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Topic: Ernest WATSON- reason for name change? (Read 571 times)
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sunshine18
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 57
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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This gentleman named Ernest WATSON marries my great grandma Hilda COOPER in 1927. Imagine my suprise when I look up the electoral roll and find out he is not Ernest WATSON at all but listed as George Joseph Nesbit WATSON, or just Joseph WATSON in the 1930 electoral roll. Can anyone think of why he would have gone from one name to the other?
No wonder I was having trouble finding Ernest WATSON, when he does not exist.
Can anyone find George Joseph Nesbit WATSON on the Victoria index? he was meant to have been born 1887 BEECHWORTH Parents George and Muriel Victoria.
Imagine my greater suprise when I find this gentleman dies in 1966 in GLOUCESTER but my great grandmother remarries again in 1940, pretending shes a spinster to William Hovey SPOONER.
Ive got the certificate proving she was married to Mr Watson before this marriage.
What do you guys think, do I have a reason to suspect bigamy?
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« Last Edit: Tuesday 03 November 09 05:03 UTC (UK) by krisesjoint »
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tropicalj
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 9076
Mason and Callum
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Just to confuse matters
there is a WW2 record for George Joseph Nesbit WATSON born 28/11/1909 at Gloucester NSW with Nok George Watson.
He would be old enough to show on the 1930 Roll
Is he a son and Ernest has long gone I wonder?
Jenn
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When you search for ancestors, you find great friends! I live in Townsville, Australia researching TOWNSEND,PINNEGAR, STRANGE, PULLEN, GRIFFIN from Wiltshire,, SHOEBRIDGE, VINALL, BRINDLE, Kent BAYLEY, Dorset,Yorkshire, HAIR, Durham, CUMMINS, BROWNLESS from Yorkshire, EDSALL, Cornwall, MORGAN, HENNESSY, BAKER, Ireland. In Australia Hennessy, Hair, Bayley, Townsend, Shoebridge, Edsall, Adamson, All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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regross
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 964
paper doll fashionista
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Sunshine,
I have looked at the Victorian fiches in detail, without success. Not even a birth to a Muriel Victoria that would fit.
I looked for both Nesbit(t) Watson singley and as a hyphenated name.
What information is on the 1966 death certificate?
Is the birth information from the marriage or the death certificate?
I could not find one that seemed to match your information in the NSW fiche. I did find the marriage you referred to.
regards
Robyn
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Abbott, Barnard, Clarke, Inward, Lanfear, Rutter,Spencer: Middlesex;
Greenaway:Cornwall;
Edney, Godwin/Goodwin, Gullett, Hampshire;
Gullett: Devon:
Emms:39th Regiment of Foot 1810-1832
Gordon, Scotland;
Arnold, Morton: Ireland;
Davies:Wales;
Olcorn:Cumberland;
Osborne: Staffordshire;
Harrington: Kent
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sparrett
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 4580
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Hi
Is this the death of George Joseph Nesbit WATSON.
In 1968 WATSON , GEORGE JOSEPH N. father GEORGE mother MURIEL VICTORIA in GLOUCESTER reg,25433
Sue
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Parrett:Woolwich,Newington,Bermondsey,Plumstead,Middlesex, West Ham. Evans: Bermondsey. Mason: Stepney, Sydney {Aust} Disney:West Ham. Cornish: Hull {UK} to Tasmania {Aust.} to Victoria {Aust} Catchpole: Sweeting: Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk |
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cando
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 6360
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Information removed due to copyright violation. See http://www.rootschat.com/forum/copyright.php for more details
RootsChat must deal with any breach of copyright by its members.
For some time the team of Copyright Editors has been removing breaches of copyright and sending detailed personal messages to the member that had posted the information. Due to the volume of posts and members this is now impractical. Messages in breach will simply be deleted and this notice posted. We apologise for any inconvenience caused but are sure you will appreciate the importance of this issue.
Cando
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« Last Edit: Tuesday 03 November 09 11:59 UTC (UK) by Copyright_editor. »
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regross
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 964
paper doll fashionista
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Sparrett,
thanks 1968 not 1966 as in the thread.
Possbily the 1909 man with the WW2 service history and if so too young (16) to be marrying in 1927., unless the age on the death certificate is way out he couldn't have been born in 1887!!
He could as Jen mentioned be Ernest's son, the est dob's allow for this but this would mean he had been married before his marriage to Hilda in 1927.
It would be worth trying to look at the 1909 birth in the NSW fiche and see who the parents were.
Cando's information from the cemetery would support George and Muriel as his parents.
I think that there are two individuals Ernest who married Hilda and George J. N as above.
There are these Victorian births:
1885 Ernest; parents John Ralf and Sarah & there are 4 George Watsons
1886 Ernest Edwin; parents Ernest Edwin and Jane & there are 7 George Watsons
1887 James Ernest; parents were James and Mary Ann & there are 2 George Watsons
1888 Thomas Ernest; parents Thomas and Catherine & there is 1 George Watson
1889 Ernest McGregor; parents Robert Ried and Janet & there are 5 George Watsons
1890 none and there are 3 George Watsons
1891 there are 5 one of whom was born in Wodonga which is near Beechworth, however this Ernest served in WW1, and with his wife moved to WA and there is correspondence between him and the forces upto 1947,so I think we can rule him out. There are 3 George Watsons
To narrow it down we would need to know what information was gven on teh 1927 marriage certificate as there asre also 3 NSW deaths between 1927 and 1940 for Ernest Watsons.
There may well have been a divorce also so that would need to be checked before assuming a bigamous seecond marriage. Hilda may well not have wanted to admit she was divorced on her remarriage.
