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Topic: Thomas RODGERS - NSW (Read 1088 times)
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lucybella
RootsChat Member
Posts: 112
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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I am trying to trace my granduncle from Ireland. He was called Thomas Rodgers, born Belfast 13/2/1896, and immigrated to Australia during the 20's or 30's.
I think I have found him in Military records for Canberra, enlisting in Hay? I have sent off for the records, which will take 60 days I believe.
I cannot find any death certificate for him. I am wondering if he ever married out there and had a family. If anyone can help, any advice would be much appreciated.
Thanks
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cando
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 6314
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Hi lucybella
Welcome to rootschat.
http://www.ww2roll.gov.au/
RODGERS, Thomas Australian Army N104434
Born 13 Feb 1896 Belfast Ireland
Enlisted 5 May 1941 at Hay Locality of Ardlethan, NSW
His NOK Edward ROGERS. He was discharged on 25 Jun 1946 with Rank of Private. His posting at discharge was 16 Garrison Battalion.
You can search here
http://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/familyHistory/search.htm
His parents' names would help identify him in the death index.
Lots of resources for NSW at the top of the board
AUSTRALIAN RESOURCES
> New South Wales Resources
I am sure others 'chatters will have input to help you in your quest.
Cheers
Cando
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lucybella
RootsChat Member
Posts: 112
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Thank you very much for your help! I cannot believe I have located Thomas in Australia. There is so much more I would like to know, for example, if he married and had children.
I have searched the death index many times, but cannot find a death certificate for him. I know his parents names, father was William, and mother was Mary Jane. However, he was orphaned in Belfast at around 6 years of age (both parents died in 1904) and he probably went into care, so I wonder if he would have much memory of his parents. I have searched also by leaving the parents names blank, but still no death certificate.
His next of kin is Edward in the army records. Edward was his older brother by a couple of years, and was my grandfather.
Thanks again for your response.
Lucybella
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cando
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 6314
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Lucybella if Thomas was married at the time of enlistment in 1941, his wife would have been noted as next of kin not Edward.
Perhaps wait until you receive his service record before searching further. There may be more information in his file. My aunt married at the end of the war prior to discharge and it was noted in her record. Occasionally there can be communications post discharge about pension applications etc.
I wonder if someone could search some of the online shipping records to see if they can locate his arrival.I cannot see a passenger record for Thomas.
I cannot see a Thomas RODGERS on the 1936 NSW electoral roll around the Hay area. Of course he may not have been in the area in 1936 or he may not have enrolled.
Hopefully his service record will give some useful info.
Cheers
Cando
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lucybella
RootsChat Member
Posts: 112
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Thank you Cando
I just posted on another thread about the electoral rolls, not spotting that you had already searched the 1936 ones in the Hay area for me. Thank you.
Should I join 'ancestry' do you think? Would I have access to all the Australian electoral rolls if I did so?
Any advice welcome
Lucy
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tropicalj
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9046
Mason and Callum
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It would not be right for any of us to advise you to join Ancestery or not that is an individual decision based on whether or not you will get what you want from it plus the costs involved.
Ancestery only has a few rolls for each state to look at ie 1930 and 1936 for NSW.
As to finding his death if he died in NSW the records are only available up to 1978 and it is possible he lived past that year.
kind thoughts Jenn
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When you search for ancestors, you find great friends! I live in Townsville, Australia researching TOWNSEND,PINNEGAR, STRANGE, PULLEN, GRIFFIN from Wiltshire,, SHOEBRIDGE, VINALL, BRINDLE, Kent BAYLEY, Dorset,Yorkshire, HAIR, Durham, CUMMINS, BROWNLESS from Yorkshire, EDSALL, Cornwall, MORGAN, HENNESSY, BAKER, Ireland. In Australia Hennessy, Hair, Bayley, Townsend, Shoebridge, Edsall, Adamson, All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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lucybella
RootsChat Member
Posts: 112
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Thank you Tropicalj
Yes, I see what you mean, it can get quite expensive to research these things. I have already spent quite a bit of time and money on the 'Irish History Foundation' website, although I must say I have found a great deal of my family's history on it
Thomas Rodgers seems to have gone missing, according to family lore, all of a sudden. For a number of years after his emmigration, he remained in contact I believe. The family in Ireland used to send him parcels (favourite cigarettes etc) and then suddenly there were no reply's or further contact from him. I do not know the address they wrote to.
