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Author Topic: two sons same name one census  (Read 234 times)
luckydog
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Posts: 135


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
two sons same name one census
« on: Tuesday 27 October 09 17:30 UTC (UK) »
The 1901 census for Edinburgh has most of my Hooper ancestors all of whom I can identify except for one. The last one listed is Francis Thomas Hooper born about 1901 in Edinburgh, he is noted as the son of Francis Hooper and Margaret Hooper. However they already have a son called Francis also on the census return.He was born on the 4th June 1883 in Edinburgh. Margarets first husband had died on the 31st July 1882 so it is unlikely that he is the father of the elder son. There is also no birth record of Francis Thomas Hooper, neither can I find a death record. Anyone have any idea what is going on here.
Mike
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CaroleW
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Posts: 16814


Barney 1993-2005
Re: two sons same name one census
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 27 October 09 17:53 UTC (UK) »
Francis Hooper & Margaret only appear to have married in 1888 according to this submitted IGI entry

Francis Hooper   Birth:  1844   Halifax, Yorkshire  Death:  1911   
Father:  Francis Hooper    Mother:  Mary Small     
   
Spouse:  Margaret Bain  Marriage:  01 JUN 1888   St George Midlothian

Another submitted IGI entry which is clearly wrong re: mother

Francis Hooper   Birth:  1883  Midlothian  Death:  After 1934   

Father:  Francis Hooper    Mother:  Margaret Bain 

In 1881 Francis snr was a Private in the 79th Highlanders living in Perth

In 1871 he was an unmarried soldier in Aldershot England

1901 census includes Agnes Bell b 1880 Perth and Margaret Bell b 1882 Glasgow - both of whom are shown as the daughters of Francis & Margaret

Have you viewed the full 1901 image on Scotlands People to check whether either of the Bell's are shown as married as Francis Thomas aged 1month could possibly be a Bell
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CaroleW
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Posts: 16814


Barney 1993-2005
Re: two sons same name one census
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 27 October 09 18:21 UTC (UK) »
It may be as well if we had the full census entries upfront for comparison purposes - may help

1901 - all Hooper children b Edinburgh

Francis Hooper 57 b England (IGI shows Halifax Yorks)
Margaret   42 b Edinburgh
Francis 18
Edwin  16
William 14
Mercy 12
Janet   10
James   7
Agnes  6
Francis Thomas  1 month
Agnes Bell 21 daughter b Perth
Margaret Bell 19 daughter b Glasgow

1891 - all b Edinburgh unless shown otherwise

Francis Hooper 47 b Halifax Yorks
Margaret   32 b Linlithgow
Margaret   10 b Perth (Agnes Bell was b 1880/1881 Perth)
Francis 8
Edwin  6
William  4
Mercy 2

In 1881 Margaret Bain was married to husband Thomas - no children

Should the submitted marriage entry be 1883 and not 1888???
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Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
CaroleW
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Posts: 16814


Barney 1993-2005
Re: two sons same name one census
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 27 October 09 18:28 UTC (UK) »
Whoever is submitting these IGI entries is way off track - 1901 shows Margaret b Glasgow and Agnes b Perth

Margaret Helen Bell   Birth:  1881 Perth Scotland
 
Father:  THOMAS Bell    Mother:  MARGARET BAIN 
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luckydog
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Posts: 135


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: two sons same name one census
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 27 October 09 18:55 UTC (UK) »
Margarets first husband Thomas Bell was a soldier based in barracks as far apart as Glasgow, Perth and Inverness hence the wide range of birth places for his daughters. Margaret had several children to Francis Hooper before they were married . He was a soldier in the same regiment as Thomas Bell and there is a strong possibility that they "met" while she was still married to Thomas. I think the suggestion that Francis Thomas Hooper is a son of one Thomas Bells daughters is a strong possibility.
According to my mother, consulted since my first post, my great-grand mother took several family strays into her own family.
Mike
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luckydog
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Posts: 135


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: two sons same name one census completed
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 27 October 09 19:10 UTC (UK) »
Hi Carole , I have just followed up your suggestion and found a birth record for Frank Thomas Bell , illigitimate , mother Agnes Jane Bell , 5 Prospect Terrace , Edinburgh . The witness is my g-grandmother who was a midwife and probably delivered her own grandson. The corrected entry gives Franks father as Charles Reid , barman.
Why is the blindingly obvious the last thing we think of checking ?
My g-grandmothers children were a fairly wild bunch and there illigitimate offspring have been causing me no end of trouble.
Thanks for your help.
Mike
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CaroleW
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Posts: 16814


Barney 1993-2005
Re: two sons same name one census
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 27 October 09 19:24 UTC (UK) »
Hi

Glad it solved the mystery
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