Robyn
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Abbott, Barnard, Clarke, Inward, Lanfear, Rutter,Spencer: Middlesex;
Greenaway:Cornwall;
Edney, Godwin/Goodwin, Gullett, Hampshire;
Gullett: Devon:
Emms:39th Regiment of Foot 1810-1832
Gordon, Scotland;
Arnold, Morton: Ireland;
Davies:Wales;
Olcorn:Cumberland;
Osborne: Staffordshire;
Harrington: Kent
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cando
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 6360
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There is this birth in NSW
26797/1906
WATSON Roy J
Father George Mother Muriel V
District Newtown
so doubt very much if a couple of the same names were having children in Beechworth in Victoria in 1887 
Their marriage
0138/1905
WATSON George
GAFFEY Muriel V
District Newtown
Hold old you was your g grandmother when she married in 1927 as George would have only been 18 years of age?
Marriage
6229/1927
WATSON Ernest
COOPER Hilda
District Wickham
Is this her birth?
34014/1906
COOPER Hilda D
Father William E Mother Janet E
District Dubbo
Perhaps you could scan and post here a portion of the marriage cert where it shows Ernest is b. 1887 and his parents' names.
Info on Divorce records in NSW
http://www.records.nsw.gov.au/state-archives/guides-and-finding-aids/archives-in-brief/archives-in-brief-77
Cando
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cando
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 6360
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Death
13541/1951
WATSON Muriel Victoria
Father Thomas Mother Ellen
District Gloucester
Information removed due to copyright violation. See http://www.rootschat.com/forum/copyright.php for more details
Cando
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« Last Edit: Tuesday 03 November 09 12:01 UTC (UK) by Copyright_editor. »
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cando
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 6360
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Australian Electoral Rolls
1930, 1933,1936,1937
WATSON George Upper Gloucester River, Barrington Selector
WATSON Muriel Victoria Royal Hotel, Gloucester Home duties
1930
WATSON Hilda Doris Burns Street, Redhead HD
She is the only WATSON enrolled at this address
George would not be 21 years old when the enrolments closed for the 1930 election. He was b. in November 1909. This is assuming we are researching the right man. Will check on the date in 1930.
1933, 1936,1937
WATSON George Joseph Nesbit, Gloucester Dairyman
WATSON Hilda Doris, Manchester, Barrington HD
Cando
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regross
RootsChat Veteran
Posts: 964
paper doll fashionista
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Hi,
Muriel Victoria Gaffey was born1881 in Hartley.
So I would say that Ernest and George J N Watson are two separate people.
Ernest may well be related to George Watson, husband of Muriel. So perhaps their marriage or his birth certificates may yield some information. It may of course just be a coincidence of names as Watson is quite common.
Robyn
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Logged
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Abbott, Barnard, Clarke, Inward, Lanfear, Rutter,Spencer: Middlesex;
Greenaway:Cornwall;
Edney, Godwin/Goodwin, Gullett, Hampshire;
Gullett: Devon:
Emms:39th Regiment of Foot 1810-1832
Gordon, Scotland;
Arnold, Morton: Ireland;
Davies:Wales;
Olcorn:Cumberland;
Osborne: Staffordshire;
Harrington: Kent
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cando
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 6360
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Mmmmm note the addresses for William Hovey SPOONER and Hilda Doris WATSON.
Australian Electoral Roll
1930
SPOONER William Hovey, Redhead Engineer
1933, 1936
SPOONER William Hovey, Manchester, Barrington Miner
I think Mr Spooner would have known Hilda was not a spinster when he married her in 1940.
The 1930 election was held 5th April so George b. Nov 1909 would not have been old enough to enrol.
Where did you find Joseph and Hilda Doris WATSON together on an election roll?
Cando
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sunshine18
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 57
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello firstly thanks everyone:) Yes Hilda was born 1906 Dubbo. You have all proved that I have the wrong WATSON. I was getting confused because I was looking for a WATSON in the same general area as she was presuming her and Ernest WATSON were still together.
I now think that Hilda was living with William Hovey SPOONER, her second husband alot sooner than I thought. and she is living with him throughout the 1930 electoral rolls.
But that still leaves trying to find the correct birth and death of my Ernest.
On the marriage certificate there is no mention of any divorce between the couple. Usually a divorce is listed isnt it, on the actual certificate?
Ernest WATSON is said to be a bachelor from Beechworth, Victoria born in 1887. He is listed as a labourer, his parents are listed as Henry WATSON, labourer, Deceased and May YOUNG deceased. The marriage took place on the 13th May 1927 at Tighes Hill.
I have not been able to find a death for an Ernest WATSON to these parents, or a birth in Victoria.
Thanks again for the help given so far:)
*Rachel
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cando
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 6360
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Death
17712/1941
SPOONER William Hovey
Father James
At Gloucester
Information removed due to copyright violation. See http://www.rootschat.com/forum/copyright.php for more details
Cando
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« Last Edit: Tuesday 03 November 09 12:02 UTC (UK) by Copyright_editor. »
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cando
RootsChat Marquessate
Posts: 6360
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Rachel I am puzzled as you said you have the marriage certificate of Hilda Doris COOPER to an Ernest WATSON son of George WATSON and Muriel Victoria.
Could you scan a portion of the cert with his name date of birth and parents' names or detail here all the information exactly as it is on the cert. ie if you would like more help.
Cheers
Cando
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sunshine18
RootsChat Extra
Posts: 57
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hi the information above is exactly what was on the marriage certificate, I thought perhaps if he had changed his name, he might have his parents too, lol thats where an overactive imagination gets you in geneology.
The above is an exact transcription from the marriage certificate itself, sorry for any confusion caused.
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