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Topic: Where's Catherine? (Read 371 times)
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Luzzu
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 548
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Hi
At long last I am dismantling my Grant brickwall piece by piece but my 3 x gt grandmother, Catherine Grant, disappears after 1873 and I can find no trace.
Can I appeal for help please?
The surname does vary but to summarise:-
Patrick and Catherine Grant were born in Ireland. They married in Manchester in 1848 (Gralton/Cox).
In 1861 they were living at 7 Larton Street, Chorlton on Medlock with their two sons, John and Michael. Recorded in the name of Grant.
In 1864 they were living at 23 York Street when their son, Thomas, was born. Registered in the name of Gralton.
In 1871, a widowed Catherine with sons, John, Michael and Thomas, were living at 25 York Street. Recorded in the name of Grant.
Husband Patrick died as a result of an accident in October 1870 and his death is registered in the name of Patrick Grantham. Youngest son, Thomas, died, aged 10, of typhoid fever in Chorlton Union Workhouse in 1873. Registered in the name of Thomas Grantham with his mother Catherine present at the death.
Oldest son John is missing from 1881 census but reappears in 1883 at his marriage to Mary Cannon and thereafter on the 1891, 1901 and 1911 census.
2nd son Michael also marries in 1883 to Margaret but appears on the 1881 census with his "wife" and babies lodging with the Maitland family and afterwards at Bradshaw Street and Gay street on the 1891, 1901 and 1911 census.
But where is Catherine? I cannot find her at all after the death of Thomas in 1873. I have trawled the BMD looking for a remarriage or a death without success.
My latest theory that she remarried in 1879 to Thomas Larkin and was living at Meadow Street in 1881, and then as a widow in Chorlton Union Workhouse in 1891 with her death in 1894 has just been blown out of the water with the arrival of a marriage certificate this morning that doesn't fit at all.
Any ideas would be more than welcome.
Luzzu
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« Last Edit: Thursday 15 October 09 22:14 UTC (UK) by Luzzu »
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Buck, Staffs & Hants; Crummett, Norfolk & Burnley; Osborne, Cornwall & Burnley; Haigh/Hague, Manchester & Todmorden; Grant, Manchester & Ireland; France, Manchester & Yorkshire; Shackleton, Burnley, Yorkshire & Australia;
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CatOne
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 5126
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You say John is missing in 1881? Have you seen the John Grant age 30 born Manchester Sargeant (80 Regiment) at Whittington Barracks, Staffordshire? RG11/2776 Folio 96 Page 7
Doesn't help with finding his mum unfortunately 
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Dunning/Downing, Osborn/e, Astley -Cheshire/Birmingham/Middlesex Fanthorpe/Hall/Driffill/Storm - Lincolnshire Bower/Woodward/Bingham/Pettinger/Shaw - Nottinghamshire Shaw, Marland - Lancashire Broph(e)y - Queens County, Ireland Richards - Neath Swansea Hunt/Fox - Lincs, Waterfield/Middleton - Staffs Hart/Harland/Askew/Scales - Yorkshire Brereton/Vickers - Cheshire Gleaves/Sandford/Hulse/Hulme - Wolstanton/Audley Staffs Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov |
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Luzzu
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 548
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Hi,
Thanks for your interest. Unfortunately John Grant at Whittington Barracks isn't mine. He married Fanny Locker in 1876 and died in Lichfield, Staffs in 1896.
Luzzu
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Buck, Staffs & Hants; Crummett, Norfolk & Burnley; Osborne, Cornwall & Burnley; Haigh/Hague, Manchester & Todmorden; Grant, Manchester & Ireland; France, Manchester & Yorkshire; Shackleton, Burnley, Yorkshire & Australia;
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BarbaraH
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1136
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Luzzu, about John the son (sorry! I was looking for Catherine but then saw this) - now that Ancestry have criminal registers, there's this, could it be him?
1877 convicted 27 February at Lancaster Assizes, held in Manchester:
John Grantham, for "uttering counterfeit silver coin knowing it to be counterfeit..." sentenced to 7 years in prison
Census 1881, John Grantham, born c. 1855 Manchester, Dyer, resident at Her Majestys Convict Prison Portland Dorset [RG11/2108 Folio 45 Page 36]
Slight problem in that 7 years takes him to 1884, so he would need early release to marry in '83... was that possible in those days 
Barbara
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Newton Heath/Failsworth: Greenwood, McGibbon, Fishwick, Berry LANCS: Holt, Greenwood, Greenhalgh, Ballard, Threlfall,Fishwick, Berry CHES/DERBYS: Holt, Goodwin, Grant, Vernon LANARK & regions: McGibbon, Bryson, Smith, Campbell YORKS/LINCS: Taylor, Stamford, Fishwick. Bartholomew Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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Luzzu
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 548
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Wow Barbara, that is interesting and it is something I haven't come across before.
Not sure how I can take it further and prove he is mine though.
Just had a look at his occupations and they vary from engraver, steel turner, general labourer and copper turner - dyer sounds like someone working in a textile mill .
And the early release . Well my John definitely got married 1 Sep 1883 in Manchester and something else I have just realised, he would have to have been around in 1881 as his first son, Thomas, was born 1st qtr 1882  .
