Author Topic: Timothy Lucey 2 Marriages?  (Read 3469 times)

Offline ballydw

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Timothy Lucey 2 Marriages?
« on: Friday 20 June 14 22:21 BST (UK) »
1901 census Timothy Lucey 45, Wife Lizzie 33, Son Timothy 20 Son John T 18.
Shandangan West Cannaway Cork.
1911 Census. Timothy 58, Elizabeth 42, Nora 26, Dan 8, Michael 5, Patrick 4, Margaret 1.
Married 10 years 4 children.
I have marriage for Timothy in 1900 to Elizabeth McCarthy.
I cannot find his first marriage or births of children from this i.e Timothy, John T & Hanora
Any help appreciated, his 1st wife must have died sometime after Noras birth c 1885 & Timothys 2nd marriage in 1900 :)

Offline gaffy

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Re: Timothy Lucey 2 Marriages?
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 21 June 14 04:50 BST (UK) »
The best I can see with a bit of playing around with the RootsIreland website search index are County Cork baptisms for Timothy Lucey 1879, John Lucy 1882, and Honora Lucy 1884 to parents Timothy Lucey and Johanna McCarthy. 

Timothy's baptism took place in Kilnamartyra RC parish, those for John and Honora took place in Macroom RC parish.

The RootsIreland website search index also brings back a County Cork church marriage in 1878 for a Timothy Lucey and Johanna McCarthy, it took place in Aghinagh RC parish.

I think this is the civil record:

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FYQ1-BXQ
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FYQ1-YZK

This is the 'best fit' for a death that I can find, but it's just a guess:

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FTDY-X49

Offline ballydw

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Re: Timothy Lucey 2 Marriages?
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 21 June 14 08:48 BST (UK) »
Thank you Gaffy this information sounds good as it was speculated in family circles that Timothys 2nd wife was related to the first wife. I never seem to have any luck on familysearch & sporadic on roots.

Am also looking for possible baptism for Timothy Lucey senior as I am "hunting" for 2 sisters (went to USA) but dont have christian  names.

Appreciate your help  :) Frances


Offline gaffy

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Re: Timothy Lucey 2 Marriages?
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 21 June 14 11:26 BST (UK) »
The closest I could find, playing with the RootsIreland website search index, taking into account the different ages of Timothy in the 1901 and 1911 census, together with the stated County Cork birthplace, is a Timothy Lucey baptised in 1852 in Kilnamartyra RC parish to parents Timothy and Honora Lucey. That's as much as I can determine from the RootsIreland website search index, the record content is pay to view, it's an absolute gamble, there is nothing to say that this is your Timothy.

The RootsIreland website search index also brings back several baptisms of that time period (including Timothy in 1852) for parents Timothy Lucey and mother's first name "Honora", including Mary Lucy 1859 and Julia Lucy 1863, but this is really speculative / unreliable stuff just for noting until it can be ruled in or out...


Offline ballydw

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Re: Timothy Lucey 2 Marriages?
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 21 June 14 18:00 BST (UK) »
Thank you Gaffy gives me something to work with looks promising even if speculative. Regards Frances :)

Offline ballydw

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Re: Timothy Lucey 2 Marriages?
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 22 June 14 01:21 BST (UK) »
The closest I could find, playing with the RootsIreland website search index, taking into account the different ages of Timothy in the 1901 and 1911 census, together with the stated County Cork birthplace, is a Timothy Lucey baptised in 1852 in Kilnamartyra RC parish to parents Timothy and Honora Lucey. That's as much as I can determine from the RootsIreland website search index, the record content is pay to view, it's an absolute gamble, there is nothing to say that this is your Timothy.

The RootsIreland website search index also brings back several baptisms of that time period (including Timothy in 1852) for parents Timothy Lucey and mother's first name "Honora", including Mary Lucy 1859 and Julia Lucy 1863, but this is really speculative / unreliable stuff just for noting until it can be ruled in or out...

Hi Gaffy ref the Timothy b 1852 to Timothy & Honora and baptisms you found for Julia & Mary - I know it is speculative but I found a Honora Lucey a 82 in Ballingeary a farmers widow & daughter Julia is also in house with daughter in law & sister in law a kate lucey a widow. Can I be "cheeky" ;D and ask if you could check if there are any other baptisms to Timothy & Hanora other than the ones you gave. I do realise that the Lucey name is very common in Macroom but have done a search for Julia & Mary on passenger records to USA with no results looking positive.
I wish I could "get to grips" with the rootsireland site?? How were you able to arrive @ the mothers name for the baptisms? Thanks again Regards Frances :)PS Is there any marriage showing for Timothy & Hanora?

Offline gaffy

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Re: Timothy Lucey 2 Marriages?
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 22 June 14 03:23 BST (UK) »

... could check if there are any other baptisms to Timothy & Hanora other than the ones you gave ...


There are in that relevant timefame, but all boys (eg. Michael 1850, Jeremiah 1848, Daniel 1846, John 1844), and given how common the names are I suspect there are several Timothy Lucey / Honora parents on the go.

Offline gaffy

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Re: Timothy Lucey 2 Marriages?
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 22 June 14 03:57 BST (UK) »

... How were you able to arrive @ the mothers name for the baptisms? ... Is there any marriage showing for Timothy & Hanora?


It doesn't seem to be widely known but once you are reduced down to a single match on a baptism in the RootsIreland website search index, you can start to put in guesses in the mother's or father's first name, a letter at a time (it's like an inbuilt "starts with" function). 

So for example, in addressing your OP about finding Timothy's first marriage or births of children Timothy, John & Hanora, I first searched for children of approximately the right 'age' with a father called Timothy.  Then I reduced the options down to a single match (take son Timothy for example, once I had identified a suitable son Timothy in 1879, I narrowed down the date in the search to 1879 so that the search only brings back one match).  It is at that point you can start guessing the mother's first name, I usually start with the first letter of any suspicions I have, but if I don't have a clue, I just put in the letter "a" and see if I still get the single match, if not I put in the letter "b" and see if I still get the single match, and so on.  In the case of Timothy's baptism in 1879, the single match disappeared when I tried letters "a" though "i", then reappeared when I tried "j", so I knew her name started with "j".  Next letter had to be a vowel, "ja", "je", and "ji" caused the single match to disappear again, but "jo" brought it back again. By the time you get a few letters in, you can pretty well guess the name and try it to see if the single match still comes back. It sounds more complicated than it is, once you've done it several times it isn't. In baptism records it only works on first names, not surnames (surnames have to be 100% correct in full). However, in the example I've given, once I knew Timothy junior's mother was Johanna, I went searching for a marriage of Timothy the father to a Johanna, once I found the marriage to Johanna McCarthy, I was able to go back again to the Timothy junior baptism and put in the full mother's name Johanna McCarthy and the 1879 match for him came back, so that's how I knew.

BTW, the only church marriage I can see is a Timothy Lucy to Hanora Harrington in 1843 in Kilnamartyra RC parish.

Offline ballydw

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Re: Timothy Lucey 2 Marriages?
« Reply #8 on: Monday 23 June 14 10:04 BST (UK) »
Thanks again Gaffy for further info  :)