They felt this was very unusual and tried by whatever resources were available to them in Belfast in the 1940's, to have a search done for him. This was unsuccessful and they felt something terrible had befallen him. It is a mystery there is no death certificate.
It is very unlikely that he lived into his 80's or beyond I think, and made no contact with home.
It is a mystery I would love to solve and now maybe with the wonders of the internet, maybe some information will turn up.
Thank you very much for your reply.
Lucy
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tropicalj
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9046
Mason and Callum
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Do you know if the family in ireland moved at all, that might explain why they never heard from him.
It is a pity you don't have any idea in Australia as to where they used to write to him
Jenn
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When you search for ancestors, you find great friends! I live in Townsville, Australia researching TOWNSEND,PINNEGAR, STRANGE, PULLEN, GRIFFIN from Wiltshire,, SHOEBRIDGE, VINALL, BRINDLE, Kent BAYLEY, Dorset,Yorkshire, HAIR, Durham, CUMMINS, BROWNLESS from Yorkshire, EDSALL, Cornwall, MORGAN, HENNESSY, BAKER, Ireland. In Australia Hennessy, Hair, Bayley, Townsend, Shoebridge, Edsall, Adamson, All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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cando
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 6314
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Hi lucybella 
During the 1940's Thomas may not have received the family mail as he was in the army.
Wonder if he was a stockman or ag labourer working around the Hay area when he enlisted. Perhaps he returned to inland Australia after being discharged from the army.
There is no central registry in Australia for births, deaths and marriages. Each State Government is responsible for recording any bdm's occuring in their State. Thomas could have died in any State or Territory in Australia and so the search has to be done state by state. Thomas may have also left Australia post discharge.
I have searched the available death indexes in the States of Western Australia, Victoria, South Australia, New South Wales and the Australian Capital Territor. I can't see a death that 'matches' ie with either the correct parents or no parents listed. The available death indexes only extend to 1956 for WA, 1985 for Victoria, 1972 for SA, 1978 NSW and 1979 ACT. There are no deaths available post 1930 for Tasmania or online death index post 1929 for Queensland. There are deaths to 1964 on fiche for Qld.
The Northern Territory does not have online indexes however I have searched a couple of resources that include deaths extracted from cemeteries registers, headstones, newspapers, probates and police journals and other than a burial record in 1963 for a RODGERS with no given name, or age, at Alice Springs, nil result.
As suggested previously, perhaps wait until you receive Thomas's service record in the hope there may be some correspondence post 1946, date of discharge.
You have mentioned that he was at Hay and Canberra. I assume you have taken this from the online service record information. Canberra, ACT is the location of his service record as that is where the National Archives are located.
Cheers
Cando
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lucybella
RootsChat Member
Posts: 112
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Thank you so much Cando for the time and trouble you went to to help me. It is much appreciated!
I will try to investigate further that death in Alice Springs, there must be some record somewhere of who is buried there, age etc.
I am wondering if Thomas could have been shell shocked or ill in some way on discharge from the army. If so it would be easy for him to have become homeless etc, being a man on his own, far away from home and family. Still, a death certificate should be somewhere for him, and I will continue that search.
I am wondering if there is anybody out there from the 16th Garrison Battalion, discharged in 1946. Any soldiers who were in their 20's then, would be 80's now, and may remember him. I know it's a long shot, but someone reading this may have a father or an uncle who fought with Thomas Rodgers.
It seems that where he was stationed in Alderlethan was an Italian Prisoner of War camp at the time. Maybe that would ring bells with someone. Or perhaps I could get a list of the men in that battalion?
Tropicalj, I am sorry for starting a new thread on the electoral rolls - I do not know how to fix that.
Annie - thanks for your help. In fact Thomas's father was William, he gave his older brother Edward as next of kin, as he was orphaned of both parents at a young age.
I must patiently await the army records now.
