top Wedgbury/worcester Wheatley/west Bromwich  Wooldridge/oldswinford  Worton/cradley Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
DMP
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Posts: 1670



Re: The illusive sam
« Reply #9 on: Sunday 07 June 09 15:23 UTC (UK) »

Hi
Children bapt at st peter
Martha 10 dec 1820
Ann 18 may 1823
Samuel 24 sept 1824
Emily 15 march 1827
Louisa 15 dec 1829
Samuel 9 july 1832

all from
http://www.freereg.org.uk/

Donna
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Butler/Willenhall/Smethwick/bromsgrove Briton/oldbury Doughty/Homer/Reynolds/Whitehouse/tipton Greenaway/gornal Phillips/,bala Toon/burton Selwood/tipton/worcester skidmore/hill top Wedgbury/worcester Wheatley/west Bromwich  Wooldridge/oldswinford  Worton/cradley Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
robsdad
RootsChat Member
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Posts: 113


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Re: The illusive sam
« Reply #10 on: Sunday 07 June 09 17:19 UTC (UK) »

Hi Donna
Seems Sam had families with a Mary, Martha & Charlotte
between 1813 and 1850ish according to St Peter's Reg. etc

Thanks for your efforts, I'm now trying to locate Sam's birth c1792
with little sucess so far.

Cheers

robsdad
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DMP
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Posts: 1670



Re: The illusive sam
« Reply #11 on: Sunday 07 June 09 19:43 UTC (UK) »

Hi Robsdad
i found these 2
Samuel LANDSDALE
12 feb 1782
Simeon & Lydia

Samuel Langsdale
29 dec 1791 born 1789 9th august
Elias & Elizabeth

Donna
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Butler/Willenhall/Smethwick/bromsgrove Briton/oldbury Doughty/Homer/Reynolds/Whitehouse/tipton Greenaway/gornal Phillips/,bala Toon/burton Selwood/tipton/worcester skidmore/hill top Wedgbury/worcester Wheatley/west Bromwich  Wooldridge/oldswinford  Worton/cradley Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
heywood
RootsChat Marquessate
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Posts: 8888



Re: The illusive sam
« Reply #12 on: Sunday 07 June 09 20:32 UTC (UK) »

The second one  looks good to me Donna - the Elias connection.

(that's just me though  Roll Eyes)
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Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Alexander, Suffolk and Lancashire; Ashworth,Whitworth, Grindrod Lancashire; Golden, Duffy County Mayo.
robsdad
RootsChat Member
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Posts: 113


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Re: The illusive sam
« Reply #13 on: Monday 08 June 09 08:32 UTC (UK) »

Hi both

Yes the son of Elias & Elizabeth is almost certainly the one from his age on 1841

they married 1789 St. Peter's

Samuel seems to have had three families / marriages as children by all wives are with
him and Charlotte on 1841

Thanks for your input

robsdad
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FamousWolf
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Posts: 2


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Re: The illusive sam "COMPLETED"
« Reply #14 on: Sunday 02 August 09 17:42 UTC (UK) »

Hi  Just joined Rootschat and found this discussion which aroused my interest because my GGGF and GGGGF were both Samuel Lamsdales.  From what I can gather from the information in the replies to your message, my own research and following up some of the helpful links folks have given I think that there were at least 6 or 7 of them in the early 19th C so trying to unpick one from the other is hard.  I found it useful to write it all down and wondered if you would be interested in my thoughts. I think we have the following family groups at least (but happy to be corrected about any of the names and dates)

Samuel and Mary who had children from about 1813-1818 (Elizabeth 1813, Samuel 1814, Elias 1818)

Samuel and Martha who had children from about 1820 -1832 (Martha 1820, Ann 1823, Samuel 1825 (d. 1826), Emily 1827, Louisa 1829, Samuel 1832 (who I think is my ancestor, d 1892)),   

Samuel and Charlotte who had children from about 1836 - 1847 (George 1836, William Henry 1841 and Charlotte 1847). 

It’s possible that these three entries are the same Samuel, certainly the ages fit:  one of your respondents found a record of death of Samuel of 18/3/1855 aged 63.  So he would have been born about 1792. So, assuming that this is the same Samuel (but it may not be of course), it is possible that he (a) married Mary, started having children with her in 1813 aged about 21 then (b) married Martha aged about 27/28 in around 1819 then went on to (c) marry Charlotte about age 43 (your respondent said that when he married Charlotte in 1835 he was a widower which supports the theory of a second marriage). 

However, one of your correspondents found a marriage entry of Samuel and Martha of 1814 which suggests that we have two Samuels here, the Samuel who married Mary and the Samuel who married Martha and then Charlotte.  I would really like to find out which is true! 

However, just for good measure there are records of the following marriages of other Samuel Lamsdale

Samuel and Jane Williams 23/11/1838
Samuel and Mary Walker 1/8/1843
Samuel and Elizabeth Dudlick 18/3/1849
Samuel and Ann Hickman 22/5/1854 (my ancestor)

So it is possible that we share a common ancestor.  At the time of Samuel and Ann’s marriage in 1854, Samuel Senior was living in Brick Street as a Locksmith

If you find out anything more then I would be interested to hear
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