Welcome, Guest. Please login or register for free.
Did you miss your activation email?
Thursday 26 November 09 05:01 UTC (UK)
Welcome Home Help Surnames Library Shop Search Login Register

+  RootsChat.Com
|-+  Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering
| |-+  Deciphering & Recognition Help
| | |-+  1911 Census
« previous next »
Pages: [1] Print
Author Topic: 1911 Census  (Read 297 times)
Janeada
RootsChat Extra
**
Posts: 68


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
1911 Census
« on: Sunday 01 November 09 20:34 UTC (UK) »
How would you interpret this child's age? I thought it would be 4 months and therefore he was born cNovember 1910 but I cannot find a birth registration to fit at all.  Undecided Undecided The census entry says he was born at Barrow-in-Furness.

Find My Past transcribers have interpreted the age as 4 years. Huh

Any comments/suggestions would be very welcome.

Janeada

* 1911_FISHER_cropped_image.jpg (35.9 KB, 1000x114 - viewed 158 times.)
Logged
CLARKE in Furness, Lancashire, Cumberland & Isle of Man, PARK in Furness, Lancashire, CHARNOCK in Furness, Lancashire, ASHBURNER in Furness, Lancashire, FISHER in Westmorland & Lancashire (& Yorkshire), HIRD in Westmorland & Lancashire, JACKSON in Cumberland, SIM in Cumberland, WING in Lincolnshire, COOK in Nottinghamshire
pjbuk007
RootsChat Veteran
*****
Posts: 579


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: 1911 Census
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 01 November 09 20:38 UTC (UK) »
4/12 means 4 months, well, that is how all doctors write it. 

Logged
BENNET(T); NRY- Brotton, CON
BURTON; NRY- Saltburn, Guisborough, Marske, Stokesley
Judge Newark Lincoln BURTON , USA
DALES; NRY- Brotton, LIN - Orby
DAVIES
GEORGE: GLA - Oystermouth & Penarth, CON
LINCOLN. Middlesbrough, NRY, Durham
PERRETT Gloucestershire
QUESTED London. Assisting with One-name Study.
TRASK; GLA - Cardiff, Barry etc, SOM - South Petherton
WESTED

Census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
toni*
RootsChat Marquessate
********
Posts: 8714
Re: 1911 Census
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 01 November 09 20:41 UTC (UK) »
i agree with you and say 4 months Smiley

added :

the 1911 census was taken in April so the child would have been born Dec 1910 Jan 1911 have you checked Q1 1911 for his birth reg ? also under male births i.e no forename ?
the parents had 42 days to register the birth to avoid a fine but i dont think that quite takes us to Q2 1911
Logged
Spinal Muscular Atrophy -SMA is a neuromuscular condition causing weakness of the muscles.
SMA is the biggest genetic killer of children under the age of 2 yrs
1 in 40 of you carry the gene that passes this conditon on
There is no current treatment
http://www.jtsma.org.uk/
http://www.petitiontocuresma.com/


NOTHING IS AS IT SEEMS

Holman & Vinton- Cornwall, Wojciechowskyj & Hussak- Bukowiec & Zahutyn, Bentley & Richards- Leicester, Taylor-Kent/Sussex  Punnett-Sussex,  Bear- Monkleigh
Redroger
RootsChat Aristocrat
******
Posts: 2221


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: 1911 Census
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 01 November 09 20:49 UTC (UK) »
Yes has to be 4 months to make sense. Toni suggest that is how the doctors write it. Have you seen the original record? Or do you know whether the resident was a doctor in in anyway connected to the medical profession?
Logged
Ayres Brignell Cornwell Harvey Shipp  Stimpson Stubbings (all Cambs) Baumber Baxter Burton Ethards Stanton (all Lincs) Luffman (all counties)
Janeada
RootsChat Extra
**
Posts: 68


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: 1911 Census
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 01 November 09 21:03 UTC (UK) »
This is part of the original document cut down because of copyright reasons. It was written by the child's father who was an ordinary working man. He had been a soldier for most of his working life but came out of the army a year or so after he married and was at the time of the 1911 census working in the shipyard as a redlead painter.

I have looked over a year either side of the last two quarters of 1910 and found nothing that fits but I didn't look for an unnamed child so maybe he is there but I didn't see him.

The thing that puzzles me is that no-one has ever mentioned another son - only Thomas Herbert the eldest child and three daughters Huh Huh So I used FreeBMD to run a quick check on the deaths but found nothing again.

