Author Topic: Volume 1 -A1 of Philadelphia passenger lists 1883-1948??  (Read 3770 times)

Offline coombs

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Volume 1 -A1 of Philadelphia passenger lists 1883-1948??
« on: Sunday 05 May 13 23:56 BST (UK) »
Hi

I am really confused here. I found a passenger list entry for my ancestor Thomas Musgrave which says Volume Number is 1 -A1, page 75, line 38. This is from the card index on the FamilySearch website. April 1892.

But for the life of me I cannot seem to find any volume called 1 -A1. I wonder if someone would be able to hep me here at all?

Thanks

Ben.
Researching:

LONDON, Coombs, Roberts, Auber, Helsdon, Fradine, Morin, Goodacre
DORSET Coombs, Munday
NORFOLK Helsdon, Riches, Harbord, Budery
KENT Roberts, Goodacre
SUSSEX Walder, Boniface, Dinnage, Standen, Lee, Botten, Wickham, Jupp
SUFFOLK Titshall, Frost, Fairweather, Mayhew, Archer, Eade, Scarfe
DURHAM Stewart, Musgrave, Wilson, Forster
SCOTLAND Stewart in Selkirk
USA Musgrave, Saix
ESSEX Cornwell, Stock, Quilter, Lawrence, Whale, Clift
OXON Edgington, Smith, Inkpen, Snell, Batten, Brain

Offline inor

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Re: Volume 1 -A1 of Philadelphia passenger lists 1883-1948??
« Reply #1 on: Monday 06 May 13 16:49 BST (UK) »
Thomas Musgrave is on the attached ship list (SS Lord Clive, Liverpool to Philadelphia, arrived April 1892).  His name is 19th from the bottom.

inor

Offline coombs

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Re: Volume 1 -A1 of Philadelphia passenger lists 1883-1948??
« Reply #2 on: Monday 06 May 13 18:22 BST (UK) »
Hi

Thanks for the info and image.

I just rechecked the card index and it seems there were 2 Thomas Musgrave's on the same voyage, one aged 61, the other aged 64. The latter is my rellie. Thomas Musgrave, miner, aged 64, widower, and stated he had 2 daughters in Pennsylvania. The other was a farmer aged 61. Quite a coincidence.

Although only one shows up in the passenger lists then?. Strange.

Ben
Researching:

LONDON, Coombs, Roberts, Auber, Helsdon, Fradine, Morin, Goodacre
DORSET Coombs, Munday
NORFOLK Helsdon, Riches, Harbord, Budery
KENT Roberts, Goodacre
SUSSEX Walder, Boniface, Dinnage, Standen, Lee, Botten, Wickham, Jupp
SUFFOLK Titshall, Frost, Fairweather, Mayhew, Archer, Eade, Scarfe
DURHAM Stewart, Musgrave, Wilson, Forster
SCOTLAND Stewart in Selkirk
USA Musgrave, Saix
ESSEX Cornwell, Stock, Quilter, Lawrence, Whale, Clift
OXON Edgington, Smith, Inkpen, Snell, Batten, Brain

Offline inor

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Re: Volume 1 -A1 of Philadelphia passenger lists 1883-1948??
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 07 May 13 04:41 BST (UK) »
Hi Ben,

At the very end of the ship list (attached) there is a notation about an "additional list", but I have no idea where that is.  Your Thomas might possibly be there.

Best of luck to you.

inor



Offline coombs

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Re: Volume 1 -A1 of Philadelphia passenger lists 1883-1948??
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 07 May 13 13:43 BST (UK) »
Hi Inor.

I think I have solved the mystery and with your help. The Thomas Musgrave who returned to America in 1892 aged 61 appears to be my ancestor. He gave basic info on the passenger list and appeared to knock 3 years off his age but in the additional list he gave the correct info it seems. Thomas Musgrave, aged 64, miner, widower and came to join 2 daughters in Penna. All that corresponds with my Thomas Musgrave.

He emigrated first in 1886 and knocked a few years off his age but emigrated with his youngest daughter who was given correct info. Yet on all censuses he gave his exact age including the 1900 US census.

