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Topic: *Completed*James and Frances KIDD in 1851 (Read 269 times)
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Philcandy
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1550
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Fellow listers
I would be grateful if anyone could find James KIDD, perhaps a mariner, and his wife Frances (formerly SWAN) in 1851?
They married in or near Hartepool in 1850, so may not have had any children with them.
I think that Frances was born about 1832, so would have been 19 or so in 1851.
Many thanks
Philip Candy
Australia
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« Last Edit: Monday 28 September 09 01:22 UTC (UK) by Philcandy »
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evie
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1896
Barnaby
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Hi Philip
James Kidd, Head, 28, Master Mariner, Newcastle, Northumberland
Frances Kidd, Wife, 18, Sunderland, Durham
Living St helens Place, Hartlepool
HO107 Piece: 2384 Folio: 320 Page: 16
Evie
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Booth, Hornsby, Northumberland & Durham Jackson, Northumberland & Durham Douthwaite, N Yorks & Durham Geldard, N Yorks Ward, Cheshire & W Yorks Swallow, Boid, W Yorks Kirby, Lowe, Studholme, Geary, Emery, Baldock census info is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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Philcandy
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1550
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Fantastic Evie. many thanks.
Any sign of James KIDD or Frances SWAN in 1841 based on their birthplaces in 1851? Frances's parents were Joseph SWAN and Mary Ann HENDERSON.
Kind regards and thanks again.
Philip
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evie
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1896
Barnaby
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Hi Philip
I think this will be your Frances Swann in 1841 living Cleadon Village which is about 5 miles from Sunderland
James Swann, 45, Ag Lab
Jane , 40
John, 20, Ag Lab
Elisa, 15
Stephen, 15
Frances, 8
William, 5
All born in County
Evie
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Booth, Hornsby, Northumberland & Durham Jackson, Northumberland & Durham Douthwaite, N Yorks & Durham Geldard, N Yorks Ward, Cheshire & W Yorks Swallow, Boid, W Yorks Kirby, Lowe, Studholme, Geary, Emery, Baldock census info is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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evie
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1896
Barnaby
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There are two James Kidds in 1841 about the same age and as they rounded ages it is difficult.
Frances Kidd, 40, Seamster
James Kidd, 15, Shipwright
Both born Northumberland living Stepney Bank, Byker, Newcastle
HO107 Piece 820, Book 1, Folio 13, Page: 18
and the other who looks to have an occupation of Mariner although not too clear is
John Kidd, 56, Gardiner
Elizabeth Kidd, 15
James Kidd, 15, Mariner
Living Village of Chirton, Tynemouth. All born in Northumberland
HO107, Piece 825, Book 1, Folio 4, Page 1
This is the difficulty as the area fits better with the first James but the occupation fits better with the second.
Evie
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Booth, Hornsby, Northumberland & Durham Jackson, Northumberland & Durham Douthwaite, N Yorks & Durham Geldard, N Yorks Ward, Cheshire & W Yorks Swallow, Boid, W Yorks Kirby, Lowe, Studholme, Geary, Emery, Baldock census info is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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Philcandy
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1550
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Hi Philip
I think this will be your Frances Swann in 1841 living Cleadon Village which is about 5 miles from Sunderland
James Swann, 45, Ag Lab
Jane , 40
John, 20, Ag Lab
Elisa, 15
Stephen, 15
Frances, 8
William, 5
All born in County
Evie
Hi Evie
This looks possible, except that I don't think the parents' names are correct. My earlier posting showed them as Joseph and Mary Ann, which is information that i think came from her marriage and death certificates in Australia.
Thanks a lot for the KIDD entries; I'll keep looking for evidence that might help to show which one is right.
Kind regards
Philip
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evie
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1896
Barnaby
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Oh sorry Philip how on earth did I miss that about Frances' parents I must have been interrupted as I was reading your post. I will have another look for you.
