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Topic: Edward BUTCHER of Ripley? (Read 227 times)
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FreckNeale
RootsChat Member
Posts: 168
The Grapes Inn, Westhorpe, Southwell, Notts
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Hi, I have been stuck on my ggg grandfather's line for ages, and even though I now know his father's name I have not been able to get much further on it. His name was Edward Butcher, and he was born about 1841. I have found him in 1861, where he was a hosier's assistant in Marylebone, Middlesex, and by the time he married in 1865 he was still living at the same address (164 Oxford St). I have been able to trace him in every census since then, living with his wife Elizabeth, until his death in 1922 in Laxton, Nottinghamshire. He was very consistant with his age and birthplace. Every census gave a birth year around 1840-1841 and a birthplace of Ripley, Surrey. But I can't find a birth or baptism in that area, and I can't find him prior to 1861. The 1865 marriage certificate states that his father was another Edward Butcher, a Merchant's Clerk. The witnesses at the wedding were William Charles Winterburn and Jane Elizabeth Winterburn, but no known relation to the Butchers.
I've got stuck and I don't know where to turn now. Any help or ideas would be much appreciated.
Thanks, Alexander
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Logged
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Neale (or Nail) - Birmingham | Kidderminster, Worcs | Oldswinford, Worcs
Baxter - Birmingham | Ecclesall, Yorks | Peckham, Surrey
Fellows - Birmingham | Slipton, Northants
Johnson - Solihull, Birmingham
Frecknall (or Fricknall, Frignal) - Norwell, Notts | Caunton, Notts
Johnson - Laxton, Notts
Hall - Southwell, Notts
Cook (or Cooke) - Southwell, Notts
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suzard
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 10287
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Hi Alexander,
Is it possible Edward was born before his parents married???
Maybe his mum was b Ripley Surrey and he was born in a different place?
I'll post my findings in a mo
Suz
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Thornhill, Cresswell, Sisson, Harriman, Cripps, Eyre, Walter, Marson, Battison, Holmes, Bailey, Hardman, Fairhurst Noon-mainly in Derbys/Notts-but also Northampton, Oxford, Leics, Lancs-England Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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suzard
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 10287
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1851 census shows this -although very badly written in parts-
Adermanbury London
Edward Butcher head m 57? Warehouseman Goring Suffolk
Elizabeth wife 37 ripley Surrey
Edward son 11 bethnal green london
Elizabeth catherine daughter 1 Aldermanbury london
Louisa frances hardin Visitor U 61 Ripley surrey
HO107 1529 255 16
then there is a marriage reg freeBMD
Jun qtr 1848
Marylebone
on same page
Edward Butcher
Elizabeth hardin
1 219
and birth reg freeBMD
Dec qtr 1839
Bethnal green
Edward butcher hardin
2 11
??
Suz
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Thornhill, Cresswell, Sisson, Harriman, Cripps, Eyre, Walter, Marson, Battison, Holmes, Bailey, Hardman, Fairhurst Noon-mainly in Derbys/Notts-but also Northampton, Oxford, Leics, Lancs-England Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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FreckNeale
RootsChat Member
Posts: 168
The Grapes Inn, Westhorpe, Southwell, Notts
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Thanks for your prompt reply, Suz.
I had noticed that census entry when I looked through it one Edward Butcher at a time but I ruled it out because Bethnal Green is so far from Ripley. But it's very possible. I also did consider that he was born before his parents married but had no leads on to why.
I'll check to see if I can find Edward as a Hardin in 1841.
Thanks again,
Alexander
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Logged
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Neale (or Nail) - Birmingham | Kidderminster, Worcs | Oldswinford, Worcs
Baxter - Birmingham | Ecclesall, Yorks | Peckham, Surrey
Fellows - Birmingham | Slipton, Northants
Johnson - Solihull, Birmingham
Frecknall (or Fricknall, Frignal) - Norwell, Notts | Caunton, Notts
Johnson - Laxton, Notts
Hall - Southwell, Notts
Cook (or Cooke) - Southwell, Notts
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FreckNeale
RootsChat Member
Posts: 168
The Grapes Inn, Westhorpe, Southwell, Notts
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yes, I think it's him.
Here they are in 1841, living back in Ripley near Send:
George Harden, 53, Ind., born in co.: Y
Louisa Harden, 50, Y
Elizabeth Harden, 25, Milliner, Y
Jane Harden, 20, Y
Edward Harden, 19 months, N
Ann Sershall, 25, F.S., Y
The ages all fit and it even shows that Edward wasn't born in the county, even though he must have thought he had been since he seems to have grew up in Ripley. At least it was probably the earliest place he could remember living. And Elizabeth's mother Louisa was the 'visitor' in 1851 I suppose.
Thanks again Suz - I can't believe how you have just about solved it in 5 minutes and I've spent weeks going through the 1841 and 1851 census looking for him!
Alexander
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Neale (or Nail) - Birmingham | Kidderminster, Worcs | Oldswinford, Worcs
Baxter - Birmingham | Ecclesall, Yorks | Peckham, Surrey
Fellows - Birmingham | Slipton, Northants
Johnson - Solihull, Birmingham
Frecknall (or Fricknall, Frignal) - Norwell, Notts | Caunton, Notts
Johnson - Laxton, Notts
Hall - Southwell, Notts
Cook (or Cooke) - Southwell, Notts
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FreckNeale
RootsChat Member
Posts: 168
The Grapes Inn, Westhorpe, Southwell, Notts
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And I've just found him on the IGI:
EDWARD BUTCHER HARDEN
born 01 NOV 1839
Christening: 01 DEC 1839 Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London, England
Parents Edward Harden & Elizabeth
Clearly it's either transcribed wrong or something, because we know Elizabeth's surname was Harden but it's definately the right one.
The only thing that worried me was that on Edward Butcher's marriage cert it says father's occ Merchant's Clerk, but in 1851 he was a warehouseman and in 1861 he was a "smith". He had died by 1871. Oh well, I think it fits well enough...he seem to get through the occupations quick!
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Logged
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Neale (or Nail) - Birmingham | Kidderminster, Worcs | Oldswinford, Worcs
Baxter - Birmingham | Ecclesall, Yorks | Peckham, Surrey
Fellows - Birmingham | Slipton, Northants
Johnson - Solihull, Birmingham
Frecknall (or Fricknall, Frignal) - Norwell, Notts | Caunton, Notts
Johnson - Laxton, Notts
Hall - Southwell, Notts
Cook (or Cooke) - Southwell, Notts
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suzard
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 10287
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Hi,
I found the 1841 census - but couldn't get back on site to post
It very much looks like he is the correct Edward - wonder where Edward snr was in 1841? and why they didn't marry for a few years??
I'm sure it will all fall into place eventually
Suz
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Thornhill, Cresswell, Sisson, Harriman, Cripps, Eyre, Walter, Marson, Battison, Holmes, Bailey, Hardman, Fairhurst Noon-mainly in Derbys/Notts-but also Northampton, Oxford, Leics, Lancs-England Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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