Late last night, I did find a possible re-marriage on the Lancs BMD for Catherine and it is one I must have missed as I haven't noticed it before:-
Catherine Grant/David Webster
1874 Manchester Cathedral
CATH/201/63
and on Free BMD it is Sep 1874 Manchester 8d 356.
So I think I will try and find this couple on the census or death registrations for them to see if it is a goer before I order the certificate. Tonight's project  .
The real mystery to me is the name variations - I can understand how Gralton can become Grantham with Irish and Manchester dialects and lack of literacy but why does it become Grant. I found John and Michael's births registered under Gratten and Grattan which I think I could be Gralton misheard. There were also 7 other babies (all of whom died in infancy) some of whom were Gralton/Granthams but others were just registered as Grant. John and Michael both married as Grants and after that the Gralton/Grantham name disappeared forever.
Luzzu
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Buck, Staffs & Hants; Crummett, Norfolk & Burnley; Osborne, Cornwall & Burnley; Haigh/Hague, Manchester & Todmorden; Grant, Manchester & Ireland; France, Manchester & Yorkshire; Shackleton, Burnley, Yorkshire & Australia;
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Cancan
RootsChat Member
Posts: 137
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hi,
Would love too!!!! 
Fingers crossed
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Brogan, Kilgallon, Quinn,-- Co Mayo/Sligo, Burnley UK
Osborne,-Cornwall, -- Burnley Lancs
Pilkington, Harrison, Grant -- Burnley Lancs
Ebbs & Bolger -- Dublin Irl
McClendon -- Alabama USA
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BarbaraH
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1136
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John definitely got married 1 Sep 1883 in Manchester and something else I have just realised, he would have to have been around in 1881 as his first son, Thomas, was born 1st qtr 1882 .
Ha, that would be a tricky one to explain if he was in Dorset prison!
Hope something turns up on the marriage for you
Barbara
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Newton Heath/Failsworth: Greenwood, McGibbon, Fishwick, Berry LANCS: Holt, Greenwood, Greenhalgh, Ballard, Threlfall,Fishwick, Berry CHES/DERBYS: Holt, Goodwin, Grant, Vernon LANARK & regions: McGibbon, Bryson, Smith, Campbell YORKS/LINCS: Taylor, Stamford, Fishwick. Bartholomew Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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Luzzu
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 548
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Hi all,
Just to say thank you to Cancan for the 1874 Catherine Grant/David Webster Manchester Cathedral marriage look up. I really appreciate your help.
however,
 she is not my Catherine. The Catherine Grant who married in 1874 was a 28 year old spinster whose father was John Grant and I am looking for a widow in her early '40's whose father was Patrick Cox.
Well I am completely out of ideas now. All I can think is that she had a really sad end as there are several unknown female deaths registered in Chorlton at that time. Its horrible to think she died where no one knew who she was so her death and burial couldn't even be done in her name but I don't know where else to look.
Luzzu
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Buck, Staffs & Hants; Crummett, Norfolk & Burnley; Osborne, Cornwall & Burnley; Haigh/Hague, Manchester & Todmorden; Grant, Manchester & Ireland; France, Manchester & Yorkshire; Shackleton, Burnley, Yorkshire & Australia;
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BarbaraH
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1136
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Oh no, what a shame it wasn't the one.
I recalled a marriage for a Catherine Grant in Salford, last time we were doing this? Did anyone follow that one up?
1880 Catherine Grant m Alexander G Johnson, register office or registrar attended. on Lancs BMDs.
I looked for an Alexander Johnson with a Catherine in 1881, but couldn't see them - sort of fits in with the thread really!
Barbara
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Newton Heath/Failsworth: Greenwood, McGibbon, Fishwick, Berry LANCS: Holt, Greenwood, Greenhalgh, Ballard, Threlfall,Fishwick, Berry CHES/DERBYS: Holt, Goodwin, Grant, Vernon LANARK & regions: McGibbon, Bryson, Smith, Campbell YORKS/LINCS: Taylor, Stamford, Fishwick. Bartholomew Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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Luzzu
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 548
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Hi Barbara,
I had missed the 1880 Salford Catherine Grant/Alexander G Johnson marriage and will spend some time trying to find them in 1881 and 1891 and also for deaths in the FreeBMD.
Another lead - thank you.
Hi Holtfamilytree,
Now that is an idea and one I hadn't thought of, I suppose because they were poor.
I am not sure how I will go about finding out if she did but there must be someone on Rootschat who will know what to do.
However, I have had some good news today - certificates received today confirm that 4 possible children are definite children - so now I have 8 definite children plus confirmation that I have the right death certificate for Patrick. As he died in an accident away from home it didn't give his address but I did find the burial record which gives his address and that matches the address on one of the birth certificates. This was one complicated family - they changed their address more often than the number of surname variations but always within a few streets or even next door on two occasions. I am not sure if they kept getting evicted or were avoiding someone  .
This is one of my favourite lines in my family tree and something won't let me give up on them yet.
Luzzu
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Buck, Staffs & Hants; Crummett, Norfolk & Burnley; Osborne, Cornwall & Burnley; Haigh/Hague, Manchester & Todmorden; Grant, Manchester & Ireland; France, Manchester & Yorkshire; Shackleton, Burnley, Yorkshire & Australia;
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