Author Topic: Boswells in South Wales  (Read 6386 times)

Offline centralscrutiniser

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Boswells in South Wales
« on: Friday 13 August 10 15:35 BST (UK) »
Hi All

I'd be very grateful if anyone has any suggestions for finding out more about some Boswell family members please?

The 1891 census shows three caravans, at New Road, Merthyr Tydfil. Frederick Boswell (b. c1840 in Cheshire) and his wife Charlotte (b.1838 Howe) lived in the first with their daughter Maria (b.1874, Wellington Shropshire).   The second caravan housed Lloyd Roberts (b.1856 in Bulith)  his wife Annie (b.1861 Neath) and his brother Lewis (b.1871). Frederick's other daughter Alice Maud (b.1868 in Dudley) lived in the third and final caravan on the street with her husband Henry Watts (b. 1861 Treorchy) and their children William, Annie and Richard. Their other daughter Charlotte lived in the first caravan with her grandparents.

I am keen to find anything I can about these people, especially who Frederick and Charlotte's parents might have been, and what Charlotte's maiden name was.

I'm also interested to know about their work - Frederick is listed as 'Hawker and Stall Keeper', his wife Charlotte as what appears to say 'fancy foods-keeper' with son in law Henry as a 'swinging boat keeper'. Even more intruigingly Lloyd and Lewis Roberts are both listed as 'showman'. Can anyone offer some advice on where I might find out about what they did, which circus/fair they might have been performing with, or exactly what a 'showman' might have done?

It seems likely that given that they were living in caravans and from the births of them and their children seemed to have travelled around, as well as the Boswell name, they might have been Romany. Can anyone suggest anywhere I might find out some more information about Romanies in Wales around this time?

Thanks for any help!

Offline rob g

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Re: Boswells in South Wales
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 14 August 10 15:43 BST (UK) »
hi, c.s. the name is a romany one for sure, i know some of the boswell family my self. they have done all types of  of work all over the uk, and would have been show men too. try  the (romany genes) site.and there is a site for show men but i cannot recall it, just type, family history showmen  and lots of sites will come up? as to the occupations. hawker is a seller of goods. stall holder is any kind of side show stall that could be easy to move around with games or goods to sell, and the food stalls are the same as you would get at any fair today by fancy it may be toffee apples sweets etc.all easy to make. the swings are the old type of rope pull swings that you still see, they would have travelled with lots of other familys. to fairs etc all over the country, there are lots of gypsy boswells in the uk. a very old romany name. i think you will find lot of info when you start looking ..good luck..rob..g
romany history, mitchell family history. Earthenware. general . And horse. I dealers/hawkers. market trading.  lancashire. cumbria. staffordshire.scotland. paternal, side. wilson. lee. burton. miller .burnside. Smith. varey. howard. Jones. Lowther. Evens. Ward. Dale.maternal, side. miller cumbria, stewert. mitchell. allan. Ireland. donaghue, Kelly. Murphy. Young. Plus many others. .

Offline centralscrutiniser

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Re: Boswells in South Wales
« Reply #2 on: Monday 16 August 10 12:22 BST (UK) »
Hi Rob, thanks for your reply.

I've had a look at a few sites, including the Romany Genes one which seems very good.

When I googled Frederick and his details a page came up romanyjib paint bucket, or something similar. It seems to show some details of the people I'm looking for but is a private membership forum for which you need an invitation. Is anyone a member of this site who might be able to check if there are any details on Frederick and family please?

Offline CatOne

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Re: Boswells in South Wales
« Reply #3 on: Monday 16 August 10 13:31 BST (UK) »
Hi,

I think its "fancy goods vendor" in 1891 census. Could this be the marriage -

Frederick Boswell June 1866 Dudley 6c 95
Brides - Charlotte Burns or Susannah Benton

Dunning/Downing, Osborn/e, Astley -Cheshire/Birmingham/Middlesex
Fanthorpe/Hall/Driffill/Storm - Lincolnshire
Bower/Woodward/Bingham/Pettinger/Shaw - Nottinghamshire
Shaw, Marland - Lancashire
Broph(e)y - Queens County, Ireland
Richards - Neath Swansea
Hunt/Fox - Lincs, Waterfield/Middleton - Staffs
Hart/Harland/Askew/Scales - Yorkshire
Brereton/Vickers - Cheshire
Gleaves/Sandford/Hulse/Hulme - Wolstanton/Audley Staffs
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov


Offline centralscrutiniser

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Re: Boswells in South Wales
« Reply #4 on: Monday 16 August 10 13:36 BST (UK) »
Hi catone, thanks. Fancy goods vendor sounds intruiging - any idea what constitutes fancy goods?

Is that wedding at St Thomas' Dudley? I found a reference to a Frederick Boswell marrying a Charlotte Burns in June 1866, and although somebody (coincidentally named Boswell!) has transcribed all the births, marriages and deaths for the church from about 1830 to 1890, the period 1860-68 is missing!

Apologies, I'm new to this, but where did you find the reference to the wedding and what does the 6c 95 code relate to please?

Thanks again

Offline CatOne

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Re: Boswells in South Wales
« Reply #5 on: Monday 16 August 10 14:15 BST (UK) »
The reference is what you need if you want to order the certificate, I found the marriage on freebmd.org.uk

I think "fancy goods" are trinkets/gifts etc like what people would buy from fetes/holiday places today

Couldn't find Frederick/Charlotte on earlier censuses before 1881 though  :-\

Regards
Cat  :)
Dunning/Downing, Osborn/e, Astley -Cheshire/Birmingham/Middlesex
Fanthorpe/Hall/Driffill/Storm - Lincolnshire
Bower/Woodward/Bingham/Pettinger/Shaw - Nottinghamshire
Shaw, Marland - Lancashire
Broph(e)y - Queens County, Ireland
Richards - Neath Swansea
Hunt/Fox - Lincs, Waterfield/Middleton - Staffs
Hart/Harland/Askew/Scales - Yorkshire
Brereton/Vickers - Cheshire
Gleaves/Sandford/Hulse/Hulme - Wolstanton/Audley Staffs
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov

Offline centralscrutiniser

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Re: Boswells in South Wales
« Reply #6 on: Monday 16 August 10 15:26 BST (UK) »
Thanks, I hadn't seen that site but it looks good.
Did you find them on the 1881 census then? We havent seen them before the 1891 census - if you did, do you have a reference?
Thanks!

Offline CatOne

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Re: Boswells in South Wales
« Reply #7 on: Monday 16 August 10 16:55 BST (UK) »
Sorry I took so long to get back to you, took daughter to the park, heres the reference for 1881, although Fredericks age is 80 (place of birth Burslem? Staffordshire) and Charlotte is 63 (place of birth Builth)  :-\

RG11/5317 Folio 91 Page 6
69 Brecon Road, Tydfilwell, Merthyr Tydfil, Glamorgan
Dunning/Downing, Osborn/e, Astley -Cheshire/Birmingham/Middlesex
Fanthorpe/Hall/Driffill/Storm - Lincolnshire
Bower/Woodward/Bingham/Pettinger/Shaw - Nottinghamshire
Shaw, Marland - Lancashire
Broph(e)y - Queens County, Ireland
Richards - Neath Swansea
Hunt/Fox - Lincs, Waterfield/Middleton - Staffs
Hart/Harland/Askew/Scales - Yorkshire
Brereton/Vickers - Cheshire
Gleaves/Sandford/Hulse/Hulme - Wolstanton/Audley Staffs
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov

Offline Redworth

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Re: Boswells in South Wales
« Reply #8 on: Monday 16 August 10 21:18 BST (UK) »
Hi Centralscutiniser

General tip to get to Romany sites, google "Romany or Romani or just Gypsy" there is a wealth of them all offering info of all types.   

Ray
Mortlock. Redworth. Tiday. Sutton. Boswell. Dighton. Chapman. Lee. Scamp. Smith. Rutherford. Andrews. McBride. Eaton. Gadney. Buckley. Nelson. Norley. Kirk. Gumble. Loverage. Hewett. Delonette. Barnet.