Ben
Researching:

LONDON, Coombs, Roberts, Auber, Helsdon, Fradine, Morin, Goodacre
DORSET Coombs, Munday
NORFOLK Helsdon, Riches, Harbord, Budery
KENT Roberts, Goodacre
SUSSEX Walder, Boniface, Dinnage, Standen, Lee, Botten, Wickham, Jupp
SUFFOLK Titshall, Frost, Fairweather, Mayhew, Archer, Eade, Scarfe
DURHAM Stewart, Musgrave, Wilson, Forster
SCOTLAND Stewart in Selkirk
USA Musgrave, Saix
ESSEX Cornwell, Stock, Quilter, Lawrence, Whale, Clift
OXON Edgington, Smith, Inkpen, Snell, Batten, Brain

Offline johnnyboy

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Re: Volume 1 -A1 of Philadelphia passenger lists 1883-1948??
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 07 May 13 17:17 BST (UK) »
Hi Inor.

I think I have solved the mystery and with your help. The Thomas Musgrave who returned to America in 1892 aged 61 appears to be my ancestor. He gave basic info on the passenger list and appeared to knock 3 years off his age but in the additional list he gave the correct info it seems. Thomas Musgrave, aged 64, miner, widower and came to join 2 daughters in Penna. All that corresponds with my Thomas Musgrave.

He emigrated first in 1886 and knocked a few years off his age but emigrated with his youngest daughter who was given correct info. Yet on all censuses he gave his exact age including the 1900 US census.

Ben

Hi Ben: I think you need to find that "additional list" to eliminate the possibility that there were two Thomas Musgrave's on the same ship. Book Two, as mentioned in the second passenger lits posted by inor, would be somewhere among the 817 images that include the first passenger list with Thomas Musgrave, farmer, on it. The last line of the index card for your ancestor Thomas Musgrave may have a typographical error in the volume number. The passenger lists in question are in volumes X1 and X2, rather than A1. You will see that if if you scroll down to item 16 on this link: https://familysearch.org/search/image/index#uri=https://familysearch.org/records/collection/1921481/waypoints

If you look at the index card for Thomas Musgrave's arrival in 1892, you'll notice, right under the box in which Lord Clive is typed that there is some small print. The numbers become blurred as you enlarge the image, but I can see that they seem to be 9(2?) 28 27(37?), meaning a date in February or September 1927 or 1937. I think it was 1937, when a lot of jobs were created by the U.S. government through the Works Progress Administration to put people to  work during the Great Depression. The date is the date on which that index form was created at the printer. But the information on them may have come from the original 1892 passenger lists (more likely) or from old information cards (with original data from the passenger) that were being newly indexed using the Soundex system (which is based on the first three consonants of the surname).

Regards,
John  :o :o :o
ENGLAND (all Yorkshire but one)
SLATER: Ovenden, Halifax, and Massachusetts
DOBSON, LONGBOTTOM: Thornton (Bradford)
DRURY: Darton, Halifax, and Massachusetts
NEVIL(LE): Wigan (Lancs.), Darton
MEGSON: Dewsbury, Ossett
GARSIDE: Woolley, West Bretton

SCOTLAND
ROBERT HENDRY: b. 1856, Who-knows-where-shire, Scotland; 1882 to US
DEMPSTER, HOUSTON: Lesmahagow, Glasgow, and Massachusetts
GALBRAITH, MEIKLE: Kirkmichael, Ayr.; Hamilton, Glasgow, and Massachusetts

Offline coombs

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Re: Volume 1 -A1 of Philadelphia passenger lists 1883-1948??
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 07 May 13 17:37 BST (UK) »
Hi Inor.

I think I have solved the mystery and with your help. The Thomas Musgrave who returned to America in 1892 aged 61 appears to be my ancestor. He gave basic info on the passenger list and appeared to knock 3 years off his age but in the additional list he gave the correct info it seems. Thomas Musgrave, aged 64, miner, widower and came to join 2 daughters in Penna. All that corresponds with my Thomas Musgrave.

He emigrated first in 1886 and knocked a few years off his age but emigrated with his youngest daughter who was given correct info. Yet on all censuses he gave his exact age including the 1900 US census.

Ben

Hi Ben: I think you need to find that "additional list" to eliminate the possibility that there were two Thomas Musgrave's on the same ship. Book Two, as mentioned in the second passenger lits posted by inor, would be somewhere among the 817 images that include the first passenger list with Thomas Musgrave, farmer, on it. The last line of the index card for your ancestor Thomas Musgrave may have a typographical error in the volume number. The passenger lists in question are in volumes X1 and X2, rather than A1. You will see that if if you scroll down to item 16 on this link: https://familysearch.org/search/image/index#uri=https://familysearch.org/records/collection/1921481/waypoints

If you look at the index card for Thomas Musgrave's arrival in 1892, you'll notice, right under the box in which Lord Clive is typed that there is some small print. The numbers become blurred as you enlarge the image, but I can see that they seem to be 9(2?) 28 27(37?), meaning a date in February or September 1927 or 1937. I think it was 1937, when a lot of jobs were created by the U.S. government through the Works Progress Administration to put people to  work during the Great Depression. The date is the date on which that index form was created at the printer. But the information on them may have come from the original 1892 passenger lists (more likely) or from old information cards (with original data from the passenger) that were being newly indexed using the Soundex system (which is based on the first three consonants of the surname).

Regards,
John  :o :o :o

Hi John. Yes the date on the card shows most likely when they were indexed, (1937ish) not when the passenger arrived. The indexes were compiled in the 1930s as you said. I checked a few others and it has the same date as 1937 so it does look like the info was from the original lists created at the time they arrived, such as 1894 etc.

I do know that the info on my Thomas's card in 1892 is correct such as the personal info and the number of children there, which shows that there is a record somewhere of his return to America. I do think it is probably the same Thomas who gave info, such as he gave additional info on himself so he appears twice in the cards.

At least I know there is a record of Thomas's return to the US which was copied onto those card indexes (either a passenger list or immigration card).

Ben
Researching:

LONDON, Coombs, Roberts, Auber, Helsdon, Fradine, Morin, Goodacre
DORSET Coombs, Munday
NORFOLK Helsdon, Riches, Harbord, Budery
KENT Roberts, Goodacre
SUSSEX Walder, Boniface, Dinnage, Standen, Lee, Botten, Wickham, Jupp
SUFFOLK Titshall, Frost, Fairweather, Mayhew, Archer, Eade, Scarfe
DURHAM Stewart, Musgrave, Wilson, Forster
SCOTLAND Stewart in Selkirk
USA Musgrave, Saix
ESSEX Cornwell, Stock, Quilter, Lawrence, Whale, Clift
OXON Edgington, Smith, Inkpen, Snell, Batten, Brain

Offline coombs

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Re: Volume 1 -A1 of Philadelphia passenger lists 1883-1948??
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 08 May 13 18:25 BST (UK) »
I looked at the list again of the Lord Clive and looked a bit before and after but cannot find that "additional list". It could well be in another archive rather than amongst the filmed lists in X1. I am sure that is probably where the info on my Thomas Musgrave came from. But at least it is good to know when he went back to the US and the info was gathered from a list or an original card written in 1892.
Researching:

LONDON, Coombs, Roberts, Auber, Helsdon, Fradine, Morin, Goodacre
DORSET Coombs, Munday
NORFOLK Helsdon, Riches, Harbord, Budery
KENT Roberts, Goodacre
SUSSEX Walder, Boniface, Dinnage, Standen, Lee, Botten, Wickham, Jupp
SUFFOLK Titshall, Frost, Fairweather, Mayhew, Archer, Eade, Scarfe
DURHAM Stewart, Musgrave, Wilson, Forster
SCOTLAND Stewart in Selkirk
USA Musgrave, Saix
ESSEX Cornwell, Stock, Quilter, Lawrence, Whale, Clift
OXON Edgington, Smith, Inkpen, Snell, Batten, Brain

Offline salmon-run

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Re: Volume 1 -A1 of Philadelphia passenger lists 1883-1948??
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 25 June 14 16:50 BST (UK) »
Greetings! This is my 1st post to this site. Was this issue ever resolved? I have the same exact situation. Manifest reel 0019 contains v 1-1A-2-2A. but is for 1893 arrivals, NOT 1892. Also note that the 1A and 2A on the manifest volume are A1 and A2 on the Index Cards.
My interest is the May 5, 1892 arrival of the SS Illinois. The manifest for about 650 passengers on reel 0016 is a TRANSCRIBED version in alphabetical sequence. The index Cards have additional information that could have ONLY come from the original manifest records gathered directly from passengers. Reel 0016 does have 4 pages of the original manifest much later in the reel but is still short about 400 passengers (several of which I am interested in). The last page of this original manifest also contains a note that additional lists can be found in Book 1 and Book 2....no clue as whats these books are or their location.

Thank you,