Tammy married her daughter off - ELLINgTON Family

[John1935]

Hello Westoe

Might just have found 'Invention', nice lady at British Library, is having a copy sent up to her so had she can check, and will know next Tuesday,so fingers crossed - it is so nice when you manage to contact such a helpful person, and that happened twice last week, the other being at Devon Family History Soc.

"Once you know a port a ship is Registered at you can look at Shipping Registers for that Port as these usually give the Masters name. On the research I have done so far on Shipping Registers I usually find that they are held by the Local Archives that cover the area the Port is in".

 Ref: BT115/11 (Alphabetical Register  for Captains, period 1845 - 1854)  The above had just been quoted to me - have you been able to do this for South Shields ( Thinking that John Tillman would have been on the 'John & Eleanor' at that time) - if so who did you contact  ? They seem to be implying that the top number ( which each year never changes, would be the Number given to the ship by it's Port of registry ?)

Best

John

[Westoe]

Hello John,

Good going with "Invention". I'll cross my fingers for you too.

Erm ... I'm not quite sure that I understand your question about BT 115/11. I didn't contact anybody - I've just had a few files that I have bought from TNA and the several which have been free downloads.

If you want to see what a page in BT 115/11 looks like, see the Merchant Seamen records at FindMyPast. There are two entries there for a John Tillman, born 1811, Exmouth. One of them is for BT 112 and the other is BT 115/11.

My problem is that I'm too far away to consult the Newcastle shipping registers and that TNA file where I found you Silas Angas on CHARLES RICHARD had data for London only until after Official Numbers were introduced, so wasn't much use for my early mariners.

Apologies if I am being obtuse on this one and Good Luck with your 'two chippies' 'Mabel and Mary' thread.

Cheers,
Westoe

[John1935]

Hello Westoe

Yes I have the two files, but while 112 has name of ships 115 is all numbers, and what it now appears is needed, is to find out if the number ( 1544.752 ) is a number given by Port of registry, and if so, where to find out to which ship, but somehow feel, that since I had three different answers from TNA, that I am on a wild goose chase! So think I will drop that one now.

Best

John

[John1935]

Hello All

Not been asleep, and not dead yet ! Have just come back from a digging trip in London.
So thought that I should relay any what might be useful info :
Well - first off ( see post 23) YES The British library is excellent, and staff very helpful, important point to mention is that before you go to get your library card - you can in fact register on line, which in turn means that you can use that reg No. to pre-order up what you wish to see.
My result thanks to very helpful Alice, and equally good staff in the digital imagery dept, I was able to get a good photo of 'John Tillman' taken from the Magazine ' Invention' ( however due to copyright I of course cannot show).
 Moan coming up - Crews list - I now understand that in 1970 the vast collection of OUR heritage 'crews list' was split up, with about 10% to TNA, the same to National Maritime Museum, with remainder offered to their Ports of origin,, ( Not all port would accept them).
I understand that NMM have years 1861, 62, & 63 then years ending in 5 only. I happened to order up two of these list while at NMM and was pleased to see the care and attention that had been paid to their preservation, each one arrived in a separate folder, enveloped in a rigid plastic folder. Also found staff there extremely helpful.
Not so in TNA, where you had many stuffed in an old cardboard box!!! have just re read and NO I didn't mean that the Staff were in boxes - Sorry Another problem at TNA was my following  experience, and a warning to others, to allow plenty of time - as they do not have the same system in place as British Library.
To Follow

Best

John

[John1935]

TNA Continued

Hour and a half to get there, another hour and a half to get card - then to start desk ?

Me:   How do I order please .

Young lady : I will help you, on the computer we first go to - Oh ! Let us try this one instead. Ah good,   now you swipe your card like this, Uhm, try again, we are having some problems !!!

(Another computer - bit like musical chairs - still smiling - just)

At last!

Me : so I enter the info here

Lady : yes and then you go to reading room over there.

Me : But it says it is not held here and will take three days to get!!!  And I am not here in 

               three days - why could this have not been pointed out before.

Lady : We are thinking about changing the system, so that people can find out.

Me : like the efficient system that the British library use ?

Lady : Sorry, yes.

Well as they say you can't win them all!!

