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Author Topic: Manchester Catholic Parish Church - 1848  (Read 557 times)
emmsthheight
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Posts: 1892


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


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Re: Manchester Catholic Parish Church - 1848
« Reply #15 on: Thursday 01 October 09 23:00 UTC (UK) »

Hi

Thank you Luzzu.  That's a great site.  There's a great dpage on the origens of the Cathedral and other Manchester and Salford parishes.  Great explanation, but it's not surprising people get confused!

Also some fascinating transactions where marriage was concerned!

http://www.manchester-family-history-research.co.uk/new_page_10.htm

Best wishes

Emms
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Luzzu
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Re: Manchester Catholic Parish Church - 1848
« Reply #16 on: Friday 02 October 09 12:07 UTC (UK) »
Brilliant article.

Can you imagine the chaos of 10-20 couples getting married at the same time?
I read somewhere (can't remember where) that Christmas Day was popular for Manchester Cathedral weddings and - not sure how true this is  Undecided - that sometimes the Groom didn't even have to be present Shocked Shocked  Would be interesting if anyone else had heard anything like this.

Also, Salford Cathedral is a Catholic cathedral.
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Buck, Staffs & Hants; Crummett, Norfolk & Burnley; Osborne, Cornwall & Burnley; Haigh/Hague, Manchester & Todmorden; Grant, Manchester & Ireland; France, Manchester & Yorkshire; Shackleton, Burnley, Yorkshire & Australia;
FAB Fiona
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Re: Manchester Catholic Parish Church - 1848
« Reply #17 on: Friday 02 October 09 13:37 UTC (UK) »
"Catholic" can be a confusing word, as it means universal, all-encompassing, etc. 

Did it come into use in the religious sense in the 2nd century or so to differentiate it after the break with what are now the eastern "orthodox" churches?  And I think it is still used in CofE liturgy when it refers to itself as the Holy Catholic Church or some such (I stand to be corrected... ).

Some churches did refer to themselves as Catholic when they were CofE.  I don't think "Roman Catholic" came into use as a common term until the 20th century, the Roman Catholic church was more often The Church of Rome.

Doesn't help us much when we're trying to sort our family histories!

Fiona
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Bradbury-Gorton/Salford/Disley
Barker-Bury/Stockport/Cheadle, Staffs
Barrowclough-Salford/Sowerby
Berry-Coppull
Connolly-Hulme/Birkenhead/Ireland
Crowley, Renshaw & Steele-Manchester
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Kay-Bury
Mooney & Richmond-Dublin
Price & Sparks-Liverpool
Pritchard-Stockport/Manchester/Leeds
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Sweeney-Salford/Chester
White-Manchester/Notts/Dublin
Ziegler-Staff
Luzzu
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Posts: 510
Re: Manchester Catholic Parish Church - 1848
« Reply #18 on: Friday 02 October 09 16:31 UTC (UK) »
Gosh - now it gets really complicated  Undecided.

Another question - if a marriage is "Registrar Attended" what does this mean exactly - is it an indication of a Catholic marriage?

Presumably if ALL marriages were "Registrar Attended" it wouldn't be necessary to state this on the record.

Huh

Luzzu
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Buck, Staffs & Hants; Crummett, Norfolk & Burnley; Osborne, Cornwall & Burnley; Haigh/Hague, Manchester & Todmorden; Grant, Manchester & Ireland; France, Manchester & Yorkshire; Shackleton, Burnley, Yorkshire & Australia;
jds1949
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: Manchester Catholic Parish Church - 1848
« Reply #19 on: Friday 02 October 09 16:45 UTC (UK) »
"Registrar Attended" can mean a Catholic marriage - or indeed any marriage other than an Anglican one. Only C of E clergy were legally empowered to register marriages - all other denominations had to have a civil registrar present. That remained the case until relatively recently.

jds1949
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Luzzu
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Re: Manchester Catholic Parish Church - 1848
« Reply #20 on: Friday 02 October 09 17:36 UTC (UK) »
Apparently if a marriage certificate says "Married in the Catholic Church of St ?" without saying "According to the Rites and Ceremonies etc.," this means that when the couple arrived to get married, something unexpected had happened to the Priest, i.e., he was ill or indisposed or stuck in bad weather and was unable to conduct the ceremony.

The Registrar who would be in attendance would conduct the marriage and do all the legal bits and pieces but without the Priest the marriage could not be done by "According to the Rites and Ceremonies etc.,"  Then another official of the church would conduct the hymns, prayers.

Luzzu
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Buck, Staffs & Hants; Crummett, Norfolk & Burnley; Osborne, Cornwall & Burnley; Haigh/Hague, Manchester & Todmorden; Grant, Manchester & Ireland; France, Manchester & Yorkshire; Shackleton, Burnley, Yorkshire & Australia;
Toronto
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Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: Manchester Catholic Parish Church - 1848
« Reply #21 on: Monday 05 October 09 23:48 UTC (UK) »
St Augustine's church was in use at that time frame. Read the following, I found this in a site that was about St Augustine's. My catholic GGgrandparents were married in this church. It was near London Road (Piccadilly railway station) in Granby Row.

Mike Morris
Toronto Canada
St. Augustine’s Parish (founded 1820) is one of the oldest in Manchester, only St. Chad’s, Cheetham Hill (1773) and St. Mary’s in Mulberry Street (1794) are older and all three were founded by the same tireless priest, Fr. Rowland Broomhead.

The first St. Augustine’s Church was built in 1820 on Granby Row, near the present day Manchester Piccadilly Train Station. At the time there were only 500 Catholics in the Manchester District, which included Bolton, Rochdale, Stockport, Glossop and Macclesfield. This first Church was sold and demolished in 1905 to make way for the Manchester Technical College which in turn became UMIST (University of Manchester Institute of Science and Technology). In 2004 UMIST merged with the Victoria University of Manchester to establish the University of Manchester.
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PARSONAGE.
BOWLER
MATTLEY
WESTERMAN
SPENCER
MORRIS
FITZMORRIS
SMITH
WELLS
BROADY.,,,,,, Manchester and Cheshire
SENIOR,,,,,,,,,Cheshire
SPROSTON....Cheshire
HUNT,,,,,,,,,,,,,Cheshire
THORNBER,,,,,Preston and Lancashire
BREAKELL,,,,,,Preston and Lancashire
ATKIN,,,,,,,,,,,,Cheshire and Manchester
ASHTON,,,,,,,,,Cheshire and Manchester
DANIEL,,,,,,,,,,Cheshire and Manchester
JUDGE,,,,,,,,,,, Manchester and Ireland
TIDSWELL,,,,, Manchester
DUFFY ,,,,,,,,,, Manchester and Sligo I
emmsthheight
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Posts: 1892


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


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Re: Manchester Catholic Parish Church - 1848
« Reply #22 on: Tuesday 06 October 09 17:29 UTC (UK) »
Hi Toromto

Thank you for the article.  I've used all three registers and knew they were old, but not that they were the earliest three.  The part that's especially interesting to me is the comment about the wider picture in the area.  I have family in Heywood and Rochdale as well, and Some werew married in Manchester and have early children before the Hetwood records started.  Maybe I should be looking in the Manchester registers!

Thank you again.

Emms
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