Author Topic: Illusive and Illegitimate COLLIER - YEWDALL  (Read 9839 times)

Offline avm228

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Re: Illusive and Illegitimate COLLIER - YEWDALL
« Reply #18 on: Tuesday 18 November 08 10:19 GMT (UK) »
It seems to me that, without Isabel's birth certificate, nothing any of us can find will be better than circumstantial evidence as to her likely parentage.  We don't even know for sure that Catharine was her natural mother. If Isabel was enumerated in the 1891 census then she is very well disguised!

I'm afraid it's my view that if you're looking for anything concrete then the birth certificate of Isabel Beatrix/Beatrice Yewdall needs to be obtained.

Anna
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline durhamlass

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Re: Illusive and Illegitimate COLLIER - YEWDALL
« Reply #19 on: Tuesday 18 November 08 16:51 GMT (UK) »
I agree with you Anna , looking at the information provided it would be like looking for a needle in a haystack !

I have researched many William Yewdall's and the one that is listed on LDS (baptism 1837 Otley )was born in 1831,he and his family emigrated to the USA 1850, before Catherine Hill was born.


Sorry Rupie but sometimes there is no other way round it but to order the certificate and then you have something positive to work with.

Offline Calverley Lad

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Re: Illusive and Illegitimate COLLIER - YEWDALL
« Reply #20 on: Tuesday 03 March 09 21:27 GMT (UK) »
I am still trying to locate my great grandmother's sister.

The child emigrated with her mother to Canada in the 1890's under the name Isabel Beatrix COLLIER and susbsequent Canadian records list her under that name.

Her mother was Catharine Hill COLLIER.

Catharine's husband John Monkman Peacock COLLIER died shortly after the 1881 census.

There were 3 children, Elizabeth, Ethel and George Edwin.  Elizabeth and Ethel are living with Collier grandparents in 1891.  George Edwin died before this, his death being registered in Dewsbury.

In June 1883, (2 years after her father's death), Isabel Beatrix was born.  Searches of BMD and IGI do not find her under the name Collier.

Catharine Hill and JMP Collier's marriage was registered in Wharfedale (married at Ilkley Parish Church).

In 1891, Catharine Collier (mistranscribed Catharine Collen) was living with the family of her sister Mary B Young (mistranscribed Mary B Fanny) and another sister Jane A Bettany (mistranscribed Jane A Bottay) in Lockwood.

Neither Isabel Beatrix nor Jane's son, Harold were with them.  Harold was found with a brother, Christopher Hill.

Harold's birth was registered Sep 1876 in Wharfedale.

So ....  I did a freebmd search of Jun and Sep 1883 in Wharfedale and found Isabel Beatrice YEWDALL.  I also searched all of England for the same time period and found only 3 other Isabel Beatrices, all down south.

Isabel is obviously NOT the daughter of John MP Collier.

Searches of freebmd and igi turn up no marriage of anyone named Yewdall to Catharine Collier or Catharine Hill.

Is there any way, short of ordering a birth certificate, to find the mother's maiden name of Isabel Beatrice Yewdall (reg Sep 1883, Wharfedale)?

Thanks to anyone in a position to do a lookup or for any helpful advice.
Cheers,
Rupie

Have you been able to get any further yet?
(I am still chasing William)
 Regards Brian
Yewdall/Yewdell/Youdall -Yorkshire

Offline rupiezucki

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Re: Illusive and Illegitimate COLLIER - YEWDALL
« Reply #21 on: Monday 16 March 09 02:44 GMT (UK) »
Hi Brian,

Still no further ahead.  I spent several wonderful hours recently at our provincial records office and found Isabel's marrage registration.  She gives her name as Isabel Beatrix Collier, daughter of John and Cathrine Collier.  We know this cannot be true, as John died in 1881, and she was born in 1883 (affirmed by her age on the marriage reg).  I also found another sister I had been trying to find in Yorkshire with no luck --- there she was in Canada also!

I recently saw John Collier's death certificate and he died of T.B., which he had had for 2 years.  I still cannot find Beatrix on the 1891 census under any name.  I have tried workhouses in the area - nada!

I suspect Beatrix must be Miss Yewdall.  I keep hoping to make contact with other family members, either the Joyce family that she married into, or the Robinson family who her sister Elizabeth married into, but no joy.

Someone told me that it was possible to see information on birth certs before one orders them, but it requires a physical visit to the office where the records are held.  It's a pity that a jpg copy cannot just be ordered online.  You used to able to do that here, but no more.

Eventually, I guess I will just break down and send them the money and take a chance .. I just keep hoping that the freebmd records will show me something good.  I know that they are still not complete as I still have some people whose marrriages list only one of the pair.

Ah well....

Have a nice day!
Rupie
Scales - Scarborough, Farmany, Ellerburne, Thornton, Pickering; Collier - Atwick, Lund; Lake - Norfolk; Ridley - Durham; Stokoe - Northumberland;
Monkman - Yorkshire; Peacock - Seamer; Umpleby; Cook; Hetherington - Northumberland; Whitwham - Sunderland, Ripon, Grantley; Robinson - Canada, Vancouver; Paton - Scotland, Auchtergaven


Offline avm228

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Re: Illusive and Illegitimate COLLIER - YEWDALL
« Reply #22 on: Monday 16 March 09 08:02 GMT (UK) »
I just keep hoping that the freebmd records will show me something good.  I know that they are still not complete as I still have some people whose marrriages list only one of the pair.


