Michie Lineage in Clackmannanshire

[TJMichie]

Hello,
I've recently begun researching my family history and I've been using a sheet of paper my great grandfather put together. I'm posting this here hoping I can get more information on the Michies mentioned, specifically siblings and full names, what I'm putting here is all I have, as well as some information on the people/families mentioned.

The reason I say I'm looking for full names is, when my great grandfather put this together, his focus was on the fact our line is all Johns and Alexanders. For example, his name was Frances John Alexander, but he's simply listed as "John". I'm sure many of these are middle names and I'm sure things would be easier on me if I had their full names plus any death dates and such as well. After taking a quick look through a few threads, it seems to me a lot of last names of spouses are mentioned here. I'm not looking for official help, more anecdotal for now. I'm just hoping to connect up with some or a few people and fill in a few blanks. As a side note, while everyone appears to have been born in Alloa, the town name I always heard as a child was Tillicoultry. Don't think that means anything, but it's there.

A cousin of mine has been able to fill in some stuff on more recent generations, such as extended family through spouses, so I won't include anything more recent than my great grandfather here, but he's the first one born outside Crackmannanshire from the looks of things. Myself, my father and my grandfather were all born in British Columbia, Canada. My great grandfather was born in Pennsylvania and his father was, apparently, born in Crackmannanshire. Anyway, from the beginning:
All Alexanders and Johns are Michies
-----
Alexander b.Unknown
Married Isobel Janet MacLarine
Son Alexander Christened Aug 1668

Alexander married Elizabeth Spowart Aug 26, 1695
Son John b.May 11, 1701

John married Agnes Aitken Dec 29,1726
Son John b.Dec 27 1729

John married Margaret Jack Aug 24, 1743
Son John b.Feb 9, 1759

John married Frances Erskine Snadon Jan 26, 1788
Son John b.Mar 24,1793

John married Elizabeth Hunter Jan 26, 1813
Son John b.Feb 12, 1818

John married Margaret Black Paterson Jan 24, 1837
Son John b.May 11, 1839

John married Helen Clement Oct 11, 1858
Son John Aug 10, 1859

John married Isabella Jane Burden 1878 (no month or date)
Son Alexander May 31, 1884

Alexander married Martha Suttie
Son John mar 26, 1914

If anyone has anything they can add to this and help me out, I'd be more than appreciative!
-Tyson

[MonicaL]

Hi Tyson

Welcome to RootsChat 

Just picking out some of the couples to try to help.

John Michie and Helen Clement marriage https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XTL2-ST5

1871 Census to help expand on the family - everone born in Alloa:

John Michie 31, general clerk
Helen Michie 30
John Michie 11
Alexander Michie 9
Helen Michie 4
Margaret Michie 2
Elizabeth Michie 1 month
James Michie 14 brother, Factory Worker
Christina Michie 10 sister

Address: Private House, Tillicoultry

And from 1881:

John Michie 41 Coal Weigher
Helen C Michie 41
Alexander Michie 19, Enginekeeper At Works
Helen Michie 14
Margaret Michie 12
Elizabeth Michie 10
James Michie 8
Andrew Michie 6
George Michie 4
Jeanie Michie 1...last born I think.
Christina Michie 20, sister, Woollen Millworker

Address: No 1 Devonside, Tillicoultry

1891, the family still show at 1 Devonside, with John Snr. working as a Pitheadman.

Monica

[MonicaL]

The next line down to Alexander b. 1884, again censuses are a great way of expanding the family to siblings.

From 1891 in Wellington Vancouver - All the Michies showing as born in Scotland, very recently going by the age of the youngest, possibly 1890 (hopefully a shipping manifest entry will let you confirm):

John Michie 31
Issabella Michie 31
Margaret Michie 13...showing as born 31 Jan 1878, so parents married same year 
John Michie 11
Henry Michie 9
Alexander Michie 7
Nelly Michie 5
Joa (?Isa) Michie 3
Elizabeth Mickie 1
P Thomas Williams 49, lodger b. England
   
A few more children for 1901:

John Michie 41, engineer
Isebella Michie 42
Maggie Michie 23
John Michie 21
Henry Michie 19
Alexander Michie 16
Nellie Michie 14
Iac Michie 12
Elizabeth Michie 11
Jane Michie 9
Grace Michie 8
Sadie Michie 6
Fanny Michie 3...last born I think.

Monica

Added: Re shipping records, I think John Snr travelled first (not sure on dates for that). Isabella and the children arrived together on the 'Pomerian' on 24 Sep 1890 at Quebec heading for Wellington.

[MonicaL]

Alexander Michie married Martha Irilla Suttie on 20 May 1908 in Nanaimo. I think this is their 1911 census entry in Ladysmith, Nanaimo (mis transcribed):

Alexander Michock 27, teamster, b. Scotland
Martha Michock 25 b. USA
Martha Irela Michock 2 b. BC

Monica

[MonicaL]

Just a little more, and then we can talk about sources where you can also look up further info and research.