Janeada
Logged
CLARKE in Furness, Lancashire, Cumberland & Isle of Man, PARK in Furness, Lancashire, CHARNOCK in Furness, Lancashire, ASHBURNER in Furness, Lancashire, FISHER in Westmorland & Lancashire (& Yorkshire), HIRD in Westmorland & Lancashire, JACKSON in Cumberland, SIM in Cumberland, WING in Lincolnshire, COOK in Nottinghamshire
mosiefish
RootsChat Aristocrat
******
Posts: 2806


John Knowles 1896 to 1917
Re: 1911 Census
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 01 November 09 23:29 UTC (UK) »
Hi,

Did Lucy state in the 1911 that she had a child deceased?   Sometimes they got confused and included a dead child in the return.  It just looks to me like James has been 'added' to the list with a slightly different hand. 

Thought I would mention it.

Regards,
Mo 
Logged
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Lancs: Harrison, Entwistle, Devine, Grundy, Ashworth, Freeman, Jackson, Rushton
Cornwall: Rich, Binney, Peake
Devon: Walters
Janeada
RootsChat Extra
**
Posts: 68


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: 1911 Census
« Reply #6 on: Monday 02 November 09 08:05 UTC (UK) »
Hi Mosiefish,

In 1911 Lucy states that she has three children alive and three were born to her. The "child died" column has a line through it but that doesn't mean that James grew up if he died it would be after the 1911 census.

There were two daughters born later, one towards the end of 1911 the other in 1913. I've been in contact with several people researching this particular part of the family, some of them with a much closer connection than I have, and no-one has ever mentioned James so I just wondered if he had died as a child.

Janeada
Logged
CLARKE in Furness, Lancashire, Cumberland & Isle of Man, PARK in Furness, Lancashire, CHARNOCK in Furness, Lancashire, ASHBURNER in Furness, Lancashire, FISHER in Westmorland & Lancashire (& Yorkshire), HIRD in Westmorland & Lancashire, JACKSON in Cumberland, SIM in Cumberland, WING in Lincolnshire, COOK in Nottinghamshire
toni*
RootsChat Marquessate
********
Posts: 8714
Re: 1911 Census
« Reply #7 on: Monday 02 November 09 09:10 UTC (UK) »
i checked Barrow in Furness FreeBMD and you are right no Fisher on there to match  Undecided 
i also checked Barrow Upon Soar in case it was indexed incorrectly but no hes not there
of course Births should be registered where they took place and while the census states Barrow In furness is there anything to make you believ she could have been elsewhere ??
If young James died as an infant he may not have commonly been talked about and if the girls were younger they may not have known

these are the only male fisher births in Q4 1910 - Q1 1911
Births Mar 1911   
Fisher  Male    Bodmin  5c 57   
Fisher  Male     Warrington  8c 205

and it looks as if both those youngsters died

Deaths Mar 1911 
Fisher  Male  age 0  Bodmin  5c 57   
Fisher  Male  age 0  Warrington  8c 132

finally

there is one more death
Deaths Jun 1911 
Fisher  Male  age 0  Patrington  9d 183

 Undecided

i was also wondering if the child was stillborn, he wouldnt show on the registers but the mother may still have named him though why he was shown as 4 months old im not sure, if she had him 4 months ago then that would tie in and match with what Mo says
Quote from: mosiefish on Sunday 01 November 09 23:29 UTC (UK)
Hi,

Did Lucy state in the 1911 that she had a child deceased? Sometimes they got confused and included a dead child in the return. It just looks to me like James has been 'added' to the list with a slightly different hand.

Thought I would mention it.

Regards,
Mo

Logged
Spinal Muscular Atrophy -SMA is a neuromuscular condition causing weakness of the muscles.
SMA is the biggest genetic killer of children under the age of 2 yrs
1 in 40 of you carry the gene that passes this conditon on
There is no current treatment
http://www.jtsma.org.uk/
http://www.petitiontocuresma.com/


NOTHING IS AS IT SEEMS

Holman & Vinton- Cornwall, Wojciechowskyj & Hussak- Bukowiec & Zahutyn, Bentley & Richards- Leicester, Taylor-Kent/Sussex  Punnett-Sussex,  Bear- Monkleigh
Nick29
RootsChat Aristocrat
******
Posts: 2875
Re: 1911 Census
« Reply #8 on: Monday 02 November 09 09:43 UTC (UK) »
Quote from: mosiefish on Sunday 01 November 09 23:29 UTC (UK)
Hi,

Did Lucy state in the 1911 that she had a child deceased?   Sometimes they got confused and included a dead child in the return.  It just looks to me like James has been 'added' to the list with a slightly different hand. 