Evie
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Booth, Hornsby, Northumberland & Durham Jackson, Northumberland & Durham Douthwaite, N Yorks & Durham Geldard, N Yorks Ward, Cheshire & W Yorks Swallow, Boid, W Yorks Kirby, Lowe, Studholme, Geary, Emery, Baldock census info is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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Philcandy
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1550
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Hello Evie
I have done a bit more digging and have the names of the children that SHOULD be with Joseph and Mary Ann in 1841 at least:
Frances Ann Swan, b. 25 April 1832, Sunderland
Joseph (Junior) Swan, b. 2 March 1834, Sunderland
William Edward Swan, b. 14 December 1835, Sunderland
Martin Henderson Swan, b. 11 June 1837, Sunderland
With luck, some of them might also be at home in 1851 as well.
Kind regards
Philip
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evie
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1896
Barnaby
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There is a family in Hartlepool under the name Swan, although they have Francis down as male. Joseph is a butcher. William is missing, but there is an Elizabeth 2 months. Could this be them? If I cannot find anything else suitable i will type it out shortly.
Evie
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Booth, Hornsby, Northumberland & Durham Jackson, Northumberland & Durham Douthwaite, N Yorks & Durham Geldard, N Yorks Ward, Cheshire & W Yorks Swallow, Boid, W Yorks Kirby, Lowe, Studholme, Geary, Emery, Baldock census info is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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evie
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1896
Barnaby
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1841
Joseph Swan, 33, Butcher, not born in county
Mary, 30
Francis, 8
Joseph, 7
Mary, 2
Martin 4
Elizabeth 2 months
All born in county apart from Joseph living Northgate Street, Hartlepool with a FS Ann Taylor aged 12
Evie
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Booth, Hornsby, Northumberland & Durham Jackson, Northumberland & Durham Douthwaite, N Yorks & Durham Geldard, N Yorks Ward, Cheshire & W Yorks Swallow, Boid, W Yorks Kirby, Lowe, Studholme, Geary, Emery, Baldock census info is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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Philcandy
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1550
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thanks Evie. This certianly looks like them. Any sign of this family in 1851 that gives birth places especially for parents?
Best wishes
Philip
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evie
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1896
Barnaby
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Hi
In 1851
Joseph,43, is still a butcher living Northgate Street, Hartlepool born Warton, Northumberland
The children Martin U, 13, Mary Ann, 11 and Elizabeth, 9 all born Sunderland.
Now it looks like he has re married as his wife is called Isabella, 38, and she was born Sunderland
Evie
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Booth, Hornsby, Northumberland & Durham Jackson, Northumberland & Durham Douthwaite, N Yorks & Durham Geldard, N Yorks Ward, Cheshire & W Yorks Swallow, Boid, W Yorks Kirby, Lowe, Studholme, Geary, Emery, Baldock census info is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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evie
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1896
Barnaby
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You are very welcome.
Well that is interesting, I wonder if Joseph left a will or there are any records about payment as a part -owner?
Anything else you want checking?
Evie
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Booth, Hornsby, Northumberland & Durham Jackson, Northumberland & Durham Douthwaite, N Yorks & Durham Geldard, N Yorks Ward, Cheshire & W Yorks Swallow, Boid, W Yorks Kirby, Lowe, Studholme, Geary, Emery, Baldock census info is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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Philcandy
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1550
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Thanks Evie.
I may have taken this line of inquiry as far as I can for the time being.
I have a feeling that Joseph and Isabella may have moved to Australia too. I have found a will for a Joseph SWAN, a butcher, who died in 1866 leaving everything to his wife Isabella, so that looks pretty conclusive, at least on the face of it. Added later: I found the burials of Joseph in 1866 and Isaballa in 1891 in St Kilda Cemetery, Melbourne. They are interred with other members of their family and are indeed the people I was looking for:).
I'll close off this thread now, but many thanks for all your help.
Kind regards
Phil Candy
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« Last Edit: Tuesday 29 September 09 19:50 UTC (UK) by Philcandy »
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