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Topic: Died in Craigs. Where could they be buried? (Read 329 times)
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Janice M
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 2446
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I really hope that someone can help me.
My gg-granparents John Elder & Margaret Stewart, died in Craigs.
John died April 1, 1898 and Margaret (Peggy) died May 29, 1904. They were Presbyterian. Their daughter Ann and her husband Henry Smyth were witnesses on the death certificates. According to the 1901 Census, Margaret was living with her daughter and son-in-law at #88, Craigs Townland, Craigs Parish.
As I live in Canada, and have never visited Northern Ireland, I am totally unsure of the distance between villages, or of the practice of the different burial grounds, concerning different religions.
We are having a difficult time, trying to find births, marriages, deaths and burials with regards to this line, because of the lack of records available.
Any help would be appreciated.
Janice
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Elder, Stewart, Johnston, Baskerville, Marks, Carson, Leitch, Bulloch, Thomson, Allen, Campbell, Gordon, Murray, Kelly, Chambers, Black, Cheyne, Youngson, Williamsdaughter, Anderson, Briggs, Pirie, Clark, Philp, Mannel, Lander, Rough, Lean, Bate, Lanxon, Brown, Oliver, Kitt, Shards, Bennet, Young, Petrie, Wylie, Herbertson, Martin, McAlister, Best, Ginn, Ross, McIntosh, McGillivray, Russell, Pettigrew, Fyfe, Barrie
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scotmum
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1296
Look back, look around, look forward!
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I suppose the possibility is one of the three Presbyterian churches in Ahoghill.
What ages were they at death and what age was their daughter at 1901 - to help work out their marriage and her birth, as you could then possibly get certificates from the local registrars office in Ballymena (i managed this for one of my lines in the Ballymena area). Also, what address was on John's death certificate - was it the Craigs one that his wife shared with her daughter/son-in-law at 1901 or was it elsewhere?
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STEWART, Lanarkshire, Scotland and Fermanagh/Monaghan border areas, Ireland
LILLEY, County Antrim, Ireland (now NI).
HENDERSON,Lanarkshire,Scotland and probably County Londonderry, Ireland (now NI).
CAPE Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
SCOTT Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
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Janice M
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 2446
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Thanks for replying.
The only information that we have on this family is that given to us by a researcher. We are not in possession of any certificates.
Details of Marriage:
7 April 1842 Marriage of John Elder of Gortrechy to Peggy Stuart of Killycuggan, witnesses James Ray and James Stuart.
Children of John Elder & Margaret Stewart:
John Elder b 1849 Ireland died Glasgow 10 feb 1916 both Parents deceased
(Birth year may be incorrect, could be 1845-49)
Robert Elder b 1850 Ireland died Glasgow 16 Mar 1902 father deceased
Isaac Elder b 1855 Ireland where abouts not known after June 1884
Joseph Elder b 1857 Ireland died Glasgow 2 Oct 1899 father deceased
Thomas Stewart Elder b 1859 Ireland died Glasgow 1 Jan 1939 both Parents deceased Occupation journeyman Potter/ Saggermaker
Anne Elder b 1862 died ?
Martha Elder b ? died ?
Details of Marriage:
19 July 1882 at Portglenone 1st Presbyterian Church
Henry Smith, full age, bachelor, labourer, residence Glasgow, father Robert Smith, farmer to Annie Elder, full age, spinster, residence Gortaheran, father John Elder, farmer Witnesses - William Stirling and Martha Elder
Death Details:
John Elder aged 80 yrs died on the 1st April 1898 at Craigs informant was Ann Smyth daughter.
1901 Census
Craigs parish, Craigs townland, ref MIC/354/1/31
Property Number 88
Henry Smyth, head of family, presbyterian, age 44, farm labourer, married, born co Antrim
Anne Smyth, wife, age 39, house woman, married, co Antrim
Margaret Elder, mother-in-law, 80, widow, co Antrim
Robert Smyth, son, 17, beetler, born Scotland
Sarah Smyth, daughter, 15, scholar, born co Antrim
Isaac Smyth, son, 14, beetler, co Antrim
Thomas Smyth, son, 11, scholar, co Antrim
Jeanie Smyth, daughter, 9, scholar, co Antrim
Susan Smyth, daughter, age 6 or 7 (one has been changed to the other but it is not clear which is correct), scholar, co Antrim
Nellie Smyth, daughter, 4, scholar, co Antrim
Stewart Smyth, son, 2, scholar, co Antrim
Death Details:
Margret Elder aged 71 yrs died on the 29th May 1904 at Craigs, labourers widow, informant was Henry Smith son in law.
(We have since found that the age given at death was incorrect. She was over age 80.)