Oops forgot to mention LMA, mainly because I had in the past got so use to their good service, and I was not disappointed this time either

Best

John

[John1935]

Afternoon All,

Follow up on Captain John Tillman's sea career :


Have found another of the ships that John Tillman was Master on, that appears to have been built at 'Shorts' of Sunderland in 1864 

'Robert & Charlotte'  a Barque of 349 T measurements 120.00 x 27.1 x 16.7. Built of Fir,

Yellow Metal Sheathed and fastened. O.N. 47499 (  ref Lloyd's 1866 )

His address at that time was : 8, Edgerton Street Bishopwearmouth Sunderland.

Notice also that John Tillman did maiden voyage to Med for three months, Captain Turnbull ( John's

sister married a Turnbull ) then took command . The Tullick family are also close ( that being maiden

name of John's wife ). Note that one of the Tullicks was the last to Captain “Royal Arch”, while still

owned by John Tillman’s Son in 1877, after his father had died in 1868.

‘Geraldine 361 T Barque  o/n  51163 measurements 121.1 x 27.9 x 17.4   built & reg

S/land 1864 Owner R.Sheraton

John on Lloyd's reg as Master 1865 to mid 1866. Voyages that I found in Newspapers were :
 
Arr Shields 13th May 1865 from Alexandria.

At Constantinople from Ceres 30th May 1865 – 20th June Arr Shields from Ceres.

Arr Falmouth 18th July from Kustondje for Gloster left 24th July 1865

The Crews list, that I  picked up in NMM  this time gave Geraldine as having arrived in Sunderland

on the 23rd Jan 1865 from Taranrog ( Russia), so confirming the above, and giving me his

previous Ship. So far so good – but the next hit for John on the Newspapers, is :

All for today - garden calls !!

Best

John

[John1935]

Still on my London diggings -

Just no luck on my two Chippies ( Thomas and Peter Ellington ) or their families.

Must be another way 'to skin a rabbit', I am missing something, somewhere !

Ellingtons were a loss again, having bought the crew's list from 'Invicta', and finding that Peter's

previous ship was 'Pride of the Wear', had a hope of following him back from there, but no luck he

was not on the only list that I could find, which was in 1866 - so dead on that one. Now remember

what I forgot was to try  1865 Lists for the 'Pride' from NMM !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Likewise with Thomas, no sign of list for the 'Tudor Prince' nor the 'Jason',
 
Only actual crews list, re Ellingtons concerned Older brother - Henry George, which confirms that he was master of the 'Dauson' in 1865, that the Ship was a coastal collier, and that he was up and down the N.E. coast like a yo-yo ! from Sunderland to London each time, know how he must have felt !   ( in my case was the 'Fireglow' and Seaham Harbour to Battersea Power station)
 
H.G.  also of course  appeared on crew list 1866 on the 'Pride of the Wear'. 

Still Nothing on the death of their Father ( Thomasin's husband) !!!!

And afraid that is all for time being.

Best

John

[John1935]

Hello Westoe

First, the report on the Acadia ( David Goodsir's Ship ) was as follows :

"Acadia 32849 Barque, 37 years old, reg S.Shields - wood 733 tons, cargo Esparto Grass & Lead 740 Tons, voyage Newcastle from Malta. No. Crew 16. No. of lives lost - NIL. State of weather Lt westerly wind.
Cause of Casualty & Inquiry - burnt. Caused by cargo catching fire off coast of Spain."

Second is question - Have you any idea, when the 'North East Coast Collier Agreement ' first came into operation?
All I can remember is that the instant you tied up in your loading Port - Half the crew shot off home.
While the other half, loaded the ship and sent off telegrams when ship was ready for sea for the rest to rejoin. - This was reversed on the next run North - One big moan was when we were sent to Rotterdam. (Yes, Westoe we did find Rotterdam, just!! with the aid in Fog of Decca Navigator).
I being from the South, was popular with the Mate, ( as he was able to be off each time - and he looked after the discharging in London - so it was me who was away)
So I loaded each trip North and got amongst other things a real appreciation of the skill of the 'Trimmers' and the work they did to make sure very ship was safe for sea.

Best

John

[Westoe]

Second is question - Have you any idea, when the 'North East Coast Collier Agreement ' first came into operation?
All I can remember is that the instant you tied up in your loading Port - Half the crew shot off home.

Hello John,

Sorry, no, no idea.

Cheers,
Westoe