family in glasgow

[MonicaL]

Doddsie, the year of Bridget's death was 1908 from what you have seen? Her daughter Margaret's death from cancer in 1902 in Maryhill shows both her parens as deceased by then. A Joseph Caroll reported the death.

The tree on a/try includes a number of original SP images which always gives more confidence.

Monica

[MOFFAT]

Thanks all, I don't think the Maryhill family are one and the same as the King Str Carroll's as Patrick's mother was a McGarvil according to his marriage cert. in 1884. An aunt was married to a 'bookie' and from I have been told may have stayed in Ballater Str. Her married name was Annie Kellen or Killen. I don't know if she had family or not but she was a regular visitor to our family in Lochee ( an area well known as Tipperary because of the number of Irish who stayed there and worked in the biggest jute factory in the world known as Cox's Mill) in Dundee. Another clue perhaps

[jonn]

Hello Moffat,

What was Helen Holmes, fathers first name was it perhaps William, on the 1884 marriage do you have address,s, for both Patrick, and Helen, also what was Patricks, fathers first name. all these questions are relevant in helping in finding the correct people.

You also in a earlier post refered to Helen Holmes, having your grandfather several years before the 1884. marriage what was his first name.

Regards,
Jonn.

[MonicaL]

Moffat, the family GR2 mentioned from 1881 very much seems to fit the family you have in 1891 (a few years either side, or a little more sometimes, with some of the birth years is not unusual):

I wonder if this is the family in 1881?

84 Bardowie Street, Maryhill:

Peter Carroll, 50, general labourer
Bridget, wife, 48
Children:
Margaret, 24, cotton factory worker
John, 22, general labourer
Bridget, 20, factory worker
Mary 18, factory worker
Annie, 16, factory worker
Peter, 14, iron foundry boy
Thomas,11

All but Thomas are born in Ireland.

And then the family you have mentioned from 1891 - everyone born in Ireland apart from youngest Thomas:

Bridget Carroll 60
Bridget Canell 32
Mary Canell 28
Annie Canell 26
Peter Canell 24
Thomas Canell 20

Address: 8 Balmore St, Maryhill

Seems like the same Carroll family really...except for the issue on mother's maiden name of McBride v. McGarvil. Again, you would need to check other sources to verify more info, but at this stage I would be optimistic you are likely looking at the same family. You need to check more sources and info to make your self more confident of that though...

Monica

[jonn]

Here is a possible for Helen Holms, 1881. census.

Address 81 Trongate, Glasgow.

William Holms, Head, General Dealer, M. age 45 years, M. born Glasgow, Lanark,
Mary Holms, Wife, General Dealer, M. age 46 years, F. born Glasgow, Lanark,
Helen Holms, Daur, General Dealer, U. age 18 years, F. born Glasgow, Lanark,
Mary Ann Holms, Daur, Scholar, U. age 13 years, F. born Glasgow, Lanark,
Patrick Holms, GD Son, age 1 year, M. born Glasgow, Lanark.

Here is a census index 1891. Blackfriars, Glasgow,

Patrick Carrol, age 32 years,
Ellen Carrol, age 28 years,
Patrick Carrol, age 12 years,
William Carrol, age 9 years,
James Carrol, age 7 years,
Michael Carrol, age 3 years,
Ellen Carrol, age 1 year.

If this 1891 entry is the Patrick Carrol, and Ellen Holms/Holmes. It goes well with the birth or births pre the 1884 marriage, also the Patrick Carrol, aged 12 years may well be the Patrick Holms, aged 1 years as grandson on the 1881. census above.

Regards,
Jonn.

[MOFFAT]

jonn carroll family from trongate i think is my grandfather's as he was aged 20 when he moved to dundee around 1899 1900 re holms/holmes family helen's father was named edward  and mother mary. my grandfathers place of birth on the certificate is 30 princes str. his father is registered as atobacco spinner

[jonn]

Hello Moffat,

The 1881 census 20 Main Street, Glasgow.

Bridget Carrol, Head Labourers Widow, Age 53 years, F. born Ireland,
James Carrol, Son, Formerly, Tobacco Spinner, age 30 years, born Glasgow,
Patrick Carrol, Son, General Labourer, U. age 19 years, born Glasgow,
Owen Carrol, Son, General Labourer, U. age 16 years, born Glasgow,

Regards
Jonn.

[MonicaL]

Jonn, they are much better entries for the Carrolls for sure   Struggle to find any post 1855 births for the Carroll boys though, wondering if in fact they came to Scotland after son Owen's birth c. 1865?

A few Carroll families in the Glasgow area with similar first names which adds to the confusion.

Monica

[MOFFAT]

Hi Monica, thanks for the help. Tony (james) Carroll who played for Belfast Celtic and who was probably my grandfathers nephew is there anything on him and his family relevant to the present day which might give a clue to the family's origins in Ireland, I would assume his father was James born in 1884 and according to the records baptised in St Andrews Clyde St.