All of the birthdates listed are calculated from marriage and/or census records. Unfortunately, no birth records have yet been found.
We are assuming that both John and Margaret died at the address given in the 1901 Census, but can't be sure, as no address was given on death details.
Janice
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Elder, Stewart, Johnston, Baskerville, Marks, Carson, Leitch, Bulloch, Thomson, Allen, Campbell, Gordon, Murray, Kelly, Chambers, Black, Cheyne, Youngson, Williamsdaughter, Anderson, Briggs, Pirie, Clark, Philp, Mannel, Lander, Rough, Lean, Bate, Lanxon, Brown, Oliver, Kitt, Shards, Bennet, Young, Petrie, Wylie, Herbertson, Martin, McAlister, Best, Ginn, Ross, McIntosh, McGillivray, Russell, Pettigrew, Fyfe, Barrie
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scotmum
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1296
Look back, look around, look forward!
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From what I gather, Craigs did formerly come under a combined Parish of Ahoghill which also included Portglenone, so this and the fact that Annie married at Portglenone 1st Presbyterian Church (have you seen http://www.portglenone.co.uk/1stportglenone2.htm which includes a link to a panoramic view of the interior of the church), could possibly indicate that their ties were more likely to have been with this Portglenone church rather than an Ahoghill one. There is certainly a burial ground at the church Annie and Henry married at, as I have visited it previously when researching one of my husband's lines, so perhaps that is where they will be. Did your researcher check any of the church records at PRONI?
Also, out of interest, both Smyth and Stewart surnames feature in the 1851 Census returns for Craigs Townland (one of those areas for which the Census actually survived - have you had a look at same?). Further, a Robert Smith is recorded in the Griffiths valuation for Craigs (possibly Henry's father), OS map references can be obtained from the valuations which can be compared to maps of that time and possibly help pin down a piece of land or indeed, property.
Although they cannot undertake actual detailed research on your behalf, the Area Local Studies Service at Demesne Avenue, Ballymena, County Antrim, Northern Ireland BT43 7BG (I can PM you their email address if you wish) may be able to give you some further help/advice as they hold a lot of records etc relating to the area. You could also check with Ballymena Museum, 3 Wellington Court, Ballymena, County Antrim, BT43 6EG, as to which local cemeterty records they hold on computer file.
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STEWART, Lanarkshire, Scotland and Fermanagh/Monaghan border areas, Ireland
LILLEY, County Antrim, Ireland (now NI).
HENDERSON,Lanarkshire,Scotland and probably County Londonderry, Ireland (now NI).
CAPE Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
SCOTT Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
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Janice M
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 2446
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Hi Scotmum,
Thank you so much for your help. I would appreciate you sending me the e-mail address for the Area Local Studies Service as I cannot seem to find it.
I really appreciate your advice on where to search and what to search for. We have been scratching our heads trying to figure out where to go next. I have been trying to educate myself with regards to the geography of Northern Ireland and just how far families were willing and/or able to travel for such things as burials, etc.
The burial plots are important to us, as we are not sure just how many relatives we are missing, because of the lack of census information. (Assuming of course that other family members are buried in the same place.)
Thank you again for all of your advice.
Janice
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Elder, Stewart, Johnston, Baskerville, Marks, Carson, Leitch, Bulloch, Thomson, Allen, Campbell, Gordon, Murray, Kelly, Chambers, Black, Cheyne, Youngson, Williamsdaughter, Anderson, Briggs, Pirie, Clark, Philp, Mannel, Lander, Rough, Lean, Bate, Lanxon, Brown, Oliver, Kitt, Shards, Bennet, Young, Petrie, Wylie, Herbertson, Martin, McAlister, Best, Ginn, Ross, McIntosh, McGillivray, Russell, Pettigrew, Fyfe, Barrie
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scotmum
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1296
Look back, look around, look forward!
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Have PM'd the email addy. Also, just to correct my previous post, it was actually nearby Randalstown 1st Presbyterian Church that I had visited. Sorry, but I was confusing the two, albeit as most Presbyterian churches in the area do have graveyards, I would guess that Portglenone will have one too.
PS
Hope you do not mind my being nosy. Notice in your profile that you have the Youngson name in one of your lines. Which area were they from?
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STEWART, Lanarkshire, Scotland and Fermanagh/Monaghan border areas, Ireland
LILLEY, County Antrim, Ireland (now NI).
HENDERSON,Lanarkshire,Scotland and probably County Londonderry, Ireland (now NI).
CAPE Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
SCOTT Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
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Janice M
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 2446
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Hi Scotmum
Thanks again for everything. I received your PM, and will be sending the e-mail off shortly.
The Youngson name in my line is of a Marjory Youngson, who married Alexander Cheyne July 25, 1835 in Lerwick, Shetland. They are my ggg-grandparents on my father's side. (Have also found Marjory as May and Youngson as Younson.)
They had at least one daughter Helen. I haven't been able to find any others as of yet. Helen married David Baskerville in Edinburgh on June 17, 1864. They moved to Glasgow sometime between July of 1866 and March of 1871.
There children were:
John Thomas b 1865 Edinburgh
Harriet May b 1866 Edinburgh
Helen b 1869 England
David b 1871 Glasgow
Sarah Anne b 1873 Glasgow
William b 1876 Glasgow
Alexander b 1878 Glasgow
If any of this sounds familiar to you, let me know and I can send you more details.
Janice
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Elder, Stewart, Johnston, Baskerville, Marks, Carson, Leitch, Bulloch, Thomson, Allen, Campbell, Gordon, Murray, Kelly, Chambers, Black, Cheyne, Youngson, Williamsdaughter, Anderson, Briggs, Pirie, Clark, Philp, Mannel, Lander, Rough, Lean, Bate, Lanxon, Brown, Oliver, Kitt, Shards, Bennet, Young, Petrie, Wylie, Herbertson, Martin, McAlister, Best, Ginn, Ross, McIntosh, McGillivray, Russell, Pettigrew, Fyfe, Barrie
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scotmum
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1296
Look back, look around, look forward!
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You may already have seen this map, but if not, it will help you understand where Gortahern and Kilycoogan were in relationship to each other and Portglenone:
http://uk.multimap.com/map/browse.cgi?client=public&X=-720000.1469601&Y=7301250.02145899&width=700&height=400&gride=-719903.1469601&gridn=7301511.02145899&srec=0&coordsys=mercator&db=freegaz&addr1=&addr2=&addr3=&pc=&advanced=&local=&localinfosel=&kw=&inmap=&table=&ovtype=&zm=0&scale=50000&up.x=290&up.y=6
You can click on the arrows on the box surrounding map to move around the area and[or zoom in/out using the option on page.
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Logged
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STEWART, Lanarkshire, Scotland and Fermanagh/Monaghan border areas, Ireland
LILLEY, County Antrim, Ireland (now NI).
HENDERSON,Lanarkshire,Scotland and probably County Londonderry, Ireland (now NI).
CAPE Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
SCOTT Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
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Janice M
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 2446
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Hi Scotmum
Thank you for the map link. I have seen other maps, but not this one. This is much better as I can navigate around to see what was close by.
Thanks again.
Janice
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Elder, Stewart, Johnston, Baskerville, Marks, Carson, Leitch, Bulloch, Thomson, Allen, Campbell, Gordon, Murray, Kelly, Chambers, Black, Cheyne, Youngson, Williamsdaughter, Anderson, Briggs, Pirie, Clark, Philp, Mannel, Lander, Rough, Lean, Bate, Lanxon, Brown, Oliver, Kitt, Shards, Bennet, Young, Petrie, Wylie, Herbertson, Martin, McAlister, Best, Ginn, Ross, McIntosh, McGillivray, Russell, Pettigrew, Fyfe, Barrie
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scotmum
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 1296
Look back, look around, look forward!
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No problem. I have found the Multimaps very helpful in my own research of various parts of Northern Ireland as for some reason, they use older maps as opposed to current ones. meant to say, if you use the up arrow on the box, you will see that the areas also lie close to Rasharkin, where the Elder, Smyth and Stewart names also seem to have been associated with.
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STEWART, Lanarkshire, Scotland and Fermanagh/Monaghan border areas, Ireland
LILLEY, County Antrim, Ireland (now NI).
HENDERSON,Lanarkshire,Scotland and probably County Londonderry, Ireland (now NI).
CAPE Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
SCOTT Cumberland, England & Lanarkshire, Scotland
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Janice M
RootsChat Aristocrat
Posts: 2446
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Scotmum,
Thanks again. I have already started checking out the townlands between where John and Margaret were living when they married, through to Craigs where they died. Maybe I will be able to find other family now that I have a better understanding of what townlands lie between.
Janice
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Elder, Stewart, Johnston, Baskerville, Marks, Carson, Leitch, Bulloch, Thomson, Allen, Campbell, Gordon, Murray, Kelly, Chambers, Black, Cheyne, Youngson, Williamsdaughter, Anderson, Briggs, Pirie, Clark, Philp, Mannel, Lander, Rough, Lean, Bate, Lanxon, Brown, Oliver, Kitt, Shards, Bennet, Young, Petrie, Wylie, Herbertson, Martin, McAlister, Best, Ginn, Ross, McIntosh, McGillivray, Russell, Pettigrew, Fyfe, Barrie
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