Thought I would mention it.

Regards,
Mo 


Another reason for the different handwriting is that they were unsure of how to write the child's age in the return, and waited for the form to be picked up, when they asked for advice.  Or maybe that the head of the household started to fill in the form, and the wife finished filling it in ?
Logged
Best Wishes, Nick.

Research interests:
Field - Luton & Islington
Hole - Somerset, Suffolk & Surrey
Farnish, Parker, Cattermole, Last, Wasp, Church - Suffolk
Lewin/Lowin/Lowen - Hertfordhire
Martin - Eltham & Greenwich, Kent (London)
Stead - Greenwich, London (Kent) & Maidstone
Wood - Hertfordshire

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Janeada
RootsChat Extra
**
Posts: 68


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: 1911 Census
« Reply #9 on: Monday 02 November 09 10:48 UTC (UK) »
I don't think it is different handwriting for James' entry. Maybe the ages are in a different hand but not the names. I've done another crop from the image showing the surname for everyone in the household so that you can judge for yourself.

Janeada

* 1911_-_FISHER_cropped_image.jpg (21.87 KB, 252x280 - viewed 90 times.)
Logged
CLARKE in Furness, Lancashire, Cumberland & Isle of Man, PARK in Furness, Lancashire, CHARNOCK in Furness, Lancashire, ASHBURNER in Furness, Lancashire, FISHER in Westmorland & Lancashire (& Yorkshire), HIRD in Westmorland & Lancashire, JACKSON in Cumberland, SIM in Cumberland, WING in Lincolnshire, COOK in Nottinghamshire
Nick29
RootsChat Aristocrat
******
Posts: 2875
Re: 1911 Census
« Reply #10 on: Monday 02 November 09 13:48 UTC (UK) »
Well, I'm no expert, but I wouldn't like to bet that the last entry is in the same hand, but it could be the same hand, but written more hurriedly  Smiley
Logged
Best Wishes, Nick.

Research interests:
Field - Luton & Islington
Hole - Somerset, Suffolk & Surrey
Farnish, Parker, Cattermole, Last, Wasp, Church - Suffolk
Lewin/Lowin/Lowen - Hertfordhire
Martin - Eltham & Greenwich, Kent (London)
Stead - Greenwich, London (Kent) & Maidstone
Wood - Hertfordshire

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
carol8353
RootsChat Marquessate
********
Posts: 5811


My two gorgeous grandsons
Re: 1911 Census
« Reply #11 on: Monday 02 November 09 15:18 UTC (UK) »
That last r is just the same- but the pen seems thinner to me?
Logged
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Rogers, Rapkin, Phillips - Hammersmith/Fulham/Paddington areas
Worth Bailey, Heapy, Burgess. All Macclesfield Cheshire
Mockridge,West Monkton Somerset
Jenner,Clapham Surrey
Kendrick,Liverpool
Wensley,Somerset

Coleman and Mc Namara from Ennis, Co Clare, Ireland
Blake and Maloney from  Kilbaha Co Clare, Ireland
Redroger
RootsChat Aristocrat
******
Posts: 2221


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
Re: 1911 Census
« Reply #12 on: Monday 02 November 09 20:28 UTC (UK) »
Same hand, in my opinion, but different pen, and written hurriedly. I have a case of who I think is a relative found on the deaths register of Doncaster Infirmary in 1890, neither the birth nor death ever registered that I can find, so it appears that there were frequent errors made.
Logged
Ayres Brignell Cornwell Harvey Shipp  Stimpson Stubbings (all Cambs) Baumber Baxter Burton Ethards Stanton (all Lincs) Luffman (all counties)
Pages: [1] Print 
« previous next »


[Copyright] [Shrink Link] [About Us] [Terms of Use]
All Census Lookups are Crown Copyright, National Archives for academic and non-commercial research purposes only
RootsChat.com cannot be held responsible directly or indirectly for the messages or content posted by others. Inline images in messages are the copyright of the respective linked sites.
RootsChat.com, Europa House, Bury, Lancashire, BL9 5BT

In loving memory of Eric George Davies, 1934-2009, the father of RootsChat.com































Powered by SMF 1.0.7 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC
0.05:19