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Topic: Searching for origins of: MCNALLY, Catharine Christiana (Read 3253 times)
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WiggyHobbes08
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 342
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Old Thread Please help? RANSOM Thomas 1820: MCNALLY Catharine; AMOS T: STIEGLITZ
« on: Tuesday 26 May 09 00:32 BST (UK) » Reply with quote Modify message
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,383665.375.html
This thread links directly and follows on from RANSOM, Thomas: MCNALLY,Catharine Christian thread. here is a summary of what has gone before in our search for her.
So - looking for Catharine Christina McNally - common-law wife of Thomas Ransom - approx 1819-1829.
Suspected to be with John McNally in Sydney as mother of John born 1811
Assumed to arrive in VDL with John, as un-named wife, coming under contract with John Cummings 1816 - to PD.
1817-19?? Catharine is mother of Ann 'Ransom', fathered by Thomas Amos - no proof of this other than family history as per Leo Von Stieglitz - and we haven't found the time frame to back this up yet. (However you don't get this family story without some historic reason - you don't just 'make this up' specially when we have evidence of a Thomas Amos being in the colonies at the time.)
Catharine is presumed to have left John in about 1818. He seems to disappear from VDL, but John Jnr shows up in Sydney 1822 muster with another woman Ann Clemens. (Has John gone off sealing again - he is listed somewhere as seaman.)
1st definite appearance in 1819 as un-named 'wife' - no children in evidence at this muster.
2nd definite record - birth record for Thomas McNally 1820 - Catharine listed as unmarried.
3rd definite record - Mrs Ransom donating to the Wesleyan mission 1823.
1825 per papers - Thomas and Catharine move to Green Ponds due to 'not being married'!
4th recorded as being at Green Ponds - Royal Oak Inn during court case - 1829 - refers to her presence in 1828.
Recorded as beneficiary and executrix of Thomas's Will 1829
5th Marriage to Frederick Stieglitz Feb 1830 hereafter known as Christina.
6th in paper receiving probate for Thomas's property - Nov 1829
1837 Present in Martin Cash's book as being chatelaine of Killymoon
7th named as sending exhibits to London and Paris Exhibitions 1850s.
8th named in paper at her death - (Christina Stieglitz). On grave stone and in another paper as Catharine Stieglitz. Aug 1857
As previously commented:
Lack of paper trail suggests she was a free woman.
Lack of evidence of McNally marriage suggests she was common-law wife of John McNally - but, she and John both named as McNally in birth of John McNally junior - so does that make her a McNally by birth? - probably not on this evidence.
Odd though that she signs that she is McNally, unmarried, at Thomas's birth in 1820 - (or is that just to show that the child is not John McNally's.)
Catharine does not appear in 1822 muster and we can't see evidence of children at this time either - yet! In fact Catharine seems to be very good at 'flying under the radar' - so she is giving us some trouble.
Any help is valued
Cheers, Wiggy
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« Last Edit: Monday 12 October 09 04:42 UTC (UK) by krisesjoint »
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Gaunt, Ransom, McNally, Stanfield, Kimberley. (Tasmania Australia)
Brown, Johnstone, Cumming, Cunningham, Crawford, Jack (Dumfriesshire, Lanarkshire, Scotland)
Percy, Dunning, (Devon, England)
Convicts of First/Second Fleet.
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WiggyHobbes08
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 342
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello Alison,
Sorry but wrong Ransom, I think. Our interest is in Tasmania in 1814-1829. As far as we know Thomas had no other relatives in Australia - he arrived as a convict in 1791. There was only one son and he was born in Tasmania and died there.
Good luck with your search.
Wiggy
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Gaunt, Ransom, McNally, Stanfield, Kimberley. (Tasmania Australia)
Brown, Johnstone, Cumming, Cunningham, Crawford, Jack (Dumfriesshire, Lanarkshire, Scotland)
Percy, Dunning, (Devon, England)
Convicts of First/Second Fleet.
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Just Moi
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1645
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Hi Alison,
On this link http://www.nla.gov.au/ferg/ you will find digitised newspapers including ones for NSW from 1840-1845... I found newspaper cuttings for several of my NSW forebears 1840's marriages by finding the newspaper editions for the weeks around the dates on their various certificates, and you have the date of that 1841 marriage. I hope that's a good starting point for a search through the newspapers  ... I found all sorts of bits and pieces about the weather, the wages, the accomodation available etc... and of course the marriage announcement, which included the names of the parents of the bride.....
Also, I think that in 1841 that "MF" church was perhaps a temporary building, on land donated by the Terry family... I think Christ Church St Lawrence was not completed until around 1845... my G G Gran married there in 1845...
There's lots of good NSW resources on this RChat thread too... http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,369703.0.html
Hope this helps....
Cheers, JM
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WiggyHobbes08
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 342
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Also Alison,
Been thinking - there was another Thomas Ransom around at the same time as ours - he was much younger and was in NSW - he appears in Index of Colonial Secretary's papers with one entry -leasing an Inn on the Hawkesbury I think - don't know if that helps but it may give you a link.
Wiggy
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Gaunt, Ransom, McNally, Stanfield, Kimberley. (Tasmania Australia)
Brown, Johnstone, Cumming, Cunningham, Crawford, Jack (Dumfriesshire, Lanarkshire, Scotland)
Percy, Dunning, (Devon, England)
Convicts of First/Second Fleet.
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Just Moi
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1645
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Hi all
Some bits and pieces of the jigsaw puzzle...