Lucy
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lucybella
RootsChat Member
Posts: 112
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Also Tropicalj,
I know that the family of Thomas's brother, Edward. remained in the same house in Belfast until well into the 1980's, when the whole area was knocked and rebuilt. Even then families remained in the area, and could easily be found as there is a good community there and people know each other.
So it's not a case of him losing the family, but rather they losing him.
Thanks
Lucy
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tropicalj
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9046
Mason and Callum
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http://www.awm.gov.au/research/people/all/
Hello there
interesting you say he might have been a POW. However he is not showing up as a POW, have a look at this website.
I see re reading it he may have been stationed at a POW camp, which is more than like to be at Dunera which is near HAY where he enlisted at the 16th Garrison was established.
Jenn
edited by Jenn today 8am
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When you search for ancestors, you find great friends! I live in Townsville, Australia researching TOWNSEND,PINNEGAR, STRANGE, PULLEN, GRIFFIN from Wiltshire,, SHOEBRIDGE, VINALL, BRINDLE, Kent BAYLEY, Dorset,Yorkshire, HAIR, Durham, CUMMINS, BROWNLESS from Yorkshire, EDSALL, Cornwall, MORGAN, HENNESSY, BAKER, Ireland. In Australia Hennessy, Hair, Bayley, Townsend, Shoebridge, Edsall, Adamson, All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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tropicalj
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9046
Mason and Callum
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http://hay-plains-holiday-park.nsw.big4.com.au/local-attractions/9127350/16th-garrison-battalion-day.aspx
I have been trying to find a bit more about the 16th Garrison, on this page you will see a phone no that might be able to help you as the have a celecration there for the formation of the 16th Garrison. But as I don't know if you are in Ireland or not don't know if the phone number will be of much help.
Jenn
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Logged
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When you search for ancestors, you find great friends! I live in Townsville, Australia researching TOWNSEND,PINNEGAR, STRANGE, PULLEN, GRIFFIN from Wiltshire,, SHOEBRIDGE, VINALL, BRINDLE, Kent BAYLEY, Dorset,Yorkshire, HAIR, Durham, CUMMINS, BROWNLESS from Yorkshire, EDSALL, Cornwall, MORGAN, HENNESSY, BAKER, Ireland. In Australia Hennessy, Hair, Bayley, Townsend, Shoebridge, Edsall, Adamson, All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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lucybella
RootsChat Member
Posts: 112
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello Tropicalj, Cando and all
I am very grateful for that link to Hay 16th Garrison Commemoration day, Tropical, as I have decided to email their 'Historical Records' Dept, and will hopefully find something out about Thomas.
There are several phone numbers too, with 'skype' signs beside them, although when I investigated, they are not actually on 'skype', rather they are ordinary land lines. As I am in Ireland it would have been great had they been on 'skype'. But there is an email address, and there is a 'search' available in Historical records, for a small fee. So I am hopeful! Thanks again!
In the past week I have been reading extensively on the internet about emigration from Ireland to Australia. I have searched everything available to do with passengers, and cemeteries. But I have not succeeded in finding Thomas Rodgers leaving Belfast (or London maybe) for Australia in the 1920's or 1930's. And he definitely did so...
Also although I have gone through many many searchable indexes for burials in NSW, I have found very little to go on so far. I am becoming quite obsessed with finding the answers now!
As he was deemed a missing person when he first stopped contact with his brother in Belfast, there may be some police record of the search for him. I can only make a guess at the place and date of the report though.
I am hopeful of getting some names of men in the 16th Garrison at Hay who may be still living, and may actually remember Thomas.
Thanks again to all who helped me so far.
Lucy
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tropicalj
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9046
Mason and Callum
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Good luck with your searching and please let us know how you get on please
kind thoughts Jenn
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When you search for ancestors, you find great friends! I live in Townsville, Australia researching TOWNSEND,PINNEGAR, STRANGE, PULLEN, GRIFFIN from Wiltshire,, SHOEBRIDGE, VINALL, BRINDLE, Kent BAYLEY, Dorset,Yorkshire, HAIR, Durham, CUMMINS, BROWNLESS from Yorkshire, EDSALL, Cornwall, MORGAN, HENNESSY, BAKER, Ireland. In Australia Hennessy, Hair, Bayley, Townsend, Shoebridge, Edsall, Adamson, All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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