Author Topic: My 3xgreat-grandfather - can you help me find him??  (Read 1710 times)

Offline PrueM

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My 3xgreat-grandfather - can you help me find him??
« on: Wednesday 03 May 06 04:14 BST (UK) »
Hello all,

OK, I'm finally going to throw this out there, and see if anyone else can shed some light where I have not been able to!

My great-great-great-grandfather was Joseph Henry INGRAM.

At the time of the 1841 census, he was living in France with his wife Caroline MORRISH, and several children, born between 1835 and 1840 in France.  Joseph was working as an English teacher at the time. 

In 1851 the family was back in England.  They lived in Staines, Middx and Joseph was listed as a Teacher of Languages, born in Woodlands, Dorset.

In 1861 they are in Bangor, Wales.  JOseph was "Professor of French and Mathematics" and "a graduate of the university of France (!!  THere is no such place!)".  His birthplace was given as Bath, Somerset.

Thereafter, in 1871 and 1881, his birthplace is given as Bath.  He died in late 1881.

Joseph had a brother, Samuel Frederick INGRAM, who was born in about 1819 and all the census returns list his birthplace as Bath.  He was also a teacher.

It is our understanding that the family was, nominally at least, Catholic.

The parish records for Horton-with-Woodlands in Dorset have been searched for Joseph, but with no success.  Likewise the IGI for Bath doesn't show him although no search has been made of the parish records (but Bath being a big place I'm a bit unsure of what to look for anyway).  No marriage for Joseph and Caroline has yet been found (it's possible they married in France).

My questions are:

1)  Where was he born?
2)  Why can't I find his baptism/christening?  Is it because he might have been Catholic?
3)  If he was Catholic, where might I find baptism records (if they exist)?

I have so many questions about this man!!  Sorry if this seems garbled.  I can clarify if need be...and would dearly appreciate ANY help!

Thank  you for your time
 :)
Prue

Offline AMBLY

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Re: My 3xgreat-grandfather - can you help me find him??
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 06 May 06 08:11 BST (UK) »
In 1861 they are in Bangor, Wales.  JOseph was "Professor of French and Mathematics" and "a graduate of the university of France (!!  THere is no such place!)". 

Hi Prue

This page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_France
Refers to the University of France, originally Imperial University of France, founded 1808 and dibanded 1896.

Also mentioned here:
http://uk.encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_761566988/Napoleon_I.html
http://www.napoleonicmedals.org/coins/fran14-5.htm

Cheers
AMBLY
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

"Now that we're all here, I'm not sure if we're all there...."

 Entre los individuos, como entre las naciones, el respeto al derecho ajeno es la paz
 Among individuals, as among nations, respect for the rights of others is peace
    ~Benito Juarez (1806-1872)

Offline Valda

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Re: My 3xgreat-grandfather - can you help me find him??
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 06 May 06 08:35 BST (UK) »
I'd inquire of the Catholic Family Society whether any registers for Bath survive.

http://www.catholic-history.org.uk/cfhs/

Regards

Valda

Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline PrueM

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Re: My 3xgreat-grandfather - can you help me find him??
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 06 May 06 08:36 BST (UK) »
Brilliant!
Thank you so much, both of you!

I can't believe I didn't bother looking for the University of France - I just thought it sounded so far-fetched that it was incorrect.

Many, many thanks from a happy camper  :D

Prue


Offline Dave Francis

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Re: My 3xgreat-grandfather - can you help me find him??
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 06 May 06 11:35 BST (UK) »
Hi Prue

This appears to be Samuel's marriage registration:

Samuel Frederick INGRAM
Mar qtr 1850 St Saviour, Southwark vol 4 page 463

He seems to have married Margaret FRANCIS
(matching reference, also see 1851 Census)

A copy of the certificate will provide the name and occ of Samuel's father.

Intriguingly, the same marriage reference throws up the following brides and grooms:
Charles Thomas INGRAM
Francis William DIMMACK
William HAYBITTLE
Sarah INGRAM
Sarah Frances DIMMACK
Tabitha HENDY

Multiple weddings for the same families on the same day?
Or just a coincidence?

Dave
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Surnames include: FRANCIS in Glamorgan / LANWORN in Monmouth / BLACKMAN, RUSSELL in Sussex / KEARSEY, BARLTROP in Essex / TOOKEY in Leicestershire / LASHMORE in London and Kent / GOODWIN, PASQUE, ATTOE, FISK, QUINTON, RUFFLES, CULLINGFORD and others in Suffolk / MAYOSS anywhere anytime! / GILMORE in Belfast

Offline PrueM

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Re: My 3xgreat-grandfather - can you help me find him??
« Reply #5 on: Saturday 06 May 06 13:02 BST (UK) »
Hi Dave,
That's interesting, thank you.
I do have Samuel's marriage cert to Margaret (I'm sorry, I should have mentioned that  :-[ ) and the father is named as "George Ingram, Clerk".
Needless to say, having that information has not helped in my quest!
Myself and Cal241 are descended from Joseph, and we have other cousins descended from Samuel - all of whom are desperately trying to get back that one generation.

Those other Ingram marriages are very intriguing, if it wasn't for the cost of getting certs I could almost send away for one and see who the father of one of the other Ingrams is...hmmmm......maybe after the next pay packet!  Having the names to add to my notes is useful anyway.

Thank you so much Dave, for your time.  I appreciate it   :)

Prue

P.S. You have no connection with Margaret Francis, then?  That would be nice  :D

Offline Dave Francis

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Re: My 3xgreat-grandfather - can you help me find him??
« Reply #6 on: Saturday 06 May 06 16:01 BST (UK) »
Nooo - no connection with Margaret Francis.  LOL
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Surnames include: FRANCIS in Glamorgan / LANWORN in Monmouth / BLACKMAN, RUSSELL in Sussex / KEARSEY, BARLTROP in Essex / TOOKEY in Leicestershire / LASHMORE in London and Kent / GOODWIN, PASQUE, ATTOE, FISK, QUINTON, RUFFLES, CULLINGFORD and others in Suffolk / MAYOSS anywhere anytime! / GILMORE in Belfast