Remember Adam AMOS, District Constable at Great Swan Port ... well apparently he had a Diary.... I have not found the Diary, but found the following mention of it "The Diary of District Constable Adam Amos shows the following information from a Muster Roll at October 19, 1823" at http://members.iinet.net.au/~perthdps/convicts/con387.htm The Diary - perhaps entered up daily for the Police Notes... would perhaps have information including names and events and dates .... perhaps hotel licence disputes, court appearances...
Also on the index at http://portal.archives.tas.gov.au/menu.aspx?search=2 Thomas RansomE listed as a passenger, and a Crown Servant to Mr KENT, on a voyage to PJ from Hobart departing 5 June 1819, on the "Hibernia"..
And to add to the collective knowledge of Catharine, Mrs Ransom :
http://newspapers.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/2184372?searchTerm=%22ransom%22
Sydney Gazette, 25 Aug 1825, Mrs Ransom, in VDL showing compassion for her short-term employee, a Mrs Jane Spencer.. former wife of a Francis Spencer of Black Horse, Sydney....
EDIT TO ADD, 1825 Mr and Mrs Ransom moved to Green Pond because someone dobbed that they were not married... Perhaps the dobber was in the know (so to write) from a base in Sydney... Jane Spencer returned to Sydney from PD early Aug 1825... her former husband won't take her back, but has set up with their children and her forner servant...  So umm, oh well, probably not advance the puzzle for Catharine..
Still searching 
JM
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WiggyHobbes08
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 342
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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JM - you are an addict!
Gotta go to a meeting - but will follow up soon!
Wiggy
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Gaunt, Ransom, McNally, Stanfield, Kimberley. (Tasmania Australia)
Brown, Johnstone, Cumming, Cunningham, Crawford, Jack (Dumfriesshire, Lanarkshire, Scotland)
Percy, Dunning, (Devon, England)
Convicts of First/Second Fleet.
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WiggyHobbes08
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 342
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Aussie Bob,
Thanks for your suggestion - yes I have looked at this possibility - now, do you have any way of getting her to Hobart? That would be FANTASTIC! Meanwhile, we can't make the connection so have put that date and person on the back burner. But the thought that Catharine is 'nee' McNally has occurred - specially as she gave herself as 'unmarried' on son Thomas's birth record.
Do you have any further knowledge of the Anne Ransom saga - we have a suggestion that Anne 'Ransom' was in fact a child of Thomas Amos and Catharine, and adopted by Thomas Ransom (and Catharine) - this knowledge came to us via Leo Von Stiegltiz from Tübingen, Germany, who put a post on the Killymoon Blog site. That is the closest we have come to finding Anne's origins and we were hoping to get to Catharine via Anne in that case. If you are married to a descendant it will be via Anne I believe - correct?
Anything you can do to further the cause would be gratefully received. How close have you got?
Wiggy
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Gaunt, Ransom, McNally, Stanfield, Kimberley. (Tasmania Australia)
Brown, Johnstone, Cumming, Cunningham, Crawford, Jack (Dumfriesshire, Lanarkshire, Scotland)
Percy, Dunning, (Devon, England)
Convicts of First/Second Fleet.
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rpoole
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 67
Mayfield House - Tasmania
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Sorry Wiggy,
I did research this some time ago, but only got to about where you are now, less the bit about Thomas Amos. (now that would have been a scandal back in those days if it was known).
As I said, I am only a distant relly, this by virtue of my great grandmother marrying Henry DUCKETT and her daughter Emma, my grandmother, married George POOLE, my grandfather, and Augustus STIEGLITZ, Ann's son, married Henry DUCKETT's sister Sarah, thus forming the distant link.
I will now keep an eye out for any clues of Catherine's journey but sorry I cant be of more help.
Regards, Aussie Bob
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WiggyHobbes08
RootsChat Senior
Posts: 342
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Bad luck Aussie Bob!
Oh well, can't be helped - but nice try wasn't it? That surely is a convoluted link!! But there you go - you just never know what might turn up.
Thanks for making contact and here's hoping an extra pair of eyes will find something!
JM,
What feast of untried newpapers you've put me on to! Keep me going for weeks! Might even take longer as I can't see how to put in the search name to limit the reading!
Cheers,
Wiggy
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Gaunt, Ransom, McNally, Stanfield, Kimberley. (Tasmania Australia)
Brown, Johnstone, Cumming, Cunningham, Crawford, Jack (Dumfriesshire, Lanarkshire, Scotland)
Percy, Dunning, (Devon, England)
Convicts of First/Second Fleet.
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Just Moi
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1645
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Bit More,
T S Amos died Nov 1819 in Sydney aged 42 'after short illness' ... his two orphaned sons returned to UK Feb 1820...
If there was a scandal or even just a dalliance with Catharine in VDL then it would be Jan-Apr 1819.... that would give possible birth for Catharine's child falling around the time of or just after any local Muster (mid spring) ... perhaps she was with her "Accoucher" delivering her baby 
Don't you love THAT fashionable word in that era for the MIDWIFE 
Edit to add baby girl named Ann, perhaps (this from Wiggy's list at the head of this thread)...
1817-19?? Catharine is mother of Ann 'Ransom', fathered by Thomas Amos - no proof of this other than family history as per Leo Von Stieglitz - and we haven't found the time frame to back this up yet. (However you don't get this family story without some historic reason - you don't just 'make this up' specially when we have evidence of a Thomas Amos being in the colonies at the time.)
JM
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rpoole
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 67
Mayfield House - Tasmania
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Hi again Wiggy,
Do you have any details on Thomas AMOS connecting him to the AMOS brothers, Adam and John, who settled on the East Coast from Scotland and who's offspring married a STIEGLITZ?
Aussie Bob
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