THOMAS Family of Llanelly

[English Daisy]

Hi Roycymru

Thank you for John Thomas family post replies 3 and 4.

Is there any way of finding out how many Thomas families lived on Water Street, Llanelly, back in 1837, when Jane Griffiths, daughter of John Griffiths and Ann Thomas was born?

I will save these two Thomas posts!  How are you related to this Thomas family, Roy?

Regards
English Daisy

[roycymru]

Hi English Daisy

The only way I know of to check on how many Thomas's may possibly have lived at Water Street in 1837 is to look at the 1841 census entries for Water Street.  Fortunately I have access to this. The only other John Thomas I can find is aged 60, a Mason, living on his own. There is no record of the John Thomas, printer but as the first record I have for him is 1844 he may have moved into Water Street after 1841, in fact it looks like this John Thomas appears in the 1851 census at Water Street as a bookbinder as Head of the family (age 23) with sister Catherine Thomas (30) Dress Maker, sister Mary Thomas (possibly 30, possibly a Grocer, difficult to make out), sister Esther Thomas (age 29, Domestic Duties) and bother Henry (?) aged 17 (?), Printers Compositer, all have possible birth place of Llanwinio Carmarthenshire.

Where does your reference to John Thomas of Water Street come from?

My link in on my grandmother's side. John was a brother of William Thomas (father of both was Jonah). William Thomas and Margaret Williams produced a John Thomas! John Thomas married Sarah Edmund and produced Margaret Thomas. Margaret Thomas married Walter Rees who produced Sarah Elizabeth Rees my grandmother.

Roy

[English Daisy]

Hi Roycymru

My reference to John Thomas of Water Street came from
Jane Griffiths Birth Certificate.

Information provided for informant's residence column on certificate is:

John Thomas of Water Street Llanelly
Brother of said Ann Thomas

If John Thomas is the only Thomas family living on Water Street,
in the 1841 Census, there is a high probability that we are researching
the same John Thomas.

What do you think?

Regards
English Daisy

Ann Thomas would be my gg grandmother!

[roycymru]

Hi English Daisy

Difficult to be definite especially as John Thomas was such a common name. I have no record of Jonah Thomas also having a daughter Ann (but my records are far from complete). The John Tomas, Mason who was living on his own in Water Street in 1841 I would guess is unlikely to be Ann's brother as he was "60" in 1841 while  Ann was 27 therefore the age gap is too large. But then if it is "my" John Thomas why was he the informant on Ann's daughter, Jane's birth certificate it seems unusual? There seemed to have been a lot of people living at Water Street in 1841 and it looks like one of those places that people came and went from so although you John Thomas was there in 1837 he may have moved out by 1841? Could really do with something else to link them, but not sure what. Anyone else have any ideas?

roycymru

[English Daisy]

Hi Roycymru

The reason why Ann Thomas brother was the informant
on her daughter, Jane Griffiths, birth certificate is that her
husband, John Griffiths, was a mariner and therefore likely at sea
when Jane was born in 1837!

In 1841, John Griffiths was not listed with his mariner wife, Ann Thomas
on Mill Street, Llanelly. He was likely away again. 

How far is Mill Street from Water Street in Llanelly?

Regards
English Daisy   

[roycymru]

Hi English Daisy

Thought I would search and see where Mill Street was in relation to Water Street in 1841. This is where it gets confusing as there was a Mill Street and a "Wern" Mill Street. Also there was a Lower Water Street,  two Water Streets in different districts  and a "Wern" Water Street!

I did find Ann Griffith on page 9 at Mill Street (District 6). Preceding this page 1-8 covers one of the Water Streets! This seems the most likely candidate for the Water Street your John Thomas lived at. Although in 1841 I couldn't initially find a definite John Thomas living in Water Street there was a  Jno Thomas (35) Printer and Jno Thomas Jnr(?) (9) (on page 7). There seem to be several first names abbreviated to Jno on this page. Looking on the Internet the most commonly agreed consensus for what Jno means is John

http://www.british-genealogy.com/resources/registers/registers/realnames.htm


This is confirmed by the fact that on this page is a Jno Christopher (26) a Tide Waiter and in the 1851 census there is a John Christopher (36) a Tide Waiter.

Therefore to me this definitely looks like your John Thomas!

I thought I have found him again in 1851. John Thomas a Master Printer employing 2 men. Age 44, born abt. 1807, born Carmarthen. Now living at Priory Street Carmarthen (HO107/2473/~F348), with wife Amy (37), Son Wiliam (11), and daughters Miriam (7), Martha (4) and Alice (2). However there was a John Thomas 36 a Printer living at Peter Street in Carmarthen in 1841, so I think this may be this one.

However the earlier references I found to "John Thomas, Water Street Llanelly  listed as a Printer at http://www.llanelli-history.i12.com/Trade%20Directories_hunt%201849.htm in 1849 and a Thomas listed as a printer at Water Street in 1844 http://www.llanelli-history.i12.com/Trade%20Directories_pigot%201844.htm but this time no first name and is listed as Rees and Thomas Water St." now look highly likely to be your John Thomas.

Ideally you need to find a John Thomas, Printer in Llanelly in 1851. I can't but others might.

Roy

[English Daisy]

Hi roycmyru

Thank you very much for your very informative last post!

I have sent you a PM, since my reply is quite long.

Regards
English Daisy

[Bynea Girl]

Hi English Daisy,

Mill Street & Water Street are in the same area, almost the town centre of Llanelly.  They are in the area of Anne St, on the Wern (which is a hill).

Please check the 1891 & 1901 census for Ystradfodwg Glamorgan and you will find at Metaxa Street a Thomas Griffiths collier of Pembrey born in the right year.  I believe this is the correct Thomas, not the one from Brynbach farm or from Colliers Rd Llanelly. 

Regards
Bynea Girl

[English Daisy]

Hi Bynea Girl

Thank you for your post.

I will check the 1891 and 1901 census for Thomas Griffiths.

English Daisy