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Topic: NEEDHAMS - ASHOVER (Read 544 times)
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lesleyhannah
RootsChat Veteran
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Posts: 743
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My g-g-grandmother was Maria Needham who married William Stubley in 1839. The marriage was registered in Belper. She was living at Amber Mow. Her father, John Stubley was a stone mason. Maria and William were 'of full age'.
Although I have details of Maria's children, the only clues I have of her ancestors are from that marriage certificate. One of the witnesses is Isaac Needham, obviously a relative, but could be brother, uncle, nephew, etc.
On the LDS site I've found plenty of Needhams in the Ashover area, including a number of Isaacs, and some Needhams who were stone masons. My problem is which belong to my family, and working out how they fit together. I'm hoping someone reading this will have the family on their records, and can give me a push in the right direction.
Keeping my fingers crossed - any information will be useful, and gratefully received.
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spendlove
RootsChat Senior
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Posts: 393
I've not edited my PROFILE yet
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William Stubley, his father was John Stubley and Maria Needham, her father was Thomas Needham were married 3.4.1839 in Crich, Derbyshire. IGI batch number M049783. Crich would
have been in Belper Registration District.
There is a birth of a Maria Needham Bpt. 28.4.1816 Ashover IGI batch number C320714.
her parents are shown as Thomas & Hannah Needham.
The 1861 Census helps confirm some of the above as Sarah Ann, their daughter, is shown as
being born Crick this would have been Crich.
You need to ask for search 1841 Census Ashover, Derbyshire for a Thomas & Hannah Needham
they may have some of their children still living with them.
Amber Mow - is this a house? where is this info from?
Hope this helps.
Spendlove
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Bev Duckworth
RootsChat Extra
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Posts: 81
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I've looked at the 1841 census for Ashover can can find no Hannah and Thomas Needham together.
There is :
Stephen Needham , age 54, Mason
Mary, age 55
Isaac, age 30, Mason
Thomas, age 15, Mason
all born Derbyshire.
Also:
Robert Needham, age 30, Mason,
Charlotte, age 25
Mary 10
Margaret 8
Hannah 5
Also: Hannah Needham aged 25 (can't read her profession- looks like F.S. ? Farmer's Servant ?)
living with
William Allen, age 50, farmer
John age 26
Joseph age 24
Thomas age 21
Benjamin age 15
George, age 13
Charles, age 10
Jonah(?) 2
No other Thomas Needham or Isaac Needham in Ashover.
Hope this helps,
Bev
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Sharman - Derbyshire & Lancashire
Levitt - Lancashire, Middlesex, London, Yorkshire
Butler - Shorpshire/Flintshire
Wilkinson - Yorkshire
Benson - Lancashire
Cartmell - Lancashire
Gillett - Lancashire
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lesleyhannah
RootsChat Veteran
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Posts: 743
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Spendlove and Bev, Thanks for the information. All the definite info I had came from Maria's marriage certificate - now I've looked again, it probably says Amber row!
I looked up the IGI batch numbers - they give other Needhams, but not Thomas and Hannah's family. They do give Isaac's family - which brings me back to the problem - where does he fit in? Is he Maria's brother? Or her uncle?
Bev's information shows what I mean - more Needhams who are masons. I just feel they MUST be related some way, but apart from Maria's marriage I can't find any reference to Thomas and Hannah, so can't place any of her brothers and sisters.
Bev - thanks for looking up the 1841 census. I can't think where Thomas and Hannah disappeared - thomas was alive in 1839, though I suppose he could have died before 1841.
I'm very grateful to both of you - if I could just find Thomas and Hannah's family, you've given me plenty of facts to work on.
Lesley
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muttley
RootsChat Extra
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Posts: 2
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hello Lesleyhannah 
I've just discovered Needham roots & wonder if you've resolved your query since posting it?
I have a Thomas NEEDHAM married to Hannah CLAYTON in 1808, Ashover.
I had 4 of their children as Isaiah b. 1811 Wessington, Ralph b. 1814 Ashover, Charlotte b. 1815 Wessington & Thomas b. 1817.
Could it be that Maria was their sister if she was born 1816 Ashover?
If so, her father Thomas b. 1784 Ashover had a brother Isaac b. 1783 Ashover; this would make him Maria's uncle as you guessed!
I've got Isaac & Thomas's parents as Isaiah NEEDHAM & Mary BUXTON, married 1782 Ashover.
There do seem to be a few stone masons by the name NEEDHAM in that area.
Let me know if this helps, confirms or confuses? 
Muttley
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lesleyhannah
RootsChat Veteran
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Posts: 743
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Hello Muttley and welcome to Rootschat!
I have added to the branch, slightly, since I first posted, but am glad to get your message, because it's pushed me into looking again. I had also decided Maria's parents were Thomas (c1783) and Hannah Clayton, married 1808 in Buxton.
From the IGI I've found the following children for the couple: Isaiah (1810); Charlotte (1812); Ralph (1814); Maria (1816); Thomas (1817); Isaac (1820). These fit in with your findings.
Although I've found Hannah Clayton's parents - Thomas Clayton and Grace Foxloe, who married in Derbyshire in 1782, I hadn't found the parents of Thomas Needham. I do find your record that they are Isaiah Needham and Mary Buxton very interesting, especially as you found a brother Isaac b 1783. Did you find this information on the Latterday Saints site or are you able to access the original records locally? I would love to make it to Ashover - I suspect the local cemetery has a whole bunch of my ancestors in it!
Your research may mean that brother Isaac could be the husband of Sarah, who had at least 3 daughters (Hannah, Harriott and Elizabeth). Following these lines may well open up new roads in my tree, so I am VERY grateful.
I did notice on the IGI that there is a Harriet Needham, in the same batch as Thomas's children, who seemed to produce a large number of Needhams out of wedlock! I wonder if she was sister to Thomas and Isaac - the names to crop up over and again. Also, Stephen Needham, a mason, has several kids in the same batch. I wonder if he is another brother?
Are these your relatives too? My Maria married William Stubley, but her children had all the Needham family names.
Thanks again for your input. I hope we find a link between our families.
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muttley
RootsChat Extra
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Posts: 2
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Hi again & thanks for the welcome!
Maria's sister Charlotte NEEDHAM married William CARLIN, and the CARLIN line may lead down to my maternal grandmother. I say may, as my g-g-grandmother shows as an unmarried mother of 9 children, but with a 'lodger' around her age by the name Ralph CARLIN, and later one of her grandchildren was named Ralph presumably after him.
I'm a bit of a lazy genealogist & not au fait with every aspect of checking records, but have assumed that maybe the lodger was actually her partner & father to at least some of the children? I don't know how I would prove or disprove this - a clerk in Derbyshire Records Office couldn't find any Bastardy Papers for their parish (I didn't know such things existed)
So we may well have common ancestors! You mention you wish you were nearer Ashover to check locally. Are you in Britain or another country? (hope that's not too personal)
Stevie
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lesleyhannah
RootsChat Veteran
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Posts: 743
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Hi Stevie - just finished a PM to you, before reading this!
Which census did you find Charlotte and Ralph on? I believe Charlotte also had a brother Ralph. He was born between Charlotte and Maria. The IGI shows his christening as being 26 June 1814 in Ashover, parents Thomas Needham and Hannah. So the baby could have been called after him. Now you've given me some more information about Maria's siblings I'll see if I can find any of them in the censuses (girls tend to disappear if you don't know the name of their husbands).
It would be interesting if you could find Ralph Carlin on later censuses, to see if he found another family.
Plenty to think about here though.
Lesley
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