FreeBMD is complete (as to births) for the period 1870-1889.

There are still a few marriages missing in that period, but where there's a missing spouse of a pair it's now more likely that said spouse's index reference has been mistranscribed, so that they are there but their page number doesn't appear to match.

If it's true that one can inspect BMD records at local offices before ordering certificates, it's the first I've heard of it :)

Anna
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline JeannieR

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Re: Illusive and Illegitimate COLLIER - YEWDALL
« Reply #23 on: Thursday 19 March 09 16:12 GMT (UK) »
Hi There......

Forgive me for gate crashing this thread !

But is this your girl?

1891 census
108 Spring Road , Stone , Longton , Staffordshire

William D Carson / head / age 38 / Potters Placer / Born Shelton , Staffordshire
Louisa Carson / wife / age 33 / Masseuse Nurse / born Longton , Staffordshire
Cecelia A Emony / visitor / age 26 / born Longton , Staffordshire
ISABELLA B COLLIER / visitor / age 9 / born LEEDS, Yorkshire.

It could be that Isabella was a " nurse child " being looked after by Mrs Carson, or that Miss Emony , was her governess/nurse........

Just a thought.

You are ccorrect Rupie.....researching in BC is wonderful .

Hope this helps

JeannieR
This information is Crown Copyright, from www.national archives.gov.uk

Offline avm228

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Re: Illusive and Illegitimate COLLIER - YEWDALL
« Reply #24 on: Thursday 19 March 09 16:48 GMT (UK) »
Hi There......

Forgive me for gate crashing this thread !

But is this your girl?

1891 census
108 Spring Road , Stone , Longton , Staffordshire

William D Carson / head / age 38 / Potters Placer / Born Shelton , Staffordshire
Louisa Carson / wife / age 33 / Masseuse Nurse / born Longton , Staffordshire
Cecelia A Emony / visitor / age 26 / born Longton , Staffordshire
ISABELLA B COLLIER / visitor / age 9 / born LEEDS, Yorkshire.

It could be that Isabella was a " nurse child " being looked after by Mrs Carson, or that Miss Emony , was her governess/nurse........

Just a thought.

You are ccorrect Rupie.....researching in BC is wonderful .

Hope this helps

JeannieR

That's a brilliant find, JeannieR! (So that others can easily find it, the reference is RG12/2145/100/18).

I actually read "Isabella"'s age as 7, though somewhat diffidently as it's very unclear.

Anna :)
Ayr: Barnes, Wylie
Caithness: MacGregor
Essex: Eldred (Pebmarsh)
Gloucs: Timbrell (Winchcomb)
Hants: Stares (Wickham)
Lincs: Maw, Jackson (Epworth, Belton)
London: Pierce
Suffolk: Markham (Framlingham)
Surrey: Gosling (Richmond)
Wilts: Matthews, Tarrant (Calne, Preshute)
Worcs: Milward (Redditch)
Yorks: Beaumont, Crook, Moore, Styring (Huddersfield); Middleton (Church Fenton); Exley, Gelder (High Hoyland); Barnes, Birchinall (Sheffield); Kenyon, Wood (Cumberworth/Denby Dale)

Offline rupiezucki

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Re: Illusive and Illegitimate COLLIER - YEWDALL
« Reply #25 on: Monday 04 May 09 17:53 BST (UK) »
I think it is entirely possible that this is my girl. 

Thank you.

It is amazing that she is listed in ancestry as being age 21 - looking at the sheet, I wonder how anyone transcribed this as 21.

Since I now know that the freebmd for this time period is complete (Thanks also to Anna), she is probably also the Yewdall girl.

Now, I will try and find a connection to the Carson or Emony family.

Thanks again!
Rupie
Scales - Scarborough, Farmany, Ellerburne, Thornton, Pickering; Collier - Atwick, Lund; Lake - Norfolk; Ridley - Durham; Stokoe - Northumberland;
Monkman - Yorkshire; Peacock - Seamer; Umpleby; Cook; Hetherington - Northumberland; Whitwham - Sunderland, Ripon, Grantley; Robinson - Canada, Vancouver; Paton - Scotland, Auchtergaven

Offline Calverley Lad

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Re: Illusive and Illegitimate COLLIER - YEWDALL
« Reply #26 on: Tuesday 22 June 10 19:55 BST (UK) »
Update
Quote {William Yewdall b abt 1837 Eccleshill.  He was widowed in 1875, and in 1881 was living at 4 Clifton View, Otley described as a retired cloth manufacturer.}
 (Was declared bankrupt and business sold off to pay debts!)
William snr also had a son called William (aged 16 in 1881 census)
The younger William subsequently married in Wellington Newzealand in 1900 to a Louisa Carey.
 Brian
Yewdall/Yewdell/Youdall -Yorkshire