John Michie and Margaret Black Paterson, you had their marriage as 24 Jan 1837. Just a note, Margaret is showing as Margaret Black on the children's Parish/Register entries so not sure where the Paterson comes in for her.

Possible 1841 entry:

John Michie 25, collier
Margt Black 20
John Michie 2 - https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/XBKD-K6T

Address: Holtin Square, Alloa

From 1851, everyone showing as born in Alloa except for mother Margaret:

John Michie 34 coal miner
Margaret Michie 32 b. Sauchie
John Michie 11
Margaret Michie 9
Betsey Michie 6
Jane Michie 2

Address: Cockneylane, Alloa

And 1861, for a little more on the children:

John Michie 43, coal miner
Margt Michie 41
Elisabeth Michie 15
Jane Michie 13
Margt Michie 7
James Michie 4
George Michie 2
Christina Michie 1...think she was last born.

Address: Carse Bridge, Alloa

Monica

[MonicaL]

Just wanted to add some resources and links to help you in your searches:

General collection of links and resources here www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,504968.0.html

Excellent free resources include:

FamilySearch/ LDS here https://familysearch.org/search
 
Free census compiled by volunteers. 100% coverage so far of Clackmannashire for 1841 http://freecen.rootsweb.com/

Pay to view for original images of BMDs/Censuses/Old Parish Register entries www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/search/marriage/index.aspx

To help you get your bearings! Map of Scottish Counties - www.genuki.org.uk/big/sct/index.html and maps of parishes within the counties - www.scotlandsfamily.com/parish-maps.htm

Monica

[TJMichie]

I knew I came to the right place!

Yes, it looks like you found the right line. Thanks for the info on Black/Paterson. I figured out there was likely an error or two in there (the Erskine-Snadon part doesn't seem right, either) so I'm sure I'll find a few more. This is just a write-up my great grandfather did 30 or so years ago and almost reads like Proverbs, but the word "begat" wasn't used. It is exclusive to my direct line of Johns and Alexanders and traces back to the 1668 christening.

Thank you as well for the map of Scottish counties. I have to say it would have been more helpful a week ago, haha, but Google Earth helped me out a bit. One thing I'm having a little trouble with is when I go farther back into the history of the Michie name. Several sources have said the first recorded Michie is one "John Mychy" in a rental book from Cupar Angus Aberdeenshire. When I look up Cupar Angus, though, it takes me down south closer to Clackannenshire. There is also, evidently, a large branch of Michies stemming from Aberdeenshire under the Forbes clan. Looking at the shape of it, was Aberdeenshire longer/larger c.1473 and was Cupar Angus ever considered part of it? I'm (probably in an excercize of futility) trying to connect the Michies of Clackannenshire to the "Michael MacDonald" who supposedly left the MacDonald clan and who's children became the first Michies. Evidently, the Michies do hold connection with the MacDonalds and the Forbes, and basic agreement is that Michael left and either he or a descendant joined up with the Forbes clan. The biggest problem I face is that the only thing I have telling me Michael MacDonald even existed is a story in a book that comes from a letter written between two Michies in the 1800s plus some mentions of the story, but no other tellings.

I'm gonna be honest and say Scottish history is WAY more interesting than the English history I've been doing for my wife (but her Greek tops them all) and way more interesting than I thought it was.

Again, thanks for all the info and tips. I'm sure I'll be back very soon with more questions!

[TJMichie]

Alexander Michie married Martha Irilla Suttie on 20 May 1908 in Nanaimo. I think this is their 1911 census entry in Ladysmith, Nanaimo (mis transcribed):

Alexander Michock 27, teamster, b. Scotland
Martha Michock 25 b. USA
Martha Irela Michock 2 b. BC

Monica

This is kind of messing me up here. My family did come to BC and was in Vancouver area for a couple generations, but my:
Grandfather was born in Vancouver
Great grandfather was born in Pennsylvania
Great great grandfather was born in Alloa, Clackmannanshire

or so the story goes. My grandfather had American citizenship for as long as I knew him, so it stands to reason that we didn't come straight to Canada through Quebec, unless Alexander 1884 went Scotland-Vancouver-Pennsylvania-Vancouver, which I suppose is possible, but I don't think is likely.

[MonicaL]

Who is great great grandfather? Is it Alexander Michie born in 1884?

The marriage for Alexander to Martha certainly seems to show in 1908 and that 1911 entry in Ladysmith, Nanaimo fits really in every respect (I think!). With Martha showing as American, wonder if they went back to the US for a few years and this is where you have the American birth?

Just checked...there is an entry for a crossing from Canada to the US for them in 1913. Daughter showing as Irilla it looks like. Alexander, occupation teamster, gave his father John's details as contact in Canada. Contact details for the US are Martha's father, Archie in Pennsylvania. You will probably recognise the place name, whilst I struggle with it! See below.

Did Alexander b. 1884 die back in Vancouver area (25